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Re: Secondhand Dimond [buck_shot11] [ In reply to ]
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buck_shot11 wrote:
You are putting to much on the manufacturer. Their primary interest is selling new bikes and I get that. You can ask any primary Dimond owner and they will ALL say that the customer service is second to none!

Well it has been. Because they're new. And boutique. But at some point they're going to have to transition to a more mature business model that takes into account secondary owners. Supporting secondary owners is also essentially supporting the primary owner. Because if a secondary owner can't reasonably maintain a bike, the primary's sale value will plummet. And because secondary owners are just as much unpaid Dimond marketing personnel as the primary owner. And I have noticed used Dimonds for sale popping up pretty frequently, so this transition may take place sooner rather than later.

I'm not going to pile on because Dimond is new at this. And it's tough to say if a 100% surcharge for "full retail price" over "replacement price" is reasonable or not. Typical "crash replacement" cost is about a 50% discount. Tough to say if $600 is indicative of a "wholesale" price, and it's just really expensive to manufacture. Or if $600 is already fairly well padded with a retail margin, and $1200 is just a dis-incentive because Dimond is selling all the forks they can on new bikes.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [trail] [ In reply to ]
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just a miss quoted price.. based on the review/ad someone posted the correct price is $1200 (for everyone).. everyone has fine print these days and basically miss priced items don't necessary have to be honored. I've ordered a number of parts/items online knowing the deal was too good to be true. I've gotten some of them and others were cancelled by the seller, stating mis-priced or print errors. I don't sweat it.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [ericlambi] [ In reply to ]
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ericlambi wrote:
getbarreled wrote:
How do you go from "he says your weren't upfront and are trying to weasel a deal", to "I misread and his original email coroberates everything you said."

WHAT?

The e-mail was speed typed on his phone with some massive spelling mistakes, which caused me to interpret him saying something different than what he was saying. Basically, I thought he said he spent a lot of time on the phone with you before you told him you bought the bike second hand, but he in fact said that he spent a lot of time on the phone with you before you bought the bike second hand. Again, my apologies with regards to that misinterpretation. Brad certainly never charged you with being a weasel, that was me. I stand by my general criticisms of you muckraking Dimond over a simple pricing mistake: the fact that you started this thread is completely ridiculous.

If you want to ignore specific parts of the story so you can dilute it down to "they made a pricing error" knock yourself out. That's altered reality but if that's how you want to roll go for it.

"I've never sold a fork to a non-customer, and I don't plan to start anytime soon."
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [trail] [ In reply to ]
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I think this is a great example of why businesses, especially newer ones, need a social media strategy/rapid response team. This post has festered for quite some time.

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Re: Secondhand Dimond [spntrxi] [ In reply to ]
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spntrxi wrote:
just a miss quoted price..

If we take the OP at his word, it wasn't a misquoted price. The only fork price when he called was $600. And that's what he was quoted. Then it sounds like Dimond realized after the call that his was the first secondary-owner purchase of a fork, and that the $600 was something that's like the equivalent of a "crash replacement" price, and not appropriate as a full retail price. So they created a brand new price structure.

That was my interpretation, taking the OP at face value.

Nothing wrong with that, really. Forgiveable, in my opinion, given the newness of the whole situation.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
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The price should be the price. I hate buying anything that is a different price for different people.
Last edited by: cbump: Apr 8, 17 16:23
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [cbump] [ In reply to ]
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Almost everything is different prices for different people.

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Re: Secondhand Dimond [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
buck_shot11 wrote:
You are putting to much on the manufacturer. Their primary interest is selling new bikes and I get that. You can ask any primary Dimond owner and they will ALL say that the customer service is second to none!

Well it has been. Because they're new. And boutique. But at some point they're going to have to transition to a more mature business model that takes into account secondary owners. Supporting secondary owners is also essentially supporting the primary owner. Because if a secondary owner can't reasonably maintain a bike, the primary's sale value will plummet. And because secondary owners are just as much unpaid Dimond marketing personnel as the primary owner. And I have noticed used Dimonds for sale popping up pretty frequently, so this transition may take place sooner rather than later.

I'm not going to pile on because Dimond is new at this. And it's tough to say if a 100% surcharge for "full retail price" over "replacement price" is reasonable or not. Typical "crash replacement" cost is about a 50% discount. Tough to say if $600 is indicative of a "wholesale" price, and it's just really expensive to manufacture. Or if $600 is already fairly well padded with a retail margin, and $1200 is just a dis-incentive because Dimond is selling all the forks they can on new bikes.

Trail, I don't think you could be any more on the money. I get that Brad doesn't know me from Adam, and I tried to tastefully share a little bit about myself to hopefully let him know that I fiercely promote the brands I believe in and was already totally sold out on Dimond. His response was "I'm sure you're influential but we get a lot of that" which I totally understand. It's probably annoying as hell having everybody and their mother telling you that they're the next coolest thing and they're going to sell so many bikes for you. And at the end of the day there's no way for him to really know whether or not I would help to drive sales for their brand. I know that I would, because that's just how I roll, and like you said, first second or third hand owners are all equal when it comes to promoting the bike that they are on. I'm the president and founder of a quickly growing tri club and there's no one as best I can tell for 100 miles on one of these bikes. Also, my club is in an extremely affluent area where people blow money on bikes at an insane level. It would have behooved them to get this bike out on the road and looking sharp.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [getbarreled] [ In reply to ]
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Does anyone have any access to published pricing for any of the stuff from them? As best I can tell, there's nothing in writing which tends to fuel the feeling that they're pulling numbers out of their butt.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [getbarreled] [ In reply to ]
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getbarreled wrote:
Does anyone have any access to published pricing for any of the stuff from them? As best I can tell, there's nothing in writing which tends to fuel the feeling that they're pulling numbers out of their butt.

No, but I can tell you that as a customer that bought new from them, they treated me extremely well on pricing for the parts I wanted to buy from them.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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JasoninHalifax wrote:
Almost everything is different prices for different people.

And I hate it.



After further reading it seems like the price of the fork is always 1200 bucks. I don't know who Brad is but he sounds like the owner. How does the owner not know the price of his products?
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [cbump] [ In reply to ]
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cbump wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
Almost everything is different prices for different people.

And I hate it.



After further reading it seems like the price of the fork is always 1200 bucks. I don't know who Brad is but he sounds like the owner. How does the owner not know the price of his products?

"Director of sales and marketing" I would feel that the same question would apply, possibly even more so.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [getbarreled] [ In reply to ]
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getbarreled wrote:
Does anyone have any access to published pricing for any of the stuff from them? As best I can tell, there's nothing in writing which tends to fuel the feeling that they're pulling numbers out of their butt.

They actually send an itemized list of everything on the bike when you order it.

Literally it will say:

Frame $XXXX
Fork $XXXX
Paint $XXX
Aerobars $XXX
Crankset $XXX
RD $XXX
FD $XXX
Cassette $XX
etc.

Although I'm sure fork isn't listed separately any longer since it's already included with the Brilliant or Marquise.

2018 Races:
Oceanside 70.3, Oceanside, CA, April 7th | Ironman Texas, The Woodlands, TX, April 28th | Finland 70.3, Lahti, Finland, June 30th | Jonkoping 70.3, Jonkoping, Sweden, July 8th | Waco 70.3, Waco, TX, October 28th

Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:

I can't speak for Eric on this one but Dimond has a secret Facebook page that Brad pretty much runs. Any of us who are members of the secret page can get in touch with Brad quite easily. Plus any of us that have bought a Dimond probably have Brad's email info. He's very easy to contact.


You would know all this if you were an original owner!

^ That's a joke by the way :-)

I'm not buying a bike from any company that has a secret Facebook page for bike owners. That just screams "we're exclusive and we're better than everyone."

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Re: Secondhand Dimond [cbump] [ In reply to ]
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cbump wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
Almost everything is different prices for different people.


And I hate it.



After further reading it seems like the price of the fork is always 1200 bucks. I don't know who Brad is but he sounds like the owner. How does the owner not know the price of his products?

TJ Tollakson is the owner. Brad basically runs the business side. He's well aware of the pricing.

2018 Races:
Oceanside 70.3, Oceanside, CA, April 7th | Ironman Texas, The Woodlands, TX, April 28th | Finland 70.3, Lahti, Finland, June 30th | Jonkoping 70.3, Jonkoping, Sweden, July 8th | Waco 70.3, Waco, TX, October 28th

Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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BryanD wrote:
The GMAN wrote:


I can't speak for Eric on this one but Dimond has a secret Facebook page that Brad pretty much runs. Any of us who are members of the secret page can get in touch with Brad quite easily. Plus any of us that have bought a Dimond probably have Brad's email info. He's very easy to contact.


You would know all this if you were an original owner!

^ That's a joke by the way :-)


I'm not buying a bike from any company that has a secret Facebook page for bike owners. That just screams "we're exclusive and we're better than everyone."

They have a regular Facebook page for peons like yourself. :-)

2018 Races:
Oceanside 70.3, Oceanside, CA, April 7th | Ironman Texas, The Woodlands, TX, April 28th | Finland 70.3, Lahti, Finland, June 30th | Jonkoping 70.3, Jonkoping, Sweden, July 8th | Waco 70.3, Waco, TX, October 28th

Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
cbump wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
Almost everything is different prices for different people.


And I hate it.



After further reading it seems like the price of the fork is always 1200 bucks. I don't know who Brad is but he sounds like the owner. How does the owner not know the price of his products?

TJ Tollakson is the owner. Brad basically runs the business side. He's well aware of the pricing.

Then how did he quote 600 for a 1200 dollar part?
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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BryanD wrote:
The GMAN wrote:


I can't speak for Eric on this one but Dimond has a secret Facebook page that Brad pretty much runs. Any of us who are members of the secret page can get in touch with Brad quite easily. Plus any of us that have bought a Dimond probably have Brad's email info. He's very easy to contact.


You would know all this if you were an original owner!

^ That's a joke by the way :-)


I'm not buying a bike from any company that has a secret Facebook page for bike owners. That just screams "we're exclusive and we're better than everyone."

They have two FB sites, one public site for ruster sports, and one owners page (the 'secret' group). Is that such a big deal?
I can tell you, as a member of the 'secret' group, you aren't missing any secrets...lol. Its a group of rather happy owners that post pics, see who's going to what race, have some opportunities to get in on some gear orders, etc.

Despite him possibly making a mistake, I'm glad Brad didn't sell the discounted fork. Again, that would come across as pretty unfair to other owners that paid over double for the fork. And the sales they might have gained by selling to a tri club president that lives in a wealthy area, they may have lost from the loss of referral sales from current owners who wonder why purchasers of used frames get a better deal on parts.

OP - if this is a frame you really wanted, then slap that 3T fork on it and some nice brakes, Tririgs, or maybe a cool setup with Magura's (difficult, but possible I believe), and ride it. You can always resell down the road.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [cbump] [ In reply to ]
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600 was the price for ORIGINAL owners to UPGRADE to the new fork. At least that was always my understanding - I don't speak for Ruster Sports.
It sounds like he made a mistake, it happens.
Last edited by: SBRcoffee: Apr 8, 17 17:06
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [SBRcoffee] [ In reply to ]
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 It's been a hard call for me because frankly I love the shit out of the bike. Brad's whole attitude towards the situation made it very evident that I was a second-class citizen to them and I just can't roll with that.

Like I've said a few times in this thread. I could deal with them making a mistake and not even being willing to honor the price, but be cool about it, own up to it, make me feel like you give a shit. That didn't happen at all.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [getbarreled] [ In reply to ]
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If this thread taught me anything it's never buy a Dimond. Gross.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [getbarreled] [ In reply to ]
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As was mentioned by another poster, the price was always $1200. I contacted them when they first came out, with money in hand, and ended up not purchasing due to the wait time involved. A P5-3 fork was a great alternative for $200 off of eBay, and maybe 2 hours of bondo work.

I have purchased a seat post from them in the past (for $100, which seemed crazy low) for my used Dimond (also from the Pros Closet) that was actually broken at the seat clamp area. They knew the bike had been repaired, and did not have any qualms about supplying me with additional parts. The service I received from them has always been top notch, despite them not knowing my pedigree wrt carbon refurbishment. I have dealt with other companies that did not want me fixing broken carbon and would not sell me parts to support that end.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [chicanery] [ In reply to ]
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 That was how it initially seemed like the exchange was going to go for me. Then it veered. I'm honestly glad that you had a better experience than I did.
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Re: Secondhand Dimond [James Haycraft] [ In reply to ]
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James Haycraft wrote:
ericlambi wrote:
2. You feel entitled to get the fork at the misquoted price. Can you elaborate on why you feel Dimond should 'own [their] fuck up' for your benefit?

Customers think along those lines quite frequently actually.

In California, we have every right to think along those lines (I don't know that it extends to verbal price quotes, but it's in the same ballpark):

Quote Quoting California B&P Code, 12024.2.

(a) It is unlawful for any person, at the time of sale of a commodity, to do any of the following:
(1) Charge an amount greater than the price, or to compute an amount greater than a true extension of a price per unit, that is then advertised, posted, marked, displayed, or quoted for that commodity.

(2) Charge an amount greater than the lowest price posted on the commodity itself or on a shelf tag that corresponds to the commodity, notwithstanding any limitation of the time period for which the posted price is in effect.
(b) A violation of this section is a misdemeanor punishable by a fine of not less than twenty-five dollars ($25) nor more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), by imprisonment in the county jail for a period not exceeding one year, or by both, if the violation is willful or grossly negligent, or when the overcharge is more than one dollar ($1).

(c) A violation of this section is an infraction punishable by a fine of not more than one hundred dollars ($100) when the overcharge is one dollar ($1) or less.

(d) As used in subdivisions (b) and (c), "overcharge" means the amount by which the charge for a commodity exceeds a price that is advertised, posted, marked, displayed, or quoted to that consumer for that commodity at the time of sale.

(e) Except as provided in subdivision (f), for purposes of this section, when more than one price for the same commodity is advertised, posted, marked, displayed, or quoted, the person offering the commodity for sale shall charge the lowest of those prices.

(f) Pricing may be subject to a condition of sale, such as membership in a retailer-sponsored club, the purchase of a minimum quantity, or the purchase of multiples of the same item, provided that the condition is conspicuously posted in the same location as the price.[/indent]

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Re: Secondhand Dimond [aerobean] [ In reply to ]
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TL;DR version

Guy buys a bike from a third party that doesn't work, wants the part from Dimond for half price when its only available at full price, cries online because he's not getting his own way in the hope they'll cave.

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