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training for sprint triathlons at 50
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I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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SpeedNeeder wrote:
I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.

pussy

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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SpeedNeeder wrote:
I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.
SpeedNeeder. Welcome to the forum. Dan, above, was trying to be funny. He runs the forum and is >60, but maybe it's kinda >60 going on 15.

Your question is pretty darn broad. If you're looking for training info in the context of being old and decrepit, Joe Friel has a book on "Training after 50", or something like that. Lots of good info in that book. I made the mistake of getting the book on audiotape. Can't use a highlighter on audiotape.

If you're just looking for info re. training, then you're gonna have to ask specific questions. My suggestion would be to join a local triathlon club and ask lots of questions. Those questions that don't get answered satisfactorily, take to Google and do some searching here. If you still can't find answers, start a thread here and ask.

There are other old guys here. I'm 55.There's also lots of folks here that are national class amateurs or better. Incredible amounts of knowledge here. But there's also kind of an expectation that you'll search for answers before asking new questions. Most questions have already been asked and answered many times.

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"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [RangerGress] [ In reply to ]
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RangerGress wrote:
SpeedNeeder wrote:
I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.

SpeedNeeder. Welcome to the forum. Dan, above, was trying to be funny. He runs the forum and is >60, but maybe it's kinda >60 going on 15.
plus, i also only do sprints! so, speedneeder, when you figure it out, tell me! meanwhile, whatever i come across, for what it's worth, i'll share it right back.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [RangerGress] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks Ranger.
There's lotsa articles and plans out there for IM training at age 50, but I'm not finding anything specific to sprint tri training.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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SpeedNeeder wrote:
Thanks Ranger.
There's lots a articles and plans out there for IM training at age 50, but I'm not finding anything specific to sprint tri training.

Hmm. Well, the folks that are serious tend to do longer distances, so the stuff out there re. training for a sprint is probably aimed at novices.

Everyone has strengths and weaknesses. If you've not much background in any of the 3 sports, then start reading up on cycling and running. You can't learn how to swim out of a book. I know, I spent 20yrs trying. So for that you'll have to either hook up with a group that knows what they're doing, a coach, or try to learn thru videos. I did the latter, using Total Immersion and SwimSmooth. Swimming is like ballet. It can take years to just learn how to do it. Learn how to swim. It took me 20yrs to realize that I didn't really know how to swim. Only after your form is pretty good should you concentrate on (swim) fitness.

Obviously tho there are triathlon unique aspects of this. If you transition times are slow relative to your competition, work on them. Also, you'll need to do some ride-run workouts so your body can get used to running immed after a hard ride.

Triathlon types tend to overtrain. At your age, your ability to recover is not what it once was. If you're legs don't feel "fresh" then give them a break. Figure out how much you can do and legitimately call it a "recovery" workout. When it doubt, recover a bit more.

Do what you can to eat well. When you're training hard, I'd take multivitamins and protein to help your body recover.

Books @ Amazon
"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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TrainerRoad has sprint plans. Most of their plans also include run and swim workouts alongside the bike workouts. I have not looked in the Sprint plans, though.

What is your goal (finish & feel good, podium or win AG, finish top xx overall)? What is your current ability? I routinely podium sprints in the same AG as you, but I train about 10-12 hours/week for HIM. I am not sure I could win AG if I trained any less.

I have only done four sprints so far, and in my humble opinion, it is all about the bike technology, transitions, and the run.
  • Swimming speed, regardless of distance, is pretty much determined by volume of swimming. And, the top swimmers rarely win sprints on their swims alone. So, you really only need to be in the upper end of the next tier of swimmers (the faster regular people).
  • The bike is largely determined by absolute power and the technology you bought. So, just put in the time to increase power.
  • Bike technology is a huge factor too. Buy tech (good TT bike with fit, aero helmet, aero tri suit, wheels) to increase speed which will cut your time by 2 - 4 minutes. Top AG finishers have all the bike tech.
  • T1 can give you 15 to 30 seconds if you merely hustle, ride sockless, and rubber band your shoes on your bike.
  • T2 can give you 30 to 45 seconds if you get quick lace shoes and run sockless.
  • Run: This is the money. Top >50 AG finishers are rarely running slower than an 8:00/mile pace. You need to be sub 7:30 to play. Put in the time with speed work, coupled with bike endurance, and you will earn time in the run that will protect a weaker bike or swim.

Last edited by: exxxviii: Aug 29, 17 6:31
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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I'm a little younger and do mainly sprints.

Run 4-6 days a week. 3 to 4 miles
Bike 4-6 days a week. 20 +/- miles
Swim when you can.

Works for me.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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I agree. Everything I can find on sprints is for beginners.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [B.McMaster] [ In reply to ]
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The book is called "Fast after 50". No problem doing just sprints. Usian Bolt, the best known runner in the world, runs 100 meters in an event that takes him less than 10 seconds. Most people couldn't name this year's Ironman champion, over even know where that race takes place. Yet I would imagine Bolt probably trains harder than anyone on this forum. In triathlon, distance is the golden ring of achievement, it's an opposite mentality and is all about full ironman and Kona. Even 70.3 doesn't get that much respect. As my 13 yr old son says "It's only HALF Dad!" But a sprint is as tough as you want to make it - and you're no pussy, esp if you're hammering it. :)

"The first virtue in a soldier is endurance of fatigue; courage is only the second virtue."
- Napoleon Bonaparte
Last edited by: Don_W: Aug 29, 17 4:28
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
SpeedNeeder wrote:
I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.


pussy

Man I love this place.

I cut and paste a 5k/10k training plan (I just google this) into my other bike/swim plans. I use an intermediate 5k plan if I'm focused on other stuff, and an advanced 8k plan (if I can find one) if I am focusing on running.

__________
"At the end he was staggering into parked cars and accusing his support-van driver of trying to poison him." A description of John Dunbar in the 1st Hawaii Iron Man
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [apmoss] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you everyone for your thoughtful input!
I have much respect for those that 'move up' to IM, but honestly that just doesn't interest me. I'm not even 'serious' enough to do a full marathon, much less do one after a 112 mile bike. And no, I don't want to ride my bike for 112 straight either!

To answer some questions - my goal is only to get faster, to see how hard I can push myself in training and in racing. I do follow with some interest how I compare to others. I know I finished 2nd out of 14 in my AG last race, but honestly I'm mostly competing with myself.

I know sprints don't get respect from most tri people, and I'm totally fine with that. The different distances are all good, but challenges in different ways, especially if you are really pushing yourself.

Relevant background: Compared to other 'non-serious' athletes, I would say I'm a little above average on the bike, average on the run, and below average on the swim. I have been in masters swim class on and off. I find that my family starts to get grumpy when I train over 8 hours per week, but on heavy weeks I can train 10-12 hours. I've chosen to back off training this last year, keeping up with cycling, but mostly neglecting the rest. I am now in a position where I want to dedicate more time to training.

So, I'm just looking for tips or strategies on how to maximize training for sprints. The training should be notably different than IM training, no? I'll look into the sprint plans mentioned. I'm also looking into an app (tritrainer) that at least lets you choose between beginner/advance/intermediate in different distances.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [apmoss] [ In reply to ]
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apmoss wrote:
I cut and paste a 5k/10k training plan (I just google this) into my other bike/swim plans. I use an intermediate 5k plan if I'm focused on other stuff, and an advanced 8k plan (if I can find one) if I am focusing on running.

This sounds like a good idea! I usually try not to run and bike the same day, but maybe that's something I can look at changing. (because I'm sure any 5k running plan will have me running 5/6 days per week).
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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The only things different for sprint training vs Ironman training is the key workouts that target the specific demands of the race and race execution practice.

All of the endurance training is the same because you need all of the endurance you can build to go as fast as you can.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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Whatever you do, you're going to want to run 200 miles a month. Proven to work. :D
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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5/6 days/week for running? It depends on the plan and level. They're pretty 'scalable.' Other people will do things differently, but running is my limiter, so I use this because it plots out long slow runs, track sessions, fartleks, etc. for me. (And 1 day at least will be 'only' a brief moderate run)

I'm 45-49 ag and do sprints, too, btw.

I do find that hills, 20 min/10min intervals on the bike were a huge benefit, even with just about 4-5 hours on the bike/week.

After a pretty big year or two of consistent training, I found that I could handle work that was shorter duration and higher tempo. That helped race day immensely.

ETA -- good for all, but lots of serious full body stretching and core/band work help me to stay (literally) balanced and to recover. Didn't have to a few years ago...
Last edited by: apmoss: Aug 29, 17 6:50
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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SpeedNeeder wrote:
I usually try not to run and bike the same day, but maybe that's something I can look at changing. (because I'm sure any 5k running plan will have me running 5/6 days per week).

Since I hit 50 (late 40s, actually) I am finding that I cannot comfortably run back-to-back days. I currently run 4 days/week, and that is probably pushing the limit of what my knees want to deal with. I am running about 25 miles/week, and I can ramp up to ~35, but I cannot get much more without persistent soreness and increased injury risk. So, adjust your # weekly runs and distances according to what your body can handle.

Biking, on the other hand, is easy. I double-up bike and run days with very little impact to either workout. So, give it a try, but you may find that you can ride on a run day without impacts. I ride 2x/week on run days and 1x/week on swim days.
Last edited by: exxxviii: Aug 29, 17 7:48
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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Sprints are great. If you're racing, not just completing, they're pretty challenging. I'm late forties and love training for sprints. Some very good recommendations above.

I echo the suggestion to take a look at Fast after Fifty. If you've been in a coaching environment for a while, there's nothing really new, but will help affirms some basic points (need for intensity as you age). Also, based on my experience.

  • Number of hours - 8-12 a weeks with right distribution/intensity is a good range to do well on sprints (and olys)
  • Take mobility seriously - particularly as you age, work on range of motion - in addition to fitness this will help with the skills part of running, swimming, etc.
  • Take recovery seriously (I'm still learning this one)- don't be a slave to a program - work on paces, etc. but learn to modulate depending on how you feel. The end game is get faster, not just complete the prescribed workout that day.
  • Work on strength - of course, appropriately adapted to to your fitness level and age/recovery. But things like plyos, strength, etc. can help in the production of power. I've been experimenting more with this and seeing a difference.

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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [exxxviii] [ In reply to ]
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exxxviii wrote:
TrainerRoad has sprint plans. Most of their plans also include run and swim workouts alongside the bike workouts. I have not looked in the Sprint plans, though.

Yes, TR has Sprint plans, with 3 different levels of weekly time commitment. Nothing specifically for "50+," but I don't think you really need that.

"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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Friel's most popular book - The Triathlete's Training Bible - includes a section (or at least did in early editions) where he discusses a training plan for a masters athlete focusing on sprint tris. The Time-Crunched Triathlete by Carmichael also focuses on training for short-course tris. Have fun!
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
SpeedNeeder wrote:
I'm having a hard time finding info specifically relevant to competing in sprint triathlons at age 50. I've done 7 sprints, and I'm in happy doing those. Looking for information specific to training for sprints.


pussy

50 is just a baby. Wonder if they are potty trained yet? :)

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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [Mark Lemmon] [ In reply to ]
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Mark Lemmon wrote:
Friel's most popular book - The Triathlete's Training Bible - includes a section (or at least did in early editions) where he discusses a training plan for a masters athlete focusing on sprint tris. The Time-Crunched Triathlete by Carmichael also focuses on training for short-course tris. Have fun!

Thanks Mark!
I have the Bible - I will look at that again. I know it had a method for planning a training year.
I hadn't heard of the time crunched athlete - thanks for the lead. I liked the time crunched cyclist, so that may be a good option for me.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [SpeedNeeder] [ In reply to ]
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I'm 61 and do more sprints than anything. There are lots of ways to train successfully. Here's a general idea:

1. Use some sort of running plan, such as Hal Higdon 5k, 10k, or 15k (outdated but still good), depending on what your next important race is. Running frequently is very important when you're old, even though you don't run hard every time. Running a fast 5k is a good way to hurt yourself if you're old, overweight, and/or out of shape. Even if you're in shape, you need to run a lot to get your lower body toughened up for the impact of running faster. The older you get, the more important this is. In run training for 5k-15k, you might run once or twice a week at longer than race distance, 1 or 2 speed training sessions, and some easy runs. You probably want to adhere to the limit of 10% max mileage increase per week.
2. Swim as much as you can stand it. USMS has triathlon (and other) swim workouts online that are good. Post some swim videos on Slowtwitch for commentary.
3. Bike a lot, concentrating on 12-25 mile rides. Do some rides at max speed overall, and some with intervals. Get a trainer for the winter.
4. Spend some time doing workouts that last as long as a race, combining 2-3 of run-bike-swim, or longer workouts on one of them. You can also run your own practice triathlons, or enter more races.

Biking is a larger percentage of time in a triathlon, but a lot of older people have more room for improvement in running or swimming. Compare the rankings of your splits and see where you can improve the most and easiest.
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [Mark Lemmon] [ In reply to ]
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Mark Lemmon wrote:
Friel's most popular book - The Triathlete's Training Bible - includes a section (or at least did in early editions) where he discusses a training plan for a masters athlete focusing on sprint tris. The Time-Crunched Triathlete by Carmichael also focuses on training for short-course tris. Have fun!

Yes, and yes. Carmichael's book and coaching programs are especially well-designed for those of us in middle age with limited time to train.


<The Dew Abides>
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Re: training for sprint triathlons at 50 [dewman] [ In reply to ]
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dewman wrote:
....Carmichael's book and coaching programs are especially well-designed for those of us in middle age with limited time to train.

Thanks Drew, I just ordered a copy of carmichaels book. Oddly neither time crunched book is available on iBooks, so I ordered a paper copy!
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