Figure out all the stuff you do different the week before a race, sounds like it is just races where this happens, and not training?

Many people drink too much water before races thinking they are hydrating, but reality is they are diluting their bodies minerals. It could have to do with your tapers, your pacing, not enough minerals, all sorts of things. I have had the same problem in the past, but once i took minerals with my water loading, never again. Saltstick is what I use, many others to choose from and experiment with..

I've also experienced severe cramping in my quads at various times over the past few years. It will generally start to happen about 5-15 minutes after starting a run, happens in one leg first and then the second leg very shortly after. Stretching it is very painful, and doesn't fix it. Walking is possible after it happens, but there is no hope of finishing the run, its over for the day. Soreness will then follow for the remainder of the day. This will happen at the beginning of each run for about a 2-4 day stretch, and then after that it is fine again.

One of these episodes occurred after feeling sick for a week, another couple episodes occurred after eating very very poorly for a couple of days, and another episode occurred after flying NA to Australia. I've tried researching why it was happening, and obviously no one really seems to know exactly why. I came across a suggestion to take magnesium supplements, and have found this to solve the issue for me, as during the last episode I was able to run fine again the next day after taking some. I now take a Mg supplement every day and it has never re-occurred. I don't think the "lack of fitness" theory applied to my case, as that doesn't explain why it occurs so early in my run, while at even a pretty easy pace, and then subsides after a few days. I believe it's due to an electrolyte imbalance, specifically the Mg, and that the imbalances were created from either the sickness or the massive amount of sodium from the bad eating.

Just my N=1, many people may suggest my thinking is wrong, but Mg might be worth a shot to see if it works for you.

Thank you Monty and Harapnuk.

I eat and live healthy, my blood results never showed a particular deficiency with the exception of the CPK values after those 3 occurrences.
I had enough saltsticks leading up to both races.

Would love to get the opinion from a doctor on this forum.

I am not a doctor but I'll toss in my 2 cents. This may sound far-fetched but may be worth considering.
There's a condition that occurs in horses called "Monday Morning Sickness" or azoturia or equine rhabdomyolysis. It typically happens in horses that have been worked hard during the week and then given a day off and fed the same amount of grain (carbs) as though they had worked that day. When they are put back into work the day after a rest day, they will almost immediately start to cramp up in their hindquarters, notably glutes and quads. If you do a blood draw of these horses they will be high in CPK. Here's a couple of links if you're interested in reading more: http://www.equi-therapy.net/...turia-symptoms.shtml or http://www.drgarfinkel.com/...ne-tying-up-syndrome. The theory is there is too much glycogen in the muscles brought on by over feeding of carbs with no work. Some vets also feel Vit E deficiency plays a part, as well as electrolyte imbalance.
You mentioned you worked hard for several months before your races--what were your tapers like and did you eat lots of carbs?

that is interesting.
i was just going to ask whether the cramping occurred each time after flying?

that could correlate with not running and over eating carbs...

I have had something similar happen with severe cramping in quads and its only happened when running downhill after a fast start in a race then usually starts after hitting the downhill portion of a trail running race. This has never happened when I'm running hard on a flat course with no hills. Sometimes it will even be an easy zone 2 run but I will be running on a trail that goes up and down. I think it has something to do with the running downhill part and eccentric contraction of leg muscles but I'm not 100% certain. The few times it has happened to me I have been in very good shape and well trained.

Let me know what you find out!

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"I swim because that's how I get to ride my bike."

Holy shit, that describes me to a tee ! I'm a horse and I never knew it.

Seriously, I've had exactly this problem for years. In my first tri season in 1988 I trained all summer, raced decently and then planned a big Tri before heading back to University. I tapered based on my own reading which was not much. I drove 14 hours to visit family in Chicago and planned to race in the Bud Light tri. During my shake out run on the day prior to the race my quads seized up for no good reason. I ran a bit more and went home. On race day I did ok on the bike, but my quads were cramping again for the whole run. I did not get a urinalysis, but based on how much my quads hurt I'm sure I had plenty of azotemia, azoturia and elevated CPKs.

Since then I changed my taper plan. I do reduce running volume, running as often as usual (4 /week), but not as long. I do the usual pick ups to race pace etc. I make sure that I include downhill running. I believe that my ability to tolerate eccentric contractions requires continual reinforcement. Lastly I avoid the treadmill too coming up to a race. The treadmill generates enough fatigue but does not stretch the muscles and I find that I'm more like to cramp on race day with too much treadmill time. If we believe Dr Garfinkel then the cause is the carbo-loading before the race. Over the years I have also decreased my carbohydrates pre-race in favor or my usual mixed diet.

FWIW, I am a doctor, but don't think it helps here.

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Brian
“Eat and Drink, spin the legs and you’re going to effin push (today).” A Howe

Check your calcium intake.

I think "the day or days of rest" --ie.: sitting on a plane, driving 14 hours (or even just a couple of hours), or in the case of horses, confined to a small stall, in conjunction with the carbs, shouldn't be overlooked as to why someone highly trained would cramp severely within a few minutes of starting to exercise.
The blood flow in the body and the mechanism of blood flow through pressure on the veins through muscle action and the oxygen crucial to aerobic glycogen metabolism could be significantly decreased after a day of "rest", so it could be there is not enough oxygenated blood in the muscles before beginning exercise; the glycogen begins to be metabolized anaerobically producing by-products that begin the cramping.

How was your training different from before your Boston qualifier?

I don't think taper and carb intake matter as I had in 3 different instances:
- first time hardly any exercise (rested because of stress fracture)
- second time IM LC super trained 100%
- last time Boston 75% of IM LC fitness

I took a flight hours before it happened in LA and IM LC, for Boston I took an intercontinental flight on Friday and travelled 7h on the train on Sunday, day before the race.
The sitting for hours is part of the problem, still something is missing in this puzzle....

So I had a similar experience yesterday at St Anthony's. Swam with the lead pack and hopped on the bike where my left quad massively cramped. Every pedal stroke hurt and I tried soft pedaling for a bit but it didn't help. Had to pull the plug a mile into the bike. Right leg was fine with no issues. I could barely put out 50 watts as I spun/coasted back to transition. It hurt to walk (I was limping), lifting the quad to my chest was painful and not happening, and I could only get my knee bent to 90 degrees to try to stretch it (couldn't even get my heel to my butt). I did some light foam rolling later in the day which definitely helped. It feels much better today but it is still tight. I probably could run/bike today but it's not worth the risk right now. Trying to figure out why this happened to me as this has never happened before. I did have some left calf tightness leading up to the race that I think is related. I'm 10 months post op from hip labral tear surgery (left). I still have some symptoms from surgery (mostly glute, hip, hamstring tightness). I think it's all related but my hip had felt actually normal leading up the race. I drank plenty of electrolytes/salt before the race (2 bottles of 6 scoops of EFS pro the morning of the race).


Curious to see other people's comments

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Am going through a similar thing at the moment. Has been going on for about a year.

Flew to a 70.3 May of 2015 and went for a run about 24 hrs after arriving. Flight and car journey meant 6hrs sitting on day of travel and run was a light trot evening before the event. Bam, right quad went in what I'll call a massive cramp only because that's the closest description I have. Massage, rolling and rest that night. Bit better by morning but still dodgy. Got through the swim but by the end I had full on "cramp" again and now going down into LHS adductors. Pulled out at the end of mile 1 of the bike. Too painful and couldn't get any power down. Saw Dr when I got home and general non-specific "we don't know" diagnosis. Wrote it off as one of those things that happens. Was a bummer though as was as fit and strong as I have ever been.

Had a couple of weeks off and back to training. Sometimes smaller cramps in quad on training runs (usually after or during a down hill or just after a mid-run break within a couple of mins of starting up again) but always able to stretch them off. Did a HIM in August in a new PB even though I was full of cold. Also did a half marathon in a new PB in Sept. coming off the back of a cold. Not aiming at a backdoor brag here just to say that things seemed back on track.

Then ran a marathon in late Nov (no cold this time!) and was on track for a good time and then at 13miles in started to get quad twinges. By 30km marker full on cramps in both quads and I was down to the ultra-marathoner's shuffle as I couldn't really bend the legs properly without lots of pain. Finished (not gloriously) and by this time was having problems raising the legs to go up stairs as quads were so unhappy with me. Saw Dr the following day and got MRI scan done which showed I had a fair bit of internal bleeding in the quads. So, a month off for me and then slowly getting back into it with regular physio and massage and pretty regular foam rolling as well.

All pretty much good until March when I really opened up and went for a good time in a hilly 5k. Got half way through and felt the quads start to go. So, shut it down and trotted to the finish and off to the Dr's the next day. Acupuncture and massage again. An ultrasound showing a bit of muscle tearing but not too bad. Rest of that week off and since then I've been foam rolling quads and ITB for 10-20mins every day in addition to the normal regime.

Am back to running reasonably again - can run 2hrs at a fairly easy pace (say just under 5min/km) with a fairly hard bike sessions the day before no problem. Ran a low 19min flat 5km on the weekend in the middle of a longer / easier effort of 25km just gone so some progress. But, I can "feel" it's still not right and that if I really try and go for it things might get interesting again.

Have had a vascular scan, blood work, ultrasound in the last week and results back today and everything has come back fine although apparently a bit low on Vit D (so some supplements to take now). Aside from that Dr's seem not to have many solid thoughts on what it all might be. Ultrasound showed a bit of fluid at knee and hip so "maybe" something to do with ITB but not enough that the Dr thinks it's anything but pretty typical and certainly not enough that he thinks he's found a likely cause.

So, as of today I'm starting taking Vit D supplements and back to Dr in a month. Can you say frustrated!

Will be really interested to see if anyone comes up with anything on this thread that might help answer the "what's causing this to happen" question.


Cheers

I've had a similar inexplicable cramping issue with my glutes. Happened in several races and nobody can help. Now, I'm just prepared for it to happen and just ride though it until it gets better (20-40 minutes)

I think that "horse theory" above is the closest I've seen to a plausible cause. The only thing in common with all my occurrences is a hard training block followed by a complete day off, maybe 2. The other thing in common has been massage too close to race day (less than 5 days before). Or maybe a combo of the 2.

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Not a Dr either, but being a former horse person that had a mare that tied up, that was my first thought upon reading. I spent hours pouring over spreadsheets analyzing her nutrition. CPK values would be through the roof after an episode. She's also loose a good bit of muscle mass after a bad episode. Vitamin E supplementation, Mg supplementation and a lower glycemic diet seemed to help her the most. Stress was definitely a contributor. Alas, I couldn't talk her into trying any yoga ; )

https://www.triplecrownfeed.com/articles/tyingup-feeding-avoid-tying-up/

I've decided mine were partly a combination of lack of specificity in training, exceeding my available fitness. The muscles simply became fatigued neurologically. Mineral/chemical deficiencies could be a contributor as they directly impact nervous system function. But it's not simple. I had minimal cramping in very very hot Kona, but some cramping in a very cool marathon but eased off, and it went away and didn;t return.

I can have cramping in the middle of a race, but work through it and still be able to pick up the pace and sprint to the finish.

I frequently have some cramping off the bike in a 70.3 and bad cramps in my hip flexors after the swim and through out the race is I try and stop and lift my leg up.... but can run just fine.

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http://www.trainingbible.com

hi Lachlan73, No sign in your blood work of high CPK?

Will let you know - Dr has the results go direct to him and so I'm waiting for them to be sent on to me. Hopefully get them next week ...

how high were your cpk levels?

Got blood work done yesterday.... 24 hours after race. Cpk was 5297. I'm honestly not sure if that number is too high or not (given the effort during the race).

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What is your
race/ethnicity
sex
height
weight
what race/activity did you do 24 hrs prior?

All that affects CPK.

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Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.

29 years old
White male
5"10
165 lbs
Extremely fit/athletic (under 2 hours olympic distance)

Raced an Olympic distance Sunday. Swam in the lead pack, got through transition and hopped on the bike where I instantly got a massive left quad cramp. Could barely pedal with my left leg. Spun/coasted for a mile and turned back around and headed to transition (DNF).

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That CK is high. Possibly from the cramp.

Strenuous activity can increase CK that high in a male for 3 days after, so it could also be high if you had a run/bike 1-2 days prior to your race.

The cramp itself may have caused that much CK elevation (sounds like was pretty painful)

To know if you have any abnormal CK elevation at baseline, you would have to wait several weeks, and then not do any exercise for 3 days prior to the lab test.

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Two wheels good. Four wheels bad.

I have had this happen to me too many times as well. A few times in races and a few times just after rest or travel days. The worst part about mine is they seem to stay with for a few days and don't let me train during that time. After it happened at a race I talk to Matt Fitzgerald and he said that he has heard that sometimes the body basically goes into "repair" mode when resting, especially after hard training, and the brain signals the muscles to not go hard because it is protecting the muscles and allowing them to prepare.

The horse theory combined with this one seem like exactly what is going on with me. I am just happy I am not the only one experiencing it. I just hope it doesn't happen again because it is so frustrating!

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