one question how come you are still able to take on athletes at this time of the year ? should you not have a waiting list ;-)

I can't give that much advice since I've never had a coach before but I have been 'reaching out' to a lot of coaches right now for the same reason as you. My biggest problem is the lack of communication. None of the coaches I've spoken with care about talking to you; they just want your money and to give you a Trainingpeaks.com plan (and yes, I'm reaching out to coaches that will keep the communication process open; I'm not just looking for a plan... and I'm also not reaching out to coaches that train professionals; they're too busy for amateurs anyway). And what is this crap about 1 phone call or email a month when I'm paying you $150/month. Seriously, do you think your time is that valuable? It's not. You're basically a personal trainer. Do you know how much most personal trainers cost? Less than $100/hour. I'm glad you somehow believe that you are so wise, that you can charge that much money. Life is going to suck when the Tri business starts to bottom out like golf did.

I think the triathlon community is flooded with self-taught coaches who are out to make money that will give them the luxury of training all day; they don't actually care about their students (other than the students that will give them a name to charge more money down the road). Yes, I'm very bitter at this point but, honestly, these people are giving the sport a horrible name.

Now, I'm sure 100+ coaches are going to respond and tell me that they care about their students. That's great. Maybe you do. But so far, I haven't met you and I've spoken with dozens of coaches.

Also, I'm sorry to jack your questions... I just know that hundreds of coaches are going to read this and it needed to be said.

Cheers!

As a coach...I have to work out with my clients and make that personal bond so that I truely understand and also see what the athlete is doing....that being said I have never been a fan of have someone on the other end of a computer telling me what I should be doing when they do not understand who I am.......so, I would say the best bet is someone local that is well rounded and can also seperate friendship from business because you obviously want your best bang for the buck and results! Thats my thoughts......I am sure you will get alot of those very soon, good luck and you are more than welcome to touch base with me if you have questions.

Race wise, Race hard!

If they can't give you at least 4 former client references that are willing to share their experience with you it's a red flag in my book.

Every coach who's done an IM themselves is not a good coach for sure. It's more important that they have coached several folks to a successful IM than having been successful themselves. Their personal success would be gravy, not a determining factor in my hiring them.

See if they have stats on atheltes under contrat that shows improvement in their times under their toolage.

Can they show you a sample ATP (Annual Training Plan) for a current athlete and explain why it is designed the way it is? Answer should be along the lines that it is a flexible templete to show your planned progression for the athlete, based upon their personal goals, strengths, limiters and time to train. They should stress it's not set in stone and needs to be regularly evaluated and often changed to meet current athlete status. If they give you some mindless parrot speach about periodization based on sound science that will be used to structure the entire year without changing, you should look elsewhere.

You are a snowflake, there is no other athlete like you in the universe. If your coach does not coach to your specific set of needs and abilities, but rather churns out plans with little thought to their specific applicibility to your uniquie needs, then you just wasted a ton of $$.

While certifications are a good point of reference, they should not be the end all to an athlete. It shows a personal commitment by the coach to learn more, but it does not necessarily mean they are at the top of the game or meet the standard most would associate with a credentialed professional. As many posts on this board will attest, its not all that hard to become a level 1 USAT coach.

How much technology do you plan to utilize? If you want coaching with power, you will be paying more for the data analysis and testing that comes with it. If you expect every garmin upload you do to be given the time of day and anaylized, know that its going to come with a price too. A good coach will have a scaled pricing system tailored to how much interaction you want/need and how much feedback they will provide. Watch out for the cost of services not included in any packages being offered, some folks think they are worth $100/hr to coach an athlete at a local high school track in the evening and that's a value added service they do not include in package deals.


Good luck in your quest. I hope you find a good match.

Regards,

Dave
USAT L2 / USAC L2 / Dave Scott (Tier 2) TNT Certified Coach

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Dave Stark
dreamcatcher@astound.net
USAC & USAT level 2 certified coach

I didn't think of asking about their previous athlete's performances/improvements, thanks for the tip. And per a previous post, communication is another good point. Thanks for the tips!

Another red flag are coaches that do not sign their full name to a thread or have contact info when you click on their ST profile (just kidding, kind of). If a coach doesn't know how to market his services, chances are he won't be in business long. Honestly, coaches, if you want to connect with athletes be accessible as possible. It's not a bad thing if it's easy for athletes to know who you are and how to connect with you. Seriously! Business 101.

Here's something I wrote on this a long time ago: http://www.d3multisport.com/...ts-of-hiring-a-coach
PS - there's a solid list of coaches to check out at the bottom of my article. You won't find these guys on ST; they are out coaching their athletes. ;-)

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Mike Ricci
2017 USAT World Team Coach
USAT National Coach of the Year
Coaching Triathletes since 1992.

Read these threads first:

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=3799436

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=3438047

Here is a thread with more links, maybe including the ones above:

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/gforum.cgi?post=3848442

And/or you can search "looking for a coach" and variations of that to find other relevant threads.

Then use the search function on ST to research coaches on ST by searching then reading what they write about training topics you are interested in.

I don't think it's unreasonable for a coach to ask you to describe the research you've done that has gotten you to the point where you are. It's a 2 way interview, especially since many coaches have more demand for their services then they can provide.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I recently was looking for a coach but at the last minute decided against it. The coach I was looking at was from a very reputable company/credentials but after thinking about it I was just paying for them to set up a training program based on past experiences/performance with no real focus on goals?

I think if you have the money and time and are interested in hiring a coach you need to pay for them to actually interact with you and watch you train/race and not just set up a training program IMHO. Just buying a training program IMHO does nothing; you can gather most of that information on line.

I would have to say that Slowtwich is my coach.....

X2

Hrm. Let's take a look at that.

Say your average personal trainer costs $50/hour. Highly unlikely you're only seeing that trainer 3x month. More likely you are seeing a trainer 2-4x/week, which would bring your monthly nut to somewhere in the range of $600-800. If your coach is worth anything, they are putting way more than 3 hours per month into your training plans. They are creating the plans, assessing feedback that they get from you, race results, adjusting workouts based on life/improvements/racing, etc.

Now I'll grant you 1 email/month might be a bit draconian, but you have some clients that will email 5x a day if there is no restriction.

If you look at what the coach is actually making per hour, $150 for a month is pretty damned inexpensive.



For a coach to make $40,000 per year, at $150/month they would need 267 athletes. Given the average work week is 40 hours, that means the coach has about 35 minutes per athlete, per month. If it's "flooded", there are a lot of coaches working their ass off to make basically a moderate living. (That's only a $20/hour pay scale.)

Simple math, but most people never bother to do it.

John

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Top notch coaching: Francois and Accelerate3 | Follow on Twitter: LifetimeAthlete |

I'm sorry but I just don't agree with you. That $150/month rate is basically a plan and 1 call a month. He's not adjusting your program or assessing your race results. I'd rather not call people out by name but I gladly will if you want to call my bluff.

If you want to do the research, they are all based in LA. A couple others are people I've found on st and don't live anywhere near here

I'm not saying they aren't doing that, but not all coaches do. I get much more than that, and my cost is in that ballpark. You just have to find the right coach. Obviously, they aren't it. :D

John

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Top notch coaching: Francois and Accelerate3 | Follow on Twitter: LifetimeAthlete |

Your math is way off --- $150 (month) x 12 (months) x 267 (athletes) = $480,600 per year.

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_______________________________________________

You never have the wind with you - either it is against you or you're having a good day. ~Daniel Behrman

Hrm...Is that math correct?

$40,000/year=[months/year]*[$/month/athlete]*[athletes]
athletes=40,000/(12*150)
athletes=22.2

Now, $40,000/year is a very low salary for someone with a MS or PhD, especially considering that they wouldn't have health insurance. I'd say $100,000/year minimum is a fair income, considering that they have to maintain a website, and fund their own benefits.

100,000/1,800=55.5 athletes

Assuming that the person works 40 hours a week, and let's say that you expect him to stay current ex phys research, training strategies, etc.

So 120 hours/month coaching time means you should expect about 2:10 of coaching time per month if you're paying a good coach $150/month.

Your math is way off --- $150 (month) x 12 (months) x 267 (athletes) = $480,600 per year.[/quote]
Awww...crap. Forgot to multiply by 12.

Simple math, and some people screw it up. :p

John

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Top notch coaching: Francois and Accelerate3 | Follow on Twitter: LifetimeAthlete |

Hahahahahahahah live the comment about having a phd. Also, 40 hours a week. Man up and call that a part time job like it is.

wrong, that gives $40,000 per month.

Good suggestions around the board here.

Also, using a race car analogy, be sure that you think about your engine too. You don't just want a coach who tells you how fast and how far to drive, but also how to care for your engine and ensure longevity along with performance.

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Ben Greenfield

Nutrition & Human Performance Advice
http://www.bengreenfieldfitness.com

Well, your 267 number has relevance, since at $150/month hypothetical coach would need 267 monthly commitments to reach a $40k salary (this could simply be 22 full year commitments). However, since many coaches don't require a 12 month commitment, the number of athletes coached over 12 months may end of being much higher than 22.

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_______________________________________________

You never have the wind with you - either it is against you or you're having a good day. ~Daniel Behrman

Wish I had a part time job that made me 40k a year.

John

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Top notch coaching: Francois and Accelerate3 | Follow on Twitter: LifetimeAthlete |

As a coach who specializes at helping first time IM athletes on their quest, I think the match needs to be a two way street. The more realistic and truthful you are with the prospective coach and with yourself, the greater the likelihood that you will find a successful partnership.

So be prepared (and expect the coach to ask):
- why have you chosen to tackle the distance you're hiring me to help you achieve?
-what is your worst case scenario outcome for this race?
-if this year fails (injury, etc.) are you mentally prepared to delay?
-what motivates you personally?

I have had a few athletes (very few fortunately) that have not been really honest with themselves about either their commitment or their realistic goals...and inevitably these are the hardest athletes to keep on track from a coaching perspective.

Finally, have a basic conversation with the prospective coach the phone....can you talk to the person and get a feeling that you could carry on this same conversation at a dinner party without wanting to excuse yourself and walk away?? You need to be comfortable communicating with this person and not feeling inhibited in doing so...

All the Best in your search,
Paul Schon
USAT Level 1 Coach, IronBrick Training

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So do I.

interesting and relevant:

Salary outlays for exercise physiologists. This assumes minimum of MS OR bachelor's + 2-4 years work experience. MEDIAN total benefit is over $65,000/year

http://swz.salary.com/...isshowaboutyou=false

If you go into 26% percent tile ('good') you're talking $5,000/year more, and for very good (11th percent tile) you're talking an additional $5,000/year.

Hours worked/week would be very nice to know as well.

Atleast as far as coaches on slowtwitch go.....When I was looking for a coach I PM'd several of them on this forum. Just asked a run of the mill/general training type question. You can tell alot about them in the way they answer your questions. (If they answer), go from there.