Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill

Apr 8, 14 7:07

Post #1 of 74 (9051 views)

It s my training partner, Tom Evans (4x ironman winner) that initiated me to the Band only swimming drill in 2004. He loved doing those and as we trained together...i had to get with the program! As i got back to my regular squad swims, my coach Joel Filliol decided to try a little experiment where i would swim with band only anytimes there is a pull set. So what ever the others do pulling..i would do with a band only. i believe the experiment lasted 6 months or so.

The interesting thing is, swimming with a band might sound hard...but it s highly technical and when you finally understand how to keep your body high on the water, it become rather easy to do so. I progressed to hold 1:20-25s/100m on longer sets of 400s and could swim 1500-2000m of it in practice with very little issue. Transferring those skill to my normal freestyle made a amazing difference in pace...it was definitely a precious tool for me as a athlete

Now standing on the pool deck as a coach, i have to say it s one of my favorite drill to use to teach triathlete to swim ''on top'' of the water, to kept a high turnover and be aware of any slippage in their catch.

I suggest you start with 50s at first as until you master the technical part... it can be a grueling effort. But remember... if you can apply those concept...the results can be spectacular for your every day swimming.

hope this video can help some of you! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cg-GB2_lPyI

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 7:12

Post #2 of 74 (9032 views)

YES!

Band is awesome.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 7:21

Post #3 of 74 (9008 views)

haha it is the Enforcer. Love it but have a long way to go.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 8:40

Post #4 of 74 (8918 views)

I am totally the first guy with a band. When I swim normal freestyle my body position seems great though. Is there still benefit? Band swimming seems odd for me, it is an advanced drill designed to help with something very basic...

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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 10:05

Post #5 of 74 (8809 views)

Being able to adapt to a band and then translate it to regular swimming is completely dependent on the physiology of the athlete. I started using them in 1985. I restarted using them 6 months ago. They are a great tool. But take a stick, hold your hands 3 feet apart. Can you bring the stick over your head without bending your arms? If not then you may want to grab a kick board, not a band.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 10:28

Post #6 of 74 (8773 views)

When you swim with band only, where do you where it? The pool I train at is coed, and I'm not sure how they'd feel if I didn't have my trunks on. I do want to get faster though.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [mortysct] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 12:25

Post #7 of 74 (8649 views)

i would say body position is at the base of swimming but not a basic concept. even advance swimmers can use it.

might not be for everyone.... But it s a drill of choice for my swimmers ;)

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 12:31

Post #8 of 74 (8638 views)

Another lover of the band ! I just wish more people had the faith to work through the first few hell-ish swims to glean the benefits.

Post deleted by Administrator [ In reply to ]

runner66

Apr 8, 14 12:37

Post #9 of 74 (8620 views)

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [runner66] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 12:46

Post #10 of 74 (8602 views)

try to kick drill first to really get your butt/back and legs up high. it s a technical issue and yes, much easier said than done. But the day you figure out how to apply the pressure, it does make a world of a difference!

also, keep the set short... perhaps some 25s repeat to start with 10-20 sec rest and build to 50s repeat as you get better at it.

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 13:19

Post #11 of 74 (8548 views)

ajthomas wrote:

But take a stick, hold your hands 3 feet apart. Can you bring the stick over your head without bending your arms? If not then you may want to grab a kick board, not a band.

Maybe I speak for others when I say that I'm not quite tracking.

You seem to be describing a shoulder abduction/flexion test and if I fail it I should kick more. Is the time with the kickboard supposed to help shoulder flexibility? I think I could see that but it seems like the long way around, so I guess I am missing something.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [runner66] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 14:27

Post #12 of 74 (8448 views)

runner66 wrote:

I bought one

They actually sell bands?!?! Old faithful is an old cut up and tied tube.

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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [Kevin in MD] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 15:36

Post #13 of 74 (8379 views)

Quote:

Maybe I speak for others when I say that I'm not quite tracking.

You seem to be describing a shoulder abduction/flexion test and if I fail it I should kick more. Is the time with the kickboard supposed to help shoulder flexibility? I think I could see that but it seems like the long way around, so I guess I am missing something.

Thanks - I was thinking the same thing and would love an explanation.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 15:39

Post #14 of 74 (8378 views)

Jonnyo, would you suggest using paddles with this drill or no?

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [runner66] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 16:34

Post #15 of 74 (8317 views)

runner66 wrote:

I bought one and tried it a few times. I can't get my legs off the bottom of the pool. Your video is great, but easier said than done. I will keep trying and see if I can make it a few yards without sinking. Since body position and balance are clearly my number one problem, I should keep working with the band.

It improves quickly. Start with a buoy+band, then once that's easy with NO kicking, go to band.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 18:10

Post #16 of 74 (8224 views)

ajthomas wrote:

Being able to adapt to a band and then translate it to regular swimming is completely dependent on the physiology of the athlete. I started using them in 1985. I restarted using them 6 months ago. They are a great tool. But take a stick, hold your hands 3 feet apart. Can you bring the stick over your head without bending your arms? If not then you may want to grab a kick board, not a band.

AJ - Can you elaborate a bit??? This sounds like a Zen koan as it is written...ah-so, my little buttercup, unless you can bring the stick over your head w/o bending your arms, you must use the kick board not the band.

"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 18:37

Post #17 of 74 (8181 views)

I'm going to venture a guess about what AJ is saying... If you have crappy shoulder flexibility, you can't get your arm straight out in front of you on entry, without that you are going to have a hard time getting good body position without a kick to keep your legs up. If you can't hold your arm out straight, your hand is going to be a foot under water as you stretch and get ready for the catch. All this time you are getting some major drag from it, so to compensate, you start your catch and pull early. This can work if you have a kick that allows you to maintain proper position by raising to your legs. If you put a band on someone like this, their legs just sink like crazy, so the only thing they can do it increase their turnover even further to now drag their legs behind them, hopefully a bit higher. So this person isn't learning proper body position, they are learning to turnover like crazy to keep their legs off the bottom rather than actual proper body position.

At least that is my guess.

Last edited by: steelerguy: Apr 8, 14 18:37

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 18:44

Post #18 of 74 (8168 views)

There are physical markers necessary to be successful with the windup doll approach. Not everyone has them. JohnnieOs shoulder and lower back flexibility is off the charts. Of course he excels with the band.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 18:46

Post #19 of 74 (8158 views)

I could never swim with a band. I might try it again, but I expect I'll have the same result.

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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [steelerguy] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 18:52

Post #20 of 74 (8148 views)

steelerguy wrote:

I'm going to venture a guess about what AJ is saying... If you have crappy shoulder flexibility, you can't get your arm straight out in front of you on entry, without that you are going to have a hard time getting good body position without a kick to keep your legs up. If you can't hold your arm out straight, your hand is going to be a foot under water as you stretch and get ready for the catch. All this time you are getting some major drag from it, so to compensate, you start your catch and pull early. This can work if you have a kick that allows you to maintain proper position by raising to your legs. If you put a band on someone like this, their legs just sink like crazy, so the only thing they can do it increase their turnover even further to now drag their legs behind them, hopefully a bit higher. So this person isn't learning proper body position, they are learning to turnover like crazy to keep their legs off the bottom rather than actual proper body position. At least that is my guess.

Hmmm, well, that sounds like a reasonable interpretation. I have good shoulder flex as it is very easy for me to do the "straight-arm stick test" with anywhere from a 1 foot ruler to a 4-ft long stick. Of course, this is prob b/c I've been swimming since age 5. OTOH, despite huge amounts of work on my kick over the years, my kick is still not very fast relative to my swimming speed, so I'm a light 4 to 6 beat kicker on freestyle and backstroke. On fly and breast, I kick as hard as possible just to get a good rhythm on these strokes, but breast is the only stroke where my kick makes big contribution, but I think this is true for almost everyone, just due to the nature of breaststroke. Anyway, thanks for the koan interpretation:)

"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [steelerguy] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 20:02

Post #21 of 74 (8087 views)

Exactly and really better than I could have examined it.

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 20:47

Post #22 of 74 (8043 views)

what would happen if you put a band on? are you saying you rely a lot on your kick?

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 21:12

Post #23 of 74 (8028 views)

My legs sink with a band, if I'm strict about not kicking. Eventually my toes are close to dragging on the bottom. That's with pushing my head down. It's really just how my body is built, I have a lot of buoyancy in my chest area and none in my legs, relatively speaking. Overall I'm a sinker. That said, the last time I swam with a band was almost 10 years ago, so I might revisit it to see if I can do it.

It isn't something I've ever really worried about. My legs stay up fine with not much of a kick, just a little flick, and I'm not a distance swimmer either. Also, I have a kick dominated stroke anyway, I'm at least 5 secs per 100 slower on pull sets, probably more like 8 secs pet 100, so it's not like I will ever race without kicking.

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Last edited by: JasoninHalifax: Apr 8, 14 22:11

Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 21:27

Post #24 of 74 (8014 views)

yep, i would see you as a typical kick dominant swimmer where kicking is a intergral and important part of your swimming.

I m at the opposite of the spectrum where kick isn't worth much for me. i developed into a pull swimmer. I can swim at race pace with a pull boey no problem. That said, i m exactly like you and my legs definitely sinking a lot with band only. The biggest factor is pressing down and hard with the chest...and having the core engage so everything else comes up!

not that it would make much of a difference for you in your swimming but it s a fun challenge to see if you can manage to get those legs up.... fun game in the pool!

Jonathan Caron / Professional Coach / ironman champions / age group world champions
Jonnyo Coaching
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Re: Swimming with Band only: my favorite drill [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]

Apr 8, 14 21:59

Post #25 of 74 (7990 views)

When I first started masters, my coach told me to look straight down at the bottom of the pool. This was to keep my hips/legs up. After several months, he told me to "Press the buoy" by relaxing my neck and pressing down with my chest instead. This has been extremely helpful to me. Is there a cue that I could work on with just a band. Right now I'm using a band with a buoy.

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