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Who has given up recording HR when training?
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I'm considering stopping recording my heart rate when training as I've realised I almost never check the data during or after exercise. The only time I check my HR mid-workout is during long runs, just to make sure I'm not pushing too hard. But it seems like such a variable metric, and given that I train with power on the bike, I don't think I'd miss it for cycling or running.

I'm wondering how many people have also stopped recording HR, and whether you missed it and went back, or left the stap off and never looked back?

Thanks!
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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HR data can give you an indicator of over training
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I hadn't used it years and only now started using it in the last week- didn't like it on the bike, wasn't useful for me, just telling me I was blowing up or hurting which I can feel anyway. Power also can let me know this. Used it for a long run and kept me in check but I had sort of been keeping myself in check just by pace or PRE anyway for years. I'll probably ditch it again.
I can see it's use in some instances like maffetone running etc. or overtraining like mentioned above. But I would be surprised if a lot used HR.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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If you are training I would continue logging your HR data. It's a better indicator of your fitness and training efficacy than monitoring power. In fact I stopped monitoring power.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [pokey] [ In reply to ]
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pokey wrote:
HR data can give you an indicator of over training

So can continually tired/sore legs.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I stopped for a few years once I got power. I restarted this year to try out some new metrics, but my hrm strap is such a hit or miss thing it messes up a lot of my data, so I'm pretty much done with it.

Data didn't tell me anything I didn't already know, anyway. I just need the wattage.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [NealH] [ In reply to ]
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NealH wrote:
If you are training I would continue logging your HR data. It's a better indicator of your fitness and training efficacy than monitoring power. In fact I stopped monitoring power.

^^^^ This. While I still use power numbers though, I am more swayed by HR. On the run, I use it most of the time to keep to my plan.

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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I like having both HR & power, seeing HR drop for the same power helps confirm that I'm getting something back for the work.

Having said that I use optical, I can imagine straps being a pain, I'd still want to use them but might only stick it on now & again.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I've actually gone back to heart rate. Still use power to monitor progress

Yes, it's variable, it's delayed, it has issues. But focusing on it last year and sticking to a more maf style approach helped me have a breakthrough year without injury, sickness or too much fatigue for the first time in a longgg time
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [randomtriguy] [ In reply to ]
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randomtriguy wrote:
I've actually gone back to heart rate. Still use power to monitor progress

The big four types of data to capture and track:
RPE + ROF - How hard was that, how do I feel today
HR + HRV - How are you responding to volume and intensity
Power - How much work did you do, How hard was it
Course/Distance + Time/Speed - The ultimate integrated measure of performance.

All four types of metrics are vital - and have the added benefit of being concrete, individualised and largely repeatable and reliable.

Mark
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I would stay with HR. The more data you have on HR the better it is. I agree in the short term, without much data it's not very reliable because of the factors that can affect it, but over the long term (with enough data) it's a very reliable measure for intensity. I love how the new Garmin 935 tracks your last 4 hours during rest. it's great to have for sleep so you can get a accurate measurement of your resting heart rate. great to measure intensity and what's going on inside the body whereas power is an output measurement. the correlation between the two over time can be very nice if you know what you are looking for. even if you aren't using it now i would still record it and keep logging your data should you choose to start using it again. i wrote a course with ACSM and Polar HR monitors that you can take online on how to use it. it's three webinars and fairly simple to understand and a total of about 3.5 hours. it could help get you started.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [NealH] [ In reply to ]
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NealH wrote:
If you are training I would continue logging your HR data. It's a better indicator of your fitness and training efficacy than monitoring power. In fact I stopped monitoring power.


×1
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I use HR to make sure I'm pushing hard enough. Sometimes i get lazy while running.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I have been thinking of using power to train but HR and PE to race.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [NealH] [ In reply to ]
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NealH wrote:
It's a better indicator of your fitness and training efficacy than monitoring power. In fact I stopped monitoring power.

Does being able to do a 40kTT at 280watts tell less about my fitness than having an average heart rate of 166bpm while doing so? Care to flesh out your reasoning? After 40 years of monitoring HR and 20+ power I really can't find a way to agree with your contention.

Thanks,

Hugh

Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I stopped using HR in 1998.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry, I'm not one who steps backward in time. HR doesn't do squat for me in a 40K TT because if I use HR alone, I will be overcooking it for the first five minutes or so.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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For running, yes. I found that given my hollow chest, the straps never felt comfortable running, especially in races. For me pace is a better metric anyway.

But give me a watch that measures in the wrist, and I'll go back to measuring again.

(Why would you choose less data?)
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [timbasile] [ In reply to ]
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timbasile wrote:
For running, yes. I found that given my hollow chest, the straps never felt comfortable running, especially in races. For me pace is a better metric anyway.

But give me a watch that measures in the wrist, and I'll go back to measuring again.

Yeah, I stopped with heartrate a few years ago because the strap got to be such a pain in the butt. The wrist measurement from a watch does intrigue me though.

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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [RichardL] [ In reply to ]
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RichardL wrote:
Sorry, I'm not one who steps backward in time. HR doesn't do squat for me in a 40K TT because if I use HR alone, I will be overcooking it for the first five minutes or so.

I assume your training is comprised of various workouts, not just daily 40k TTs.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [timbasile] [ In reply to ]
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timbasile wrote:
(Why would you choose less data?)

I find too much data overwhelming because I tend to over think things. I have a bit of an obsessive personality. I have just sold my power meter on what was my third attempt at trying to adopt riding with power. An example of my stupid brain...

The more data you have access to the more testing you (maybe) do. Do you then 'taper' for your test so it's a fair assessment every time? How often do you do your test? How much more effective would training be if you just did the work day in, day out without worrying about numbers and taking a couple of days off to perform well in a test? Is the information that helpful anyway? Numbers are down when I'm tired, I know that. Numbers are higher when I'm fresh, of course. I''m putting out good watts compared to my peers but I'm also heavier than them so a watt isn't a watt. Watts/kg I can make sense of but that's more relevant in climbing than on the flats. What if it's a scorching hot day? Do I still try and push out the watts even though my heart rate is higher due to the additional stress? Is 300 watts at a cadence of 70 the same muscular demand as 300 watts at a cadence of 100? I guess not but I don't know ...

Next step: Remove from bike... eBay... sold... I'm thinking too much. This tool is now hindering me, not helping.

Just back to the heart rate monitor now. No cadence either. I know when I'm pushing harder I have a higher cadence, and when I'm cruising gently I use a lower cadence. That's normal and the exact numbers are determined by what feels comfortable anyway. So I just use heart rate and time. Simple and already takes into account other stresses so it's always relevant. If I get some funny numbers like can't get heart rate up I know I'm cooked and need rest. On the bike it's a bit slow to react but I kinda know the feel of various intensities now so I don't tend to overdo it and then have to calm myself back down like I did when I first started.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I have gravitated more toward heat rate.

Using a scosche armband has made readings much more reliable.

Hr is great for not overcooking on hot days.

It works well in conjunction with power data, making the power data even more useful. Try holding ftp in heat and wind resistance vs cold and you'll see how variable the power can be if you don't include hr.

Also great for race pacing to not overcooking both bike and run. Id say it's better than power for this since you can swim hard on race day and find yourself in the hr red zone despite normal seeming power then eat it on the run.

Also measure resting hr first thing in am separately. If it goes up you gotta worry about overtraining. ( Not perfect but a sign you shouldn't ignore)
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [NealH] [ In reply to ]
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NealH wrote:
If you are training I would continue logging your HR data. It's a better indicator of your fitness and training efficacy than monitoring power. In fact I stopped monitoring power.

When there were no PMs people followed religiously the HR for controlling their training, on the bike as well as when running. Now there are PMs people use power which can be ok (although indeed not without information losses compared with HR), so they do not need HR anymore on the bike. HR was dumped then totally as being superfluous, also for running.
But it is not logical to not use heart rate while running anymore because on the bike you use power now.

The old wisdom that everyone tends to go too fast on long slow runs is still valid.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [longtrousers] [ In reply to ]
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I don't bother with HR anymore, I can roughly tell where its at. I've also sold my TT bike with PM and am considering not buying another PM, I just don't use it in races. I seem to be reasonably in tune with my level of exertion. Most of my 70.3 rides have gone to plan without using HR or power. The one race I diligently stuck to my power, I overcooked it. My coach said you need to use it as a guide, some days you can put out more power than others, level of exertion is more important.
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Re: Who has given up recording HR when training? [BungleJapan] [ In reply to ]
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I'm definitely a cheapskate, so I don't use anything other than a watch when I'm serious about running and cycling (add the bike computer for distance if I happen to buy a new battery) and a pace clock for pool swimming. Besides saving money, this allows me to judge everything I'm doing by feel.

If I am aware of all the variables and settings of how I "feel," which include rest, temperature, time off day, amount of caffeine on board, recent nutrition, terrain, etc, I can better control training to how I feel, rather than thinking I have to keep x HR. If I'm a slave to some HR charts or numbers, and train to those while trying to decide how much to add or subtract based on variables, I'm just trying to be a robot. Biological systems are too variable to be constricted. When I was training for marathon or Ironman, I basically had a total time or distance in mind for any training bout. On long runs, I usually tried to keep mind off what my pace was, and just tried to end strong.

I've focused more on swimming in the last several years, taking short breaks after summer long course season to run (my wife has taken over my tribike for her training). I've focused mostly on pace for the events I've done over the last few years (USMS pool distance postal events and distance events at meets). This training also translates to OWS. A few years ago, I wanted to go about 2:15 for the pool 10k in a 50m pool, so I just worked on stuff around that pace, for either shorter (faster than pace) or longer (at pace) workouts. Even then, it was just about feel.

FWIW, I also felt like slightly undertaking for marathon and Ironman. I knew plenty of people from IM training groups who bragged about bricks and so on. I showed up to the races "fat and happy," and found myself chasing almost all of these people down on the run who had done 100 mile rides followed by 8m runs in the heat. I showed up ready and hungry. I'm not fat, but I don't look at all like others in my AG who've done two BQ's or gone under 11:20.

About the only trick I ever use on HR is this: in your taper, take your RHR just as you wake up every day. It should drop daily. If it doesn't, back off even more. In my late teens and early 20s as a club and NCAA swimmer, I'd be at about 50 when I started taper, and about 34 on the first day of a meet. This has also worked really well in the years since. Because nothing is cheaper than two fingers on your wrist or carotid.
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