post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution)

Jun 14, 16 14:44

Post #1 of 519 (23714 views)

i've written a number of articles preparatory to a series, about to commence, on the bikes that are your best match, depending on your particular profile as a tri bike rider.

i'll center this around pad x/y. i don't rightly know how many articles this is going to be. it might be 4, it might be 20. we'll see where this goes.

way back when, maybe 15 years ago, i did this, and i named body types. long body roddy. spark plug doug. laid back jack. first place grace. longleg craig. and then described the list of bikes for each type.

now we've got a whole bunch of new and different bikes, and we have better tools, ideas, calculators, that can more accurately bind you to the list of bikes you might best consider.

i'm not going to write about every answer to this post. but i'll use some of your submissions as templates for articles. i'm going to use as an operative set of metics pad x/y. so, what i'd need are your pad x/y numbers, to the center of the pad, and then a couple of sentences about you and how you ride, such as, beginner, long leg short torso, mildly rearward, or way forward, overweight, fighting weight, a long time in this position, confident in my position, very much not confident in my position, whatever describes you.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 14:58

Post #2 of 519 (23694 views)

I know this increases the work of measuring, but it would be really good to also have:
Pad width (to centres)
Extension width (also centres, near the clamps rather than grips)
Pad length (the pad itself, front to back)

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:00

Post #3 of 519 (23689 views)

pad stack: 550
pad reach: 480

3rd year racing and very aggressive position right now. I have been riding pretty far forward, even experimenting with my elbows on the pad. If I weren't already hanging way out over the front of my bike and slammed down right above the head tube, I would have more options to optimize stack and reach.

Not confident in my position, constantly tinkering. Have been tinkering with extensions, pads/cups, and BTA setups...aero testing of different combinations. About to start the tinkering more with saddles.

Last edited by: kileyay: Jun 14, 16 15:37

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:04

Post #4 of 519 (23666 views)

Pad Stack - 600mm
Pad Reach - 480mm

In spite of the fact am 170cm tall & neither long nor short legged.

Regards,

Mr. Fan of Long & Low Geometry :-)

David T-D
http://www.tilburydavis.com

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:06

Post #5 of 519 (23661 views)

UCI illegal position:
X: 493mm
Y: 625mm

UCI legal position:
X: 443mm
Y: 648mm

I'm 6'2" / 188cm tall. I competed in triathlons from 2009-2013, finishing up with Ironman in Whistler. I was top 5% on the bike leg. I then switched to road racing, where I do time trials, some of which require UCI legality. I'm comfortable and fast in the illegal position. I could probably go a bit lower. But getting into a UCI legal position is a challenge, and I'm looking for a new frame that will make this work. The top XY is not UCI legal on the converted S5 I'm riding. The extension tips are 870mm ahead of BB, and can only be 800mm ahead. The bottom XY is legal but taller/compressed.

Edited to correct XY values; added my height; added my UCI legal position

Graham Barron Design: Custom west coast house design http://www.grahambarron.com/

Last edited by: rhet0ric: Jun 15, 16 21:54

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:23

Post #6 of 519 (23634 views)

Seat clamp x/y would also be interesting. But maybe it's crossing one bridge at a time.

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [trail] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:26

Post #7 of 519 (23628 views)

i am assuming that today's tri bikes all can adjust fore/aft enough to accommodate the rider's chosen saddle position.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:40

Post #8 of 519 (23597 views)

Slowman wrote:

i am assuming that today's tri bikes all can adjust fore/aft enough to accommodate the rider's chosen saddle position.

I'm thinking of this from the perspective of being in the middle of developing a graphical calculator where you input 2-3 body measurements and it spits out "starting point" pad and clamp x,y. Possibly also a dropdown for "aggressive/average/comfort" positions. A secondary goal would be then to have an equipment database that could render specific equipment over the top of those x,y points using published stack/reach numbers and give a visual idea of what might work. Maybe starting with just frames, but also maybe, eventually, accounting for various front end options (though that gets complicated in a hurry).

Anyway the data your collecting here it useful for me to select where exactly "average starting point" pad x,y should be given designations like "aggressive."

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 15:50

Post #9 of 519 (23583 views)

Pad reach/stack = 510/590.

I'm a 5'8, 135#, average-proportioned guy. I'm reasonably confident in my position, have ridden this bike (2006ish P3-SL) for 5 years now with a lot of position experimentation.

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:26

Post #10 of 519 (23541 views)

Pad stack: 649mm
Pad Reach: 447mm (to back of pad, from my Retul report)

Brand new position, so new I don't even have a new bike to set the position on yet (it's on order). I've been doing duathlon and triathlon since ~2010, but I mostly race bikes. Confident bike handler, 40km TT time ~58min. My old TT bike was a frame bought from a club mate that was too long (I know now), but I made it "work". Mostly that's because I focus on road racing, but I'm looking to improve my TTs. The above numbers come from an "ideal" fit done by Ryan Ignatz (on a Muve fit bike) which gets me ~10.5cm of drop to the pads and gives me a low and slightly stretched position. The saddle is actually set a bit rearward, so the position would also be UCI legal (not that I need it to be just yet).
Physically, I'm 5'10" and 135lbs, and coming up on the big four-oh. Fairly evenly proportioned in legs/torso. I'm pretty sure that I'll be able to comfortably hold the position for the (primarily) 20-40km races I do. Hopefully the new position shaves time from the 40km.

----------------------------------
http://ironvision.blogspot.com ; @drSteve1663

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [drsteve] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:28

Post #11 of 519 (23537 views)

fine. thanks. for all the rest of you: add 40mm to back of pad. that gets you to the center of the pad. that's what i'm looking for.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:31

Post #12 of 519 (23534 views)

lol Sparkplug Doug. hehehehehe!!!!!

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [trail] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:35

Post #13 of 519 (23526 views)

trail wrote:

A secondary goal would be then to have an equipment database that could render specific equipment over the top of those x,y points using published stack/reach numbers and give a visual idea of what might work. Maybe starting with just frames, but also maybe, eventually, accounting for various front end options (though that gets complicated in a hurry).

Just having the front end database is complicated enough. And it's very hard to get good measurement data out of bar makers (excepting Profile Design, Bontrager, Felt, Zipp and Tririg), so I hate to think of how hard it would be to get images suitable for virtual builds. Though I'd certainly like to be able to do so.

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:47

Post #14 of 519 (23512 views)

Stack 630mm
Reach (to back of pad) 388mm
Reach (to centre of pad) 438mm

I'm on a profile F-35 pad which from memory is about 100mm wide.

I'm long legged and short in the torso.

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [benb] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 16:55

Post #15 of 519 (23501 views)

what bike are you riding? can you describe our set-up now? and the saddle. and, whether you're happy with your position?

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:15

Post #16 of 519 (23475 views)

681 stack, 454 reach.

I am tall (6'3") with a big upper body (6'6" reach or so).

Seemed that most of the taller bikes were OK, ended up on a 56cm 2015 scott plasma 10.. good idea or not? Seems to fit well. 165mm cranks. Very happy with position comfort wise.

Last edited by: copperman: Jun 14, 16 17:19

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:41

Post #17 of 519 (23442 views)

Yeah sure Dan. I'm on a 2013 Cervelo P2 Classic (54cm). Stock bars (profile T2 wing and T4 extensions). An ISM adamo attack saddle. I'm very happy with my fit and I'm generally placing top 10% in my age group on the ride.

The arm pads are as far back as they'll go and the saddle is a long way forward. I get knee/elbow impingement if I'm right on the end of the saddle, pushing hard or out of the saddle climbing. A smaller frame might be more appropriate but no one makes a seat post that long and the drop from the saddle to pads is already quite large.

Last edited by: benb: Jun 14, 16 17:42

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [copperman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:46

Post #18 of 519 (23436 views)

copperman wrote:

681 stack, 454 reach.

I am tall (6'3") with a big upper body (6'6" reach or so).

454 reach to centre of pads? How far back is your saddle? Setback and saddle to pads reach?

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:49

Post #19 of 519 (23434 views)

Hi,

It is great you are doing this. I've got the numbers from my ST roadshow worksheet.

Pad Elevation: Pad X: 440, Pad Y: 605.

There are also a couple of other numbers, under the notation "HX or reach (CR):

1. 450, and to the right of that 1. 545

I can post of photo of the worksheet if that is helpful.

Currently I am riding an old P3C, model year 2008, size 51. I am not especially happy with the fit lately as my neck tends to hurt a bit and I am not comfortable for long periods.
.

Eric

Last edited by: helo guy: Jun 14, 16 17:51

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:49

Post #20 of 519 (23434 views)

X: Horizontal pad reach from BB: 520
Y: Vertical pad stack from BB: 660

M45, 6'2", long torso and as lean as I'm gonna get. Professionally fit in 2015, with a bike built to that fit, and currently working to refine the details. Saddle nose to BB at -70, with a 115mm drop.

Edit: added 40mm to pad reach to adjust X to the pad center

Scott

Last edited by: GreatScott: Jun 14, 16 20:39

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:53

Post #21 of 519 (23420 views)

cyclenutnz wrote:

copperman wrote:

681 stack, 454 reach.

I am tall (6'3") with a big upper body (6'6" reach or so).

454 reach to centre of pads? How far back is your saddle? Setback and saddle to pads reach?

Yes 414 to back of pads and I added 40 to come to 454 reach.

My stack and seat are both 1CM higher than listed here, so I guess 691 stack now.

Last edited by: copperman: Jun 14, 16 18:04

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [copperman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 17:59

Post #22 of 519 (23406 views)

copperman wrote:

Yes 414 to back of pads and I added 40 to come to 454 reach.

Thanks for the details. Do you find you move your elbows forward on the pads? Or ever feel a bit cramped up?

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 18:04

Post #23 of 519 (23398 views)

cyclenutnz wrote:

copperman wrote:

Yes 414 to back of pads and I added 40 to come to 454 reach.

Thanks for the details. Do you find you move your elbows forward on the pads? Or ever feel a bit cramped up?

No basically my elbows are like 1mm hanging off the back of the pads and feel really good. If I move them 1cm forward it starts to put my back in an uncomfortable position. Nothing wrong with my back per say (no blown discs or whatever), but I have very tight hamstrings, so think it kind of limits my overall position options. Too low or too much rotation and my heels start to come up when I pedal.

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [GreatScott] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 18:25

Post #24 of 519 (23375 views)

GreatScott… we have the same numbers

pad x (reach): 520mm
pad y (stack): 660mm

6'4", 175lbs
slightly longer torso proportional to legs

ride at around 79-degrees on a Cobb Max saddle, arm rest drop is 140mm

riding in this position for 15+ years, i think it's a good position

Last edited by: Bru: Jun 14, 16 18:28

Re: post your own pad x/y (if you want the solution) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]

Jun 14, 16 19:07

Post #25 of 519 (23339 views)

Stack 609
Reach 497

Height 6'2". Long legs. Slightly forward but comfortable position aboard a Trek SC Size L.

Last edited by: Bryan0721: Jun 14, 16 21:28

Our Partners

transition-DOT-area-AT-slowtwitch-DOT-com

Advertise with us

©1999-2024 Slowtwitch, Inc., and Slowtwitch.com
Reproduction of material from any Slowtwitch.com page
without written permission is strictly prohibited.