Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Prev Next
Re: Trainer road.com [JDinMA] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
JDinMA wrote:
I just got a power meter a few weeks ago and am preparing for a half iron on Sept 11 (second half of the season). I have been using the moderate volume half iron specialty plan, starting with week 3. This week would be week 5, but I have an Olympic distance race on Sunday and would like to have a strong race, while maintaining good training for the half which is higher priority. Any recommendations on what workouts to do this week? The plan currently calls for Elwell tomorrow.

Thanks a lot, enjoying the sessions so far!

If this isn't a high-priority event, and I'm guessing it's not, then I'd recommend training through it and simply replacing your weekend's workouts with the weekend's race. Just proceed as normal until Saturday, then give Truuli -1 a shot on Saturday followed by a recovery run + a few strides just like I've prescribed on Saturday of week 8. This can give you a really good idea of how well this priming strategy works for a Sunday triathlon, even if it's a shorter event. And good luck!

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Hey Chad,

Wanted to say thanks for the awesome platform and support you all provide. From 2001-2005 I was consistently a 2:15-2:19 HIM cyclist, as I posted above. Due to work obligations and other 'stuff' getting in the way, I was off of the bike for the better part of 10 years. I got back in 6 months ago with TR and rode a 2:16 this weekend. I questioned the intensity and structure of the plans with you a few weeks back, but I definitely wanted to say I'm pleased with the progression so far and am looking forward to scrapping another (hopeful) 10 minutes over the next few years!!!

I've signed up for Galveston 70.3 on 4/2/17, what do you suggest between now and then? I did the HIM High Volume plan, and I'll probably tweak that slightly should I do it again (less rides of 4 plus hours, etc.), but overall I was pretty happy. After Galveston I'm going to do 2-3 other HIMs and then IMNC in the fall. I should note that during my break from cycling (and swimming) over the past 10 years, I did several ultra marathons and ran quite a bit (hitting over 100mpw 30 plus times), so general endurance is not a problem at all. I'm thinking of hitting sweet spot base beginning in a few weeks, but after that I'm kind of uncertain of what to do before I start my build/specialty to the season. Also, I've got the support/time to put in the training - wife and I don't have/aren't planning on kids, and I've got a stable 40hr week with no commute. Wife is supportive as well.

Again, awesome product. I would not have pushed myself as hard structuring the training myself. A power meter plus TR is the best money I've spent on triathlon related products outside of the bike itself.
Last edited by: pvolb: Aug 19, 16 10:27
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [hamachijohn] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
My guess is that PowerMatch is not turned on in the app and your Kickr and SRM aren't not equally calibrated. In other words, ERG mode is controlling the Kickr and telling it to hit "x" watts, but the power reading in the App is coming from the SRM and the Kickr's "x" watts is "x - ___" watts to the SRM. Read this. If you are using the new desktop app, go to the Kickr "Device Settings" and turn PowerMatch to "Auto."
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [hamachijohn] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
hamachijohn wrote:
Need advice re: ERG mode using Kickr. Tried doing a search but couldn't find anything on point.
Background: 3rd yr age grouper, mostly HIMs, bike times approx. 3:05 (give or take). I have SRM pm on my tri bike.

Started using TR 3 weeks ago on a dummy trainer, and loving it. I switched to a Wahoo Kickr yesterday, set it up, and used it in ERG mode. FTP is 170, based on the ftp test when I first started using TR. When using it in ERG mode, the auto adjustment of resistence is such that I hardly ever hit my target now. When I used a dummy trainer, my legs can adjust the power to match (more or less) the target, so that I get decent precision on maintaining the target watts. Using ERG mode on the Kickr yesterday, I couldn't get up to the target watts, and resulted in training @ higher cadence than I wanted.

Is this normal? Should I do another FTP test? Or should I manually increase the target watts? Or do I trust the Kickr's resistance setting and continue training @ less than the targeted watts? Thanks in advance to this newbie's question.


Glad to hear you're enjoying it, we're stoked to have you aboard — and congrats on the new equipment! Just to make things a little easier, our support team is going to generate a support request to help you out. :)

I'll give you some thoughts of what may be going on in the meantime of us hearing back from you:

By the looks of your last workout 'Haeckel' you have the SRM paired up along with your KICKR. And it also appears that you have PowerMatch turned off. I say this because your wattage is pretty consistently below your target, just like you said. The reality of the power device world is there are sometimes discrepancies in their readings. So while one power meter may read 220 watts, an electronic trainer may think thats 210 watts. PowerMatch effectively eliminates that offset, and your trainer will change resistance according to the power meter's readings. Learn more about it here.

You shouldn't need to retest since you're using the same power source. You should however make sure you're on the correct firmware version and that you're performing a spin-down calibration prior to your workouts. So give the calibration, firmware check and PowerMatch a go, and I think we'll have better luck. :) Another good practice to keep in mind while using PowerMatch is to try and maintain a consistent cadence, since crank-based power meters are a bit more sensitive.

In any case, we'll look forward to getting everything hashed out via email with support. Thanks!

Get Faster with TrainerRoad
Last edited by: Nick Kanwetz: Aug 19, 16 13:56
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [pvolb] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
pvolb wrote:
Hey Chad,

Wanted to say thanks for the awesome platform and support you all provide. From 2001-2005 I was consistently a 2:15-2:19 HIM cyclist, as I posted above. Due to work obligations and other 'stuff' getting in the way, I was off of the bike for the better part of 10 years. I got back in 6 months ago with TR and rode a 2:16 this weekend. I questioned the intensity and structure of the plans with you a few weeks back, but I definitely wanted to say I'm pleased with the progression so far and am looking forward to scrapping another (hopeful) 10 minutes over the next few years!!!

I've signed up for Galveston 70.3 on 4/2/17, what do you suggest between now and then? I did the HIM High Volume plan, and I'll probably tweak that slightly should I do it again (less rides of 4 plus hours, etc.), but overall I was pretty happy. After Galveston I'm going to do 2-3 other HIMs and then IMNC in the fall. I should note that during my break from cycling (and swimming) over the past 10 years, I did several ultra marathons and ran quite a bit (hitting over 100mpw 30 plus times), so general endurance is not a problem at all. I'm thinking of hitting sweet spot base beginning in a few weeks, but after that I'm kind of uncertain of what to do before I start my build/specialty to the season. Also, I've got the support/time to put in the training - wife and I don't have/aren't planning on kids, and I've got a stable 40hr week with no commute. Wife is supportive as well.

Again, awesome product. I would not have pushed myself as hard structuring the training myself. A power meter plus TR is the best money I've spent on triathlon related products outside of the bike itself.

Good info and great job! Glad to hear things are progressing nicely.

Considering your ample base, the specialty plan you've completed already and the timeline for Galveston, I'd say you're in line for a re-build of some duration before repeating the HIM High Vol plan (with your modifications, which by the way, I think are sensible considering the state of your aerobic base as well as your level of experience in both training and racing).

It looks like you have about 30 weeks or so, assuming you keep things low-key for a couple weeks following the completion of your latest specialty plan. Minus the 8 weeks you'll devote to your next iteration of the half-distance plan, you've got a lot of time to play with and while base training may not be of primary importance, it might be a good way to loosen the leash for a while and let your body recuperate from the high-intensity work and racing. Buuuut...

You also have a full-distance in 8 weeks and other halfs scheduled as well, so it's really sounding like a matter of prepping for each event and effectively peaking, backing things off, peaking, backing off which can get complex and run you way down if you aren't careful. So prioritize your events keeping Galveston at the head of the list and utilize portions of build & specialty plans to time out such that you're as rested/fresh as you feel the need to be dependent on the importance of each interim event.

Personally, I'd focus on Galveston and mostly train through the other events with something along the lines of 4 weeks of build (either half depending on desired TSS) and then either the first half or second half of a distance-specific specialty plan based on how fresh you're looking to be, e.g. first half with only a recovery week for lower-priority races vs the second half with a 1- or 2-week taper for more important events or ones where you're carrying more fatigue than is reasonable.

Best of luck!

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Hey Chad,

Thanks for all the great training plans. I've followed Base-Build-Specialty for my HIM this year. I've completed the Base and Build plans at Mid-Volume and am starting the Specialty this week. The Build Phase I actually hit a bit of a wall at about week 6 and had to take about a week over for fear I was overtraining. It seems the difference between the Low Volume and Mid Volume plans is not only in the avg number of hours per week but also total TSS per week but also for each of the individual workout the TSS is higher compared to the Mid Volume. I am wondering if it would be better for me to

a) Select Mid Volume workout which and possible occasionally drop one of the rides per week or lower intensity if I feel I need to or
b) Choose Low Volume and occasionally add a ride per week or just up workout intensity depending on how I feel.

I will note that I'm adding at least 1-2 swims above the plan so I'm swimming (or at least attempting to swim 4-5 times per week)

Part of me wants to just HTFU and choose the Mid Volume plan but the other part advises be smart and choose Low Volume and add intensity or workouts if I feel up to it.

Thoughts?
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'm in week 6 of the HIM specialty plan and really struggled with Sierra this morning. I barely completed Elwell last week, and that was coming off of a pretty easy week before that. But after a hard week 5, and decreasing rest intervals compared to Elwell, Sierra was too much and I skipped the second 5-minute interval. I'm expecting that Sonora next Tuesday will be even worse.

This is my second time through the entire HIM cycle this year (base-build-specialty) and these three workouts are the only ones that I've really consistently struggled with. Is this indicative or something that I'm lacking in my fitness and something that I need to work on, or is this just a really tough part of the plan that everyone has trouble with?
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [PMo] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I too found this period of the plan difficult. I do these workouts early morning, I've gone through them a few times now (just coming off Sonora last week) and can generally nail them now (really struggled first time through). IMO it takes a while to be able to motivate yourself to the level required to complete these types of workouts. I really have to psych myself up, the type of session that you don't think you can complete when you start, but as you get going, and get a couple under your belt, you learn how to deal with it. Great confidence boosters once you nail them. Stick with it!

Of course if you're going in heavily fatigued this could have an impact, make sure the day prior is very easy/rest.


PMo wrote:
I'm in week 6 of the HIM specialty plan and really struggled with Sierra this morning. I barely completed Elwell last week, and that was coming off of a pretty easy week before that. But after a hard week 5, and decreasing rest intervals compared to Elwell, Sierra was too much and I skipped the second 5-minute interval. I'm expecting that Sonora next Tuesday will be even worse.

This is my second time through the entire HIM cycle this year (base-build-specialty) and these three workouts are the only ones that I've really consistently struggled with. Is this indicative or something that I'm lacking in my fitness and something that I need to work on, or is this just a really tough part of the plan that everyone has trouble with?
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [TriTamp] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
TriTamp wrote:
Hey Chad,

Thanks for all the great training plans. I've followed Base-Build-Specialty for my HIM this year. I've completed the Base and Build plans at Mid-Volume and am starting the Specialty this week. The Build Phase I actually hit a bit of a wall at about week 6 and had to take about a week over for fear I was overtraining. It seems the difference between the Low Volume and Mid Volume plans is not only in the avg number of hours per week but also total TSS per week but also for each of the individual workout the TSS is higher compared to the Mid Volume. I am wondering if it would be better for me to

a) Select Mid Volume workout which and possible occasionally drop one of the rides per week or lower intensity if I feel I need to or
b) Choose Low Volume and occasionally add a ride per week or just up workout intensity depending on how I feel.

I will note that I'm adding at least 1-2 swims above the plan so I'm swimming (or at least attempting to swim 4-5 times per week)

Part of me wants to just HTFU and choose the Mid Volume plan but the other part advises be smart and choose Low Volume and add intensity or workouts if I feel up to it.

Thoughts?

Making the call between H-ing TFU and paying attention to what your body can actually handle is all part of the never-ending learning process, but at least you're open to the possibility that the mid-volume plan may simply be too much stress for you (for the time being, anyway).

You can do a couple of things. The first is to choose the lower-volume plan and add TSS-fillers - workouts below .70 IF - to increase overall TSS without increasing the high-intensity aspect of your training. The other option is to move up to the higher-volume plan and remove some of that same type of workout, i.e. keep the bigger, high-intensity workouts but without the additional low-IF work that could be hampering your recovery.

There's also the mix-and-match approach where you use the higher-volume plan's structure but keep the lower-volume plan's HIT workouts (typically the Tue/Thu/Sat workouts) since it sounds like it might be the extra amount of higher-intensity intervals that's exceeding what your body can positively adapt to.

I've often made the mistake of being on the bike 6-7 days/week because 3-4 of those days were lower-intensity work. Fact was, they were keeping me from recovering well enough for the next hard workout. I've learned to either stay off the bike, or more often, I won't work any harder than 60% FTP and for no longer than an hour - seems to be the right approach for me.

Good luck!

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [PMo] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
PMo wrote:
I'm in week 6 of the HIM specialty plan and really struggled with Sierra this morning. I barely completed Elwell last week, and that was coming off of a pretty easy week before that. But after a hard week 5, and decreasing rest intervals compared to Elwell, Sierra was too much and I skipped the second 5-minute interval. I'm expecting that Sonora next Tuesday will be even worse.

This is my second time through the entire HIM cycle this year (base-build-specialty) and these three workouts are the only ones that I've really consistently struggled with. Is this indicative or something that I'm lacking in my fitness and something that I need to work on, or is this just a really tough part of the plan that everyone has trouble with?

The biggest challenge with Sierra (and Elwell, Sonora, Adams) is the limited amount of recovery between intervals which is why these are reserved for a point in your season where your fitness is at its highest, both anaerobic and aerobic. But the fact is, you may be a bit too tired and not bouncing back quite enough during those short recovery valleys.

It's for this very reason I try to create alternate versions of these low-recovery workouts where I'll extend the rest periods to make the intervals more tolerable since you're more refreshed/replenished rolling into them.

If this is often an issue though, make sure that your amount of recovery (and its timing) is sufficient - you need to be rested and ready for your hard days.

Secondly, consider addressing your aerobic capacity (post-specialty) since recovery is a completely aerobic process meaning that if your aerobic capabilities are lacking, they can make it really difficult to repeat hard efforts with short recoveries between them - not something as high in importance for a steady-state triathlete as for a road racer but still possibly indicative of a fitness deficiency.

I'll make sure to add some alt versions of Elwell, Sonora & Sierra today (Adams already has one), but you can always do this really easily via our Workout Creator if you don't want to wait on me. ;)

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chadtimmerman wrote:
TriTamp wrote:
Hey Chad,

Thanks for all the great training plans. I've followed Base-Build-Specialty for my HIM this year. I've completed the Base and Build plans at Mid-Volume and am starting the Specialty this week. The Build Phase I actually hit a bit of a wall at about week 6 and had to take about a week over for fear I was overtraining. It seems the difference between the Low Volume and Mid Volume plans is not only in the avg number of hours per week but also total TSS per week but also for each of the individual workout the TSS is higher compared to the Mid Volume. I am wondering if it would be better for me to

a) Select Mid Volume workout which and possible occasionally drop one of the rides per week or lower intensity if I feel I need to or
b) Choose Low Volume and occasionally add a ride per week or just up workout intensity depending on how I feel.

I will note that I'm adding at least 1-2 swims above the plan so I'm swimming (or at least attempting to swim 4-5 times per week)

Part of me wants to just HTFU and choose the Mid Volume plan but the other part advises be smart and choose Low Volume and add intensity or workouts if I feel up to it.

Thoughts?


Making the call between H-ing TFU and paying attention to what your body can actually handle is all part of the never-ending learning process, but at least you're open to the possibility that the mid-volume plan may simply be too much stress for you (for the time being, anyway).

You can do a couple of things. The first is to choose the lower-volume plan and add TSS-fillers - workouts below .70 IF - to increase overall TSS without increasing the high-intensity aspect of your training. The other option is to move up to the higher-volume plan and remove some of that same type of workout, i.e. keep the bigger, high-intensity workouts but without the additional low-IF work that could be hampering your recovery.

There's also the mix-and-match approach where you use the higher-volume plan's structure but keep the lower-volume plan's HIT workouts (typically the Tue/Thu/Sat workouts) since it sounds like it might be the extra amount of higher-intensity intervals that's exceeding what your body can positively adapt to.

I've often made the mistake of being on the bike 6-7 days/week because 3-4 of those days were lower-intensity work. Fact was, they were keeping me from recovering well enough for the next hard workout. I've learned to either stay off the bike, or more often, I won't work any harder than 60% FTP and for no longer than an hour - seems to be the right approach for me.

Good luck!

Thanks for the feedback. I think I'm choosing the low volume plan and then add TSS fillers. Probably on the Friday similar to how the Mid volume is structured. I'll try that and see how it goes. This is all a learning experience for me. This is my 1st year of a more structured cycling program so I'm learning a lot about what my body can handle. Working towards my first IM next year so this was part of my plan this year to figure out what volume and intensity my body can handle.
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Hello TrainerRoad staff,

Thanks for the great program and awesome podcast. I don't think I would of been able to finish my first IM (Mont Tremblant) without the help of your program.

Now that I am done my A race, (while it didn't go anywhere as well as I had planned I still finished and the bike was the strongest portion) I have decided I am going to race another full again but this year it will be IMCA in Whistler

with the race being ~42 weeks away that gives plenty of time to sort out training and get a lot better, I am concerned with the bike on this course due to the large amount of climbs, so I want to be as strong of a cyclist as possible. (currently overweight and lower FTP, 2.4 W/kg goal would be to over 3w/Kg by winter time this year.

should I start with

Low Volume Full Base -> Low Volume Build then to Mid Volume Base -> Mid Volume Build -> Mid Volume Specialty

or

Sweet spot Base -> Sustained Power build -> (with my own swimming and running thrown in) -> then Mid Volume Base/Build/Specialty


Thanks again guys!!!!!!!
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chadtimmerman wrote:
The biggest challenge with Sierra (and Elwell, Sonora, Adams) is the limited amount of recovery between intervals which is why these are reserved for a point in your season where your fitness is at its highest, both anaerobic and aerobic. But the fact is, you may be a bit too tired and not bouncing back quite enough during those short recovery valleys.

It's for this very reason I try to create alternate versions of these low-recovery workouts where I'll extend the rest periods to make the intervals more tolerable since you're more refreshed/replenished rolling into them.

I find these workouts really challenging as well, so I'm glad to hear I'm not alone.

Chad - If one is really struggling to get through one of these, what is the best way to deal with it? Let's take Sierra as an example. Would it be better to (a) substitute Sierra-1, (b) do Sierra, but use a 10 second backspin in the middle of some of the intervals, (c) do Sierra, but cut one (or two) intervals short? Just wondering what you think is the best option to still get the most stimulus.

....even if the right answer is (d) HTFU :)
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [3DKiwi] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Hi!

I just got the powertap g3 hub. Will I still need the usb ant stick?


Love the Pain!

Quito-Ecuador
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [mpo_tri] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mpo_tri wrote:
Hi!

I just got the powertap g3 hub. Will I still need the usb ant stick?


Unless you're hub and computer both support bluetooth you will still need the ant+ usb stick for your hub to communicate your power output to your computer.
Last edited by: t_clay: Aug 31, 16 10:58
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [mpo_tri] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
mpo_tri wrote:
Hi!

I just got the powertap g3 hub. Will I still need the usb ant stick?

The newer Powertap G3 hubs are dual-band, so it can transmit data via BT as well as ANT+. If the device you're running TR on uses built-in Bluetooth then you're all set! If you're on a device that doesn't have native BT or you don't have the BLED112 USB Bluetooth dongle, then you'll need to get an ANT+ USB stick.

This link will take you to Amazon for an affordable option: Decooler ANT+ USB Stick

The older Powertap hubs were ANT+ only, so you'll want to double check and make sure it's the newer dual-band version if you plan on using BT.

Cheers!

Get Faster with TrainerRoad
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [Murph333] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Murph333 wrote:
Hello TrainerRoad staff,

Thanks for the great program and awesome podcast. I don't think I would of been able to finish my first IM (Mont Tremblant) without the help of your program.

Now that I am done my A race, (while it didn't go anywhere as well as I had planned I still finished and the bike was the strongest portion) I have decided I am going to race another full again but this year it will be IMCA in Whistler

with the race being ~42 weeks away that gives plenty of time to sort out training and get a lot better, I am concerned with the bike on this course due to the large amount of climbs, so I want to be as strong of a cyclist as possible. (currently overweight and lower FTP, 2.4 W/kg goal would be to over 3w/Kg by winter time this year.

should I start with

Low Volume Full Base -> Low Volume Build then to Mid Volume Base -> Mid Volume Build -> Mid Volume Specialty

or

Sweet spot Base -> Sustained Power build -> (with my own swimming and running thrown in) -> then Mid Volume Base/Build/Specialty


Thanks again guys!!!!!!!

Hey Murph,

I still think you have enough room for improvement that the Traditional Base route isn't the best fit - Sweet Spot Base is (especially if you're doing low-volume). And if you aren't using the tri plans but instead relying on your own swim & run workouts, the Sustained Power Build or the 40k TT plans are excellent ways to increase your higher-end endurance/FTP.

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [sjn] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
sjn wrote:
chadtimmerman wrote:
The biggest challenge with Sierra (and Elwell, Sonora, Adams) is the limited amount of recovery between intervals which is why these are reserved for a point in your season where your fitness is at its highest, both anaerobic and aerobic. But the fact is, you may be a bit too tired and not bouncing back quite enough during those short recovery valleys.


It's for this very reason I try to create alternate versions of these low-recovery workouts where I'll extend the rest periods to make the intervals more tolerable since you're more refreshed/replenished rolling into them.


I find these workouts really challenging as well, so I'm glad to hear I'm not alone.

Chad - If one is really struggling to get through one of these, what is the best way to deal with it? Let's take Sierra as an example. Would it be better to (a) substitute Sierra-1, (b) do Sierra, but use a 10 second backspin in the middle of some of the intervals, (c) do Sierra, but cut one (or two) intervals short? Just wondering what you think is the best option to still get the most stimulus.

....even if the right answer is (d) HTFU :)


There's always some level of just gutting things out, but it will become pretty evident when you simply can't rally the troops regardless of how much you may want to. In those cases, it's specific to the type of workout you're doing. Here are some typical recommendations:
  • If longer recoveries between intervals allow you to successfully complete the intervals, start there. Don't get crazy but a 2-minute recovery (like Sierra) extended to 3 minutes (custom modification via Workout Creator or simply pause the workout for an extra minute) can do wonders. Maybe even go as high as 5 minutes (Sierra -1) knowing that the emphasis shifts more toward capacity than repeatable power - not the worst thing when it comes to steady-state events like triathlon bike legs.

  • Backspins are almost always my preferred method during intervals longer than 2 minutes but with one caveat - you minimize them. For example, during 2- or 3-minute VO2max intervals, I'll allow myself a single, 10-second backpedal which makes me postpone it to the point I need it most (sometimes I get so close to the end of the interval I end up not needing it at all, but that carrot kept me motivated). Take no more than those 10 seconds and you're sure to miss almost none of the intended benefit because your HR, lactate levels, breathing, etc., will barely fall, but they will fall enough to reignite your "fire". Longer intervals --> more 10-second backpedals but it has to be reasonable, e.g. 5 minutes at 108% I might give myself 2 but I'll still postpone them as long as possible in hopes of only needing one or none.

  • I seldom recommend cutting intervals short because the duration is too often a key component of the sought-after stress the workout's about, not to mention it can be a sign that you've passed the point of productivity. Usually, early endings are a strong sign that it's time to call it a day - maybe not just a single early exit, but 2 or 3 and you have to start asking yourself "what's the point?". But as far as lopping off a couple intervals? Sure, maybe on a rough day, but only occasionally considering how many of the workouts achieve their overload by adding an extra interval each week. Skip that extra interval and you basically repeated last week's workout and dodged the intended progression and with it the intended training benefit.


Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Last edited by: chadtimmerman: Sep 6, 16 5:01
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks Chad. Really useful information here.

Appreciate all you guys' efforts in responding to your users questions.
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I just did my first TrainerRoad workout (not including the FTP test). That beast was harder than my Kinetic app workout. Anyway, I jumped into the middle of the Century mid volume plan. I am coming off a HIM on 8/6, and I have centuries in back-to-back weekends on 9/25 and 10/1. I am kind of winging it training wise, but I am also curious about guidance for tailoring a plan for a final build-out. I am planning an 80 mile ride Saturday on the road for the first long-ish distance since the HIM.

Any thoughts about a best way to jump into the middle of a training plan with just a few weeks to go before the rides? I started myself in week 5 of the 8 week plan.
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Hello Chad,
I have a question for you.
I am currently doing half Ironman specialty right now and in two weeks ill be going into off season to build my FTP as high as possible until the end of the year.
Before I decided to sign up for the half I finished low volume sweet spot and two weeks into sustain power and you recommended me to do 40K TT after. I gained 20w in 10weeks ish. Im going to take a week off easy after the race and build again after that.
Should I restart back to sweet spot after my half ironman and then do sustain power again or should I do sustain power again then 40k TT plan.
Thank you
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [exxxviii] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
exxxviii wrote:
I just did my first TrainerRoad workout (not including the FTP test). That beast was harder than my Kinetic app workout. Anyway, I jumped into the middle of the Century mid volume plan. I am coming off a HIM on 8/6, and I have centuries in back-to-back weekends on 9/25 and 10/1. I am kind of winging it training wise, but I am also curious about guidance for tailoring a plan for a final build-out. I am planning an 80 mile ride Saturday on the road for the first long-ish distance since the HIM.

Any thoughts about a best way to jump into the middle of a training plan with just a few weeks to go before the rides? I started myself in week 5 of the 8 week plan.

Since the nature of centuries is typically low-intensity/long-duration, I wouldn't worry too much about tapering for either of these events which makes that final recovery week totally adequate leading into your first of the two centuries.

Assuming you're still carrying a fair amount of aerobic endurance and you haven't been off the bike since your HIM, a combination of VO2max intervals and over-unders (i.e. weeks 5-8 of the Century plan) is a great way to touch up your fitness over the next few weeks.

Best of luck!

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [Iwant2gofast] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Iwant2gofast wrote:
Hello Chad,
I have a question for you.
I am currently doing half Ironman specialty right now and in two weeks ill be going into off season to build my FTP as high as possible until the end of the year.
Before I decided to sign up for the half I finished low volume sweet spot and two weeks into sustain power and you recommended me to do 40K TT after. I gained 20w in 10weeks ish. Im going to take a week off easy after the race and build again after that.
Should I restart back to sweet spot after my half ironman and then do sustain power again or should I do sustain power again then 40k TT plan.
Thank you


Sounds like you have 16-20 weeks to work on lifting your FTP, correct? The route you take will largely depend on how much fatigue you're carrying after your race, and while Sweet Spot Base isn't exactly a walk in the park, it's definitely more forgiving than the Sustained Power Build + 40k TT.

So I'd recommend doing SSB I and/or II followed by Sustained Power Build if you're a little cooked and could use a reduction in intensity, but if you're eager to be fit for something toward the end of this 16 to 20-week period (and you feel confident that you can handle a heavier workload), the Sustained Power Build + 40k TT plan is a workable plan sequence.

Good luck either way!

Head Coach at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast
Last edited by: chadtimmerman: Sep 6, 16 5:04
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [chadtimmerman] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chadtimmerman wrote:
Murph333 wrote:
Hello TrainerRoad staff,

Thanks for the great program and awesome podcast. I don't think I would of been able to finish my first IM (Mont Tremblant) without the help of your program.

Now that I am done my A race, (while it didn't go anywhere as well as I had planned I still finished and the bike was the strongest portion) I have decided I am going to race another full again but this year it will be IMCA in Whistler

with the race being ~42 weeks away that gives plenty of time to sort out training and get a lot better, I am concerned with the bike on this course due to the large amount of climbs, so I want to be as strong of a cyclist as possible. (currently overweight and lower FTP, 2.4 W/kg goal would be to over 3w/Kg by winter time this year.

should I start with

Low Volume Full Base -> Low Volume Build then to Mid Volume Base -> Mid Volume Build -> Mid Volume Specialty

or

Sweet spot Base -> Sustained Power build -> (with my own swimming and running thrown in) -> then Mid Volume Base/Build/Specialty


Thanks again guys!!!!!!!


Hey Murph,

I still think you have enough room for improvement that the Traditional Base route isn't the best fit - Sweet Spot Base is (especially if you're doing low-volume). And if you aren't using the tri plans but instead relying on your own swim & run workouts, the Sustained Power Build or the 40k TT plans are excellent ways to increase your higher-end endurance/FTP.

Hi there Trainerroad experts!

Apologies if this question has been asked ad nauseum but here is my challenge. I'm 50 weeks out from IM Mt (lots of time to develop as a cyclist of which I am a poor one). My FTP is really quite poor ~ 180 ish Male 45 and about 145 lbs. Nothing stellar but a good position on a tri bike and the results are ok and I generally make up on the run the positions I lose on the bike over a HIM.

All of that aside, I really, really want to increase my FTP over the winter. My aerobics are good and I have an independent swim program and running program to follow. If 4% increase a month is possible, that's really what I want to target. Continual improvement in power.

Do I use the Base program (mid-volume) or Build program (mid-volume) or something else? Will there be significantly better and bigger returns on high-volume plans?

Your insight is greatly appreciated.
Quote Reply
Re: Trainer road.com [Halfcrazy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Chad,
I'm interested in the response to this also, and was going to ask a similar question. You gave a fairly similar response to a previous question.
I think a blog post would be helpful about how to structure a 52 week year with your plans for a given A race.
The way it seems you've recommended is usually sweet spot base 1+2 then build +speciality +another build +speciality before finally build and speciality of plan for the 'A' race?
Much like the OP, I've got 52ish weeks till Ironman and (all things remaining equal) am thinking about the best way to use my (over) abundance of time.
I'm sure I (we) are over thinking it, but this is a forum filled with neurotic Type-A's. It would be helpful to have a good rule of thumb in place for stacking your plans.
Quote Reply

Prev Next