Check Topica, I believe that there is a forum for the iBike with lots of info

Here's a link to a "real life" study (not scientists), the rest of the home website is pretty funny as well....

http://www.nyvelocity.com/content.php?id=889

HWM

www.slopesports.com

Mary,

Getting a power meter for Curt? Now that he has starting using a heart rate monitor is going to jump in the deep end and be Mr. analysis?

Seriously though. When I first heard about the Ibike I thought there is no way the ibike could be that useful. But at Interbike this year was talking with Hunter Allen an he said there is a value to the product.

I have used the ibike for quite a few rides in conjunction with an SRM-DA. Overall for a $400 unit it does a much better job than I thought it would. Here is a link I posted on the topic list comparing ride data of the ibike vs SRM.

www.endurancefactor.com/srm_ibike.htm

For steady state solo intervals the ibike is quite consistent with the SRM.

The downside is that power value are not accurate in group rides or on really rough roads.

The other issue is mounting on a tri bike. Road bikes are no problem but because the unit measures wind pressure you need to keep the front unobstructed. Aerobars cause havoc to the readings. I hear they are working on a new mounting solution.

Also power values are only valid the position you calibrate in. Meaning if you calibrate when on the hoods riding in the drops will not be accurate.

If they get the mounting issue solved for tri bikes the ibike can be good entry level solution for those wanting to start using wattage.

So then,



in your opinion, when using wattage for training, is the computrainer still the most effective thing? Is a powermeter of any kind really worth it for racing then? I understand it is always more data..... but when it comes to race day, if ytou train off a ct, can you pace off a bike computer with just speed and HR?



:-) Mary!

IMHO if you only had the cash for either a computrainer or a power meter, I would go with a power meter. The reason being is that you can use the power meter on a regular trainer inside as well as outside during training and racing. Both a computrainer and power meter can be used for ride analysis during training, but a power meter is an invaluable tool for race day pacing, especially during longer events.


Using both data from training rides and LT testing we would establish a power value to base pacing from. Depending on the athlete I recommend pacing at a wattage of 65% to 79% of LT power or .69 to .78 of normalized LT power. Less experience athletes at the lower end of the scale and more aggressive, experienced towards the higher values.

Don't get me wrong, the Computrainer is a great tool with spin scan and the ability to ride different courses.

Heart rate still is very effective for pacing but speed not so much so. Speed is influenced so much by terrain and conditions that is tough to really gauge yourself at any given time.

My order of preference for pacing.

Wattage - with an eye on HR.
Heart rate only
Perceived exertion
Speed - Can be very problematic

Keep in mind that all have some value, but believe it or not after you get used to wattage it can simplify things and take some of the guess work out of pacing.

From my understanding though, the iBike product would be of no value on a trainer as it's sensors (wind, inertia) would read zero and it would not be able to calculate power.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

You are correct, the IBike is non-functional on a trainer.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

I have one and consider it a sound investment.
I could have bought a new bike for the cost of an SRM, and I could have bought a CompuTrainer and an IBike for the cost of a Power Tap or Ergomo. In the case of Ergomo or SRM, it's one bike only. The IBike can go on two bikes for the cost of a second mounting bracket and wiring harnes (about $75). The Power tap requires a spoked wheel, so I couldn't use it for races (with a disc wheel)
Incidentally, my Cat Eye 3dx just bought the farm, so the cost (to me) for the IBike was less because I'd have had to buy a new computer in any event.
The IBike is surprisingly accurate. I don't have another power meter to be able to do a side-by-side comparison of the data from two sources for the same ride, but I would be willing to bet that the more expensive units are more accurate. However, the data I get from the IBike is consistent with what I've gotten using a CompuTrainer. The reason I have a power meter on my bike is to learn how to climb better and learn how to NOT blow up during tris. For these purposes, the IBike has already redeemed itself. It has demonstrated to me that I can produce sufficient wattage while remaining seated on climbs, and that standing on climbs is what blows me up. I've learned that I can hold 300 watts for three minutes on a flat road but not while climbing. So I have work to do!
The other thing the IBike has done for me so far is that my workouts are better because I'm constantly looking at the wattage number and thinking that if I expect to win any races next season I'll need to generate more watts consistently. The consequence of this and having a number to look at is that I'm constantly reminded to keep the power up and also reminded not to push too hard (which I normally do and then suffer and lose speed later in the ride).
For $400, it's an awesome training tool.
As for the mounting, Topeak makes a bracket that works well, so that the IBike sits below and between the aero bars where it can get "clean" air. I don't think you can use it on the integrated aero bars such as HED, Profile Carbon X, etc., because you need a round tube to attach the bracked. However, there should be a way to adapt the bracket to work off the aero bars themselves, except that as it is now, it won't work because the IBike ends up pointing east and west.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

Cousin, do you have any pics of your setup?

Will do so, perhaps on Monday. I just received one of the new mounts that picks up cadence and so I unmounted the old one. Turns out they forgot to put the helicoils in the new one, so I had to send it back. I should get it back ready for mounting on Saturday or Monday - or at least I'm hoping so.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

Looking forward to seeing it...thanks.

Dennis, you gotta be kidding.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

"Dennis, you gotta be kidding."
- - I wouldn't kid you about a thing like that. Of course you realize that perceived exertion is only a WAG, and comparing a stationary experiece to an actual ride is pretty far-fetched as well. But I've done gut busters on the CT that showed very similar average power numbers to what I got on Mt Diablo with the IBike.
The main thing, AFIK is that it gives me data that appears to be consistent from ride to ride and is therefore adequate for my purposes.
I'd be interested to see what the charts look like if someone attaches an IBike to a bike that already has a PT or an SRM, but that won't change my outlook, because I can't afford either of those.
Power readings on the road fluctuate pretty wildly compared to CT sessions, so the precision of an SRM seems like a luxury I wouldn't spring for even if I had a couple of Gs laying around.
After reading about the IBike, and especially Hunter Allen's comments, I decided it was worth $400 even if it isn't laboratory precise.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

Can you maybe correlate it to your HR on the CT and see at the same HR on the road, how close the watt readings are? I know HR depends on other variables and the so called "scientist" out there will scream and have a fit, but it would be interesting to note any differences.

"Can you maybe correlate it to your HR on the CT and see at the same HR on the road, how close the watt readings are? I know HR depends on other variables and the so called "scientist" out there will scream and have a fit, but it would be interesting to note any differences."
- - That's really tough to do, because as good as the CT is, you don't feel the same climbing a real hill as you do simulating one on the CT. The biggest difference is in how it feels to ride downhill on the CT.
I don't own a CT, but have one available for occasional use. I've done TTs on the CT that correlate well to my race performances (using published data that relate wattage to race performance) and I find similar correlation to the IBike. One HUGE difference is that the wattage graph on the CT was incredibly smooth compared to the IBike, which I would say is at least 99% due to actually being on the road v. sitting on a trainer. However, when all is said and done the peaks and valleys average out to show pretty much what I would have expected.
The peaks on the IBike are pretty wild. I hit a small but very steep hill last Saturday and cranked out 1500+ watts (according to the IBike). Based on how my legs felt as I crested the hill, I wouldn't doubt that number. I sustained that power level for nearly six seconds (CP.1?)

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

An SRM can easily be switched from bike to bike.

Unfortunately, he's probably not.

Sounds like you need to learn the difference between "training by power" and "training with a powermeter".

Easily?????????

And still 6X the cost of the IBike. While you're taking cheapshots from the hillside, would you like to offer some constructive comments as to YOUR esteemed opinion of the IBike, or is that too much to ask?

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

"Sounds like you need to learn the difference between 'training by power' and 'training with a powermeter'. "

Gee, thanks for that drive by... Could you perchance be any less specific?

When I sit on a CT, the power curve is extremely consistent compared to the IBike, because climbing on the CT usually entails a soft blend as the hill supposedly gets steeper. When actually riding an actual hill, there are no algorithms to blend the curves. Also, I rarely "jump" on the CT, because it feels odd to do so. When I hit a challenging bit of climb, like a switchback, it just feels right to get up. I'm finding out that it isn't nearly as helpful as I thought.

Thanks for your "help."

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

Sure: just grab your ratchet wrench with the 6 mm Allen socket, unscrew the crank bolt against the self-extractor, move the crank to other bike, tighten it up, reset the zero offset, and off you go. Takes me about 1 min.


I don't have any direct experience with the iBike.

I thought that my comment was sufficient since numerous resources exist to inform people re. power-based training and since the distinction is fairly well-known. To be more specific, however: the reason that you should care about the precision of power measurements is NOT because you want to use the data to tightly regulate your effort when training. The latter is "training by power", and not only misses the point of owning a powermeter, may actually be counterproductive (esp. for a racing cyclist, but even for a triathlete).

Elwood,
Thanks anyway. I'm thinking of getting I-Bike in the new year anyway. I will check it against my trainer wattage and HR. I might also have the possibility of running it side by side with a SRM. Once I have that data, I'll post it here for others interested in IBIKE. I also think for under $400, that's a pretty good deal and since I'm not a pro and my riding is not under clinical lab conditions, I'm only looking for trends in my training AND as a new toy to play with. I can afford $400 for that kind of info, but not willing to pay $1500 or more.

"I can afford $400 for that kind of info, but not willing to pay $1500 or more."
- - Precisely my point, and I don't think we're alone in that regard. My feeling is that as I learn to use the device, it will be very nearly as useful to me as the more expensive gear. And while an elitist prick like Coggan may look down his nose at me, I'm just trying to do the best I can with the limited time and resources available.
My goal this year (assuming my knee rehab continues to go well) is to move into the top three in my AG in Northern CA. I'm pretty sure that my two newest toys, the IBike and Power Cranks will get me there. I don't really see any reason to believe that the extra 2500 for an SRM would improve things. If I should find myself sitting on those kind of discretionary funds, I'll get my own CT instead.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...