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Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr
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At $1,600 for the CT vs 1,100 for the kickr.

Is there a reason that one would choose one over the other?

Thanks

Yellowfin Endurance Coaching and Bike Fits
USAT Level 1, USAC Level 3
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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Ct is nice but I sold mine to buy a kickr and don't regret it. The wahoo plays well with so many 3rd party sites and is decades ahead in terms of software. Can't go wrong with either but I would choose the kickr again and again.

Human Person
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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surfNJmatt wrote:
At $1,600 for the CT vs 1,100 for the kickr.

Is there a reason that one would choose one over the other?

Thanks

My comments relate to Computrainers only as I have not used a Kickr, mind you a number of my friends have them and are happy.

I currently use my 2001 model Computrainer exclusively using PerfPro software, so I' think I'm at the current high water mark of software. Racemate stuff, is basic, but still works.
speaking of works, the unit I have has been in use since 2001, no updates, no repairs just one replaced cable from the local distributor, who I bought the unit from ( well my wife bought it as a birthday present - love my wife(still))
in another 14 years time, I assume the same computrainer unit will be operating, but what software will be in use I can't foresee... but I know that the unit, the basic software and the stand alone controller will still be usable. And still with the same wife....

if I was buying today at equivalent price, I'd get a Computrainer, but there is a reasonable price differential that further muddies the waters
Last edited by: Avago: May 26, 15 23:18
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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Neither. Get a power beam pro. It's got a smaller size profile, is less expensive, has 20% off right now, and works great!
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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surfNJmatt wrote:
At $1,600 for the CT vs 1,100 for the kickr.

Is there a reason that one would choose one over the other?

Thanks

Those are the costs to get them working. Add a PM for the kickr.

One you just get on and ride, the other you seem to spend more time playing with to get to work.

.

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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i have owned both and really like the Kickr. In terms of an actual trainer, it's much nicer, very heavy flywheel, no tire interface, solid frame. The CT has wires hanging everywhere and a dated software interface. The CT in ergo more is supposed to be more accurate. I have been happy with the kickr and don't feel the issues with ergo mode reading low are a problem for me, but you may want to research and decide if you care. There are people who like both a lot.

I reach for my rollers a lot too though.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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surfNJmatt wrote:
At $1,600 for the CT vs 1,100 for the kickr.

Is there a reason that one would choose one over the other?

Thanks

I own a CT, never had a kickr
I always wondered what I would do if the CT dies.

From speaking to others, what is great about the Kickr is the variety of apps out there. That being said, I have tried all kinds of things, Zwift, Suffeferst, Ergvideo, Kinomap and many others and the novelty lasts about 5 rides per application. I end up reverting back to watching ITU races while in Erg mode.

What I love about the CT is the consistency of the power measurements. My CT has become my reference when I am doubting my PM.

So consistency of readings, outstanding reliability and the expense of not having the coolest app that I will lose interest after a few rides.

A Kickr+quality PM will give good power measurements but is more expensive if yuo don't have the PM.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
One you just get on and ride, the other you seem to spend more time playing with to get to work.
.

and you know this from direct experience, right?
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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A couple of questions.

1. Do you have a crank based power meter?
2. Do you have a spare PC that you can use for the software or do you want to use IOS or Android tablets/phones?


Joel
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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I actually could never get a computrainer to work because of the funky connection that it needed to my computer (I rented a computrainer to try it out). On the other hand with the kickr I just plugged in a Ant+ stick and started off riding.

In terms of having a power meter you really don't need one you just need to realize that the kickr reads a bit high (about 10 watts for mine) and compensate appropriately. I prefer to have a my power meter control it not because of the power differential but because it means I am using the same power source that I will using outdoors and therefore I can have a valid outdoor/indoor power data comparisons.

I know you love computrainer and your velotrons and that is fine but there really are positives and negatives to both platforms and for me it really came down to a $600 price differential not to mention I was going to have to buy a new computer for the computrainer for another $500 or so dollars because my computer would not work with the computrainer like I said before I rented one and tried it out...


Joel
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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If you have a power meter, you don't need either. Get a decent trainer and subscribe to Trainer Road or one of the other online trainer programs.

If you don't already have a PM, get one and then get a trainer and subscribe.

I've had a CT since 2002. I always thought it was a piece of crap until I got on Trainer Road.

---------------------------
''Sweeney - you can both crush your AG *and* cruise in dead last!! đŸ˜‚ '' Murphy's Law
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [trismitty] [ In reply to ]
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trismitty wrote:
Ct is nice but I sold mine to buy a kickr and don't regret it. The wahoo plays well with so many 3rd party sites and is decades ahead in terms of software. Can't go wrong with either but I would choose the kickr again and again.

I gotta say, I don't entirely understand this "kickr has better software" idea.

The kickr doesn't come with _any_ built-in software other than the little wahoo control app for your phone (which is equivalent to the sweatproof controller for the CT). The racermate stuff might be a bit dated, but at least you can do simulated rides and workouts with it out of the box.

Zwift, Trainerroad, PerfPro, Tour de Giro, Bkool will all work with both, so the 3rd-party support is equal. As a developer, I can tell you the CT is much easier to work with and far more reliable in terms of getting connected and staying connected.

Addendum: After 4 months of 2-3 hours/week this winter, my kickr is broken. My CT suffered through much, much worse and is still going strong.

Edit: Dgran gives a more even-handed roundup than me below.

STAC Zero Trainer - Zero noise, zero tire contact, zero moving parts. Suffer in Silence starting fall 2016
Last edited by: AHare: May 27, 15 5:40
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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I own two CTs and I've tried the Kickr, but that doesn't make me any expert on the matter but I've read a lot of commentary on this topic and this is what I believe it boils down to:

  • They are both quite good. Look hard enough and you will find extreme love or hate for both though, but somewhere in the middle most people seem quite satisfied.
  • The CT has wires all over the place and people kid me that it looks like some dialysis machine. You will appreciate having fewer wires when setting up or moving a Kickr and you will appreciate the reliability of wired communication if you ever have electrical interference. A lot of fanfare is made over this issue and it seems a bit of a straw man.
  • If you use just one bike on the trainer then no worries about cassette compatibility on the Kickr. I've known some people who need to switch cassettes in addition to bikes and it would be easier for them to use a tire based contact point. For the vast majority the chain based contact of the Kickr is simpler.
  • The chain based contact ultimately means less friction points and no tire wear but this is a pretty minor point. Most people I know either use a dedicated training wheel with a durable trainer tire or just use left over worn tires from the outdoor season. Keep the tire clean, mount firmly with sensible press on force and this issue largely goes away.
  • The Kickr has more software options but it seems like the most popular ones are available to both platforms.
  • Based on holding the units in your hands they both seem quite durable. It is too early to say with the Kickr but if you are the sort who likes to buy things once and use them long term there is no shortage of people who are still using a CT that they bought during the Reagan administration.
  • I suspect that Wahoo will work out whatever kinks are reported with power numbers reading high or drifting, but that stuff will be unacceptable for some people. You can get bad readings on a CT as well but it usually goes back to user error calibrating and it is a pretty simple act.
  • On paper the Kickr doesn't require you to calibrate each ride, but people seem to be doing it more often than required by the book to work through the aforementioned issue. On either platform it isn't such a big deal to spend 5-10 minutes warming up the unit and your body, but some day the Kickr firmware may be tightened up such that you don't need to regularly calibrate.
  • They are both pretty quiet. Oddly enough the thing that will make either of them loud is having a dirty or worn chain and the loudness is often proportional to the speed of the chain.
  • Some people really get into the spinscan stuff for the CT. I have a host of strong opinions about it, but there may be something of value there as long as you ignore the snake oil claims about pulling up the pedals.
  • The Kickr is less expensive, no doubt about that. Most people suggest that it makes sense to buy a CT used since they are bomb proof, which evens it out a bit.



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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [gabbiev] [ In reply to ]
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The KICKR accuracy/drift issue is also amplified tenfold here on ST because it's a very vocal minority. The vast majority of KICKR owners do not or have not had this issue. Mine was within a couple percent to my Quarq right out of the box. Not discounting the issue because I'd be pissed if mine was 30W off too but anyone reading ST would believe 99% of KICKRs were faulty when that's just not the reality.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
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I agree mine is usually somewhere between 5 and 10 watts high and it is very consistent in that difference.



Joel
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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My buddy and I took a different approach to this and recently compared. I got myself a used 2002 CT Pro and he got himself a KICKR. The issues I hear people mentioning here about wires is a moot point IMO. I've taken the wires, run them below the matt and I cut a slit for them to come out from under the mat and plug into the load generator. My controller is mounted to a Microphone stand and the wires run up through the stand into the controller. The only wire you can see is the Cadence one that is on my rear non-drive side chainstay and even that is again routed through a small slit cut in my matt and fed up. I've been using a laptop circa 2008 to run TrainerRoad, Zwift, RacerMate One and I've had no problems (granted it has a decent video card).

My buddy bought himself a KICKR at the same time. He's had trouble getting it to work with his iPad, his TrainerRoad interface has much less options, he can't watch movies or races during his sessions, and he has the accuracy issues. He is happy with it but when he came to use my setup he was KICKRING himself in the ass. He wishes he had taken my approach to the "Smart Trainer" setup and pocketed the extra cash.

I bought my CT for $800 all in (Canadian $)
His KICKR was $1300 (Canadian $)

Hope that helps

------
"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"
Last edited by: cshowe80: May 27, 15 8:13
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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The Computrainer is wired and it just works. If you've ever had your wireless connection drop in the middle of an interval on an erg you'll appreciate the importance of this.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [gabbiev] [ In reply to ]
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gabbiev wrote:
GMAN19030 wrote:
The KICKR accuracy/drift issue is also amplified tenfold here on ST because it's a very vocal minority. The vast majority of KICKR owners do not or have not had this issue. Mine was within a couple percent to my Quarq right out of the box. Not discounting the issue because I'd be pissed if mine was 30W off too but anyone reading ST would believe 99% of KICKRs were faulty when that's just not the reality.


Fully agree with you that most of the complaints originate from a subset of users. The problem is, I suspect that most users have no way to validate the accuracy and consistency of their specific Kickrs. My point is that I'd want greater assurance about the unit out of the box.

This said, for the most Kickr users, accuracy and consistency really isn't an issue that will come into play for their training. A good principle is to keep things simple, unless a use case situation arises that is predicated on complexity. Indoor training isn't one of them, I don't think, though I'm willing to be convinced otherwise.

Not only that, all the vocal Kickr critics seem to by default use their 'non-Kickr power device' as the gold standard without a good reason for choosing it as the gold standard. Obviously if the Quarq is off your real FTP by -10 watts, and the Kickr is +10 watts, they're both about equally inaccurate, but you're going to blame the Kickr for being +20 watts off the Quarq and thus 'unsuable' if you don't reference correctly.

I think a few folks have been able to beta test against multiple simultaneous PMs which makes a better case for a 'gold standard reference', but the vast majority of folks automatically assume their powermeters are 100% accurate, which is certainly not necessarily the case. I do get that if you race with a powermeter, you want your Kickr to reflect your race equipment, but that still doesn't mean you can critique the Kickr for being off if you can't justify the powermeter as being 100% accurate.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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I'd get the Kickr. Only reason I got a CT is because I found one "Like New" for $500 with everything included plus a bunch of additional stuff. Can't beat that price.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [AHare] [ In reply to ]
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referrring to the 3rd party apps, but thte simplicity of running it through the iphone either with TR or WAhoo is a nice touch. Matter of preference. Haven't missed the CT once since I switched, but it was a nice piece of equipment.

Human Person
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [tovi] [ In reply to ]
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Plus for me at least, indoor vs outdoor ftp have always been different so I need to re-test outdoors close to my race anyway.




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Searching for the bliss of ultimate exertion.
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Re: Why should I buy a computrainer over a kickr [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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I have a CT, and have never used a Kickr. My CT has been dead reliable for me. Kickr appears to be a more modern, well thought out design as well.

The most compelling reason I see to go with CT over a Kickr is that ErgVideos are only available for CT.

surfNJmatt wrote:
At $1,600 for the CT vs 1,100 for the kickr.

Is there a reason that one would choose one over the other?

Thanks
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