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Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride
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rappstar and i were talking about this. the one we have now gets a pretty good turnout, maybe 80 or 90 riders? it's basically a group workout, a "rubber band" ride, that is, if you keep pedaling you can't get dropped. it's a stiff workout, but it's for all abilities, that is, it's gauged to your ability.

this ride takes place 4pm pacific time on tuesdays. i rode my second of these yesterday. my first was kind of disastrous for a number of self-inflicted reasons, which is fine, because zwift takes a few rides to get used to. you've got to spend a little time familiarizing, even tho we have a 6-part series which i assiduously followed on slowtwitch (i still refer back to it, and did today).

anyway, what we have going now is a great ride. i intend to be a regular. in my lead up to riding this ride, during the 2 times i've ridden it, i failed to variously: 1) join the ride; 2) find the ride after i joined it; 3) correctly ride it; 4) figure out how to text during it; 5) understand how to text by voice during it;

and so on. but no problem. yesterday's ride was great, lots of fun, great workout, glad i did it, will be back next week hell or high water.

the question is, do we need a second ride and, if so, what should it be? what and when? a harder ride? an easier ride? a conversational ride? a workout? a race? the distance? the format?

suggestions? (once i have some input, i may make this into a poll.)

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I have done a couple of the ST workouts and "enjoyed" them. It would be nice to have a casual-ish steady-state group ride as well just for some variation. USMES has weekly rides that have a beacon leader and beacon sweeper and everyone does really well staying within the group (there are always a few "flyers", but the leader just lets them go). I believe these rides are usually around 2.5 w/kg with climbs up to about 3 w/kg. Some other group rides will allow sprints and then everyone regroups on the beacon after the segment.

ETA: There were a little over 100 of us last night: https://www.strava.com/activities/1418134652

VDOT O2 Run Coaching
Team INFINIT Discount Code: RowanJones
Last edited by: Rowan Jones: Feb 21, 18 11:16
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Rowan Jones] [ In reply to ]
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Rowan Jones wrote:
I have done a couple of the ST workouts and "enjoyed" them. It would be nice to have a casual-ish steady-state group ride as well just for some variation. USMES has weekly rides that have a beacon leader and beacon sweeper and everyone does really well staying within the group (there are always a few "flyers", but the leader just lets them go). I believe these rides are usually around 2.5 w/kg with climbs up to about 3 w/kg. Some other group rides will allow sprints and then everyone regroups on the beacon after the segment.

ETA: There were a little over 100 of us last night: https://www.strava.com/activities/1418134652

actually, i consider a 2.5w/kg ride, if more than 45min, pretty stiff ;-(

but thanks, keep the ideas coming. i take it that this is not a normalized ride, in erg mode? you can either go forward or backward? i like that, as long as the ride is relatively mild.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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:-) Correct. The USMES (and similar) rides are non-ERG so you control your own effort. Stronger riders will sometimes drop back and pull stragglers back to the pack. The lead will also have us drop to 2.0 to allow a regroup if necessary. I like the USMES ride in particular because I'm former military, but mostly because everyone seems to follow the lead's instructions better than most other groups (imagine that!).

VDOT O2 Run Coaching
Team INFINIT Discount Code: RowanJones
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Yesterday's workout was a killer...and that's why I vote yes for a second one....mo suffering.

Also, I like the variety of workouts. I get stuck in a rut sometimes and it's cool to see how Pros structure their training and the reasons they do it.

"Good genes are not a requirement, just the obsession to beat ones brains out daily"...the Griz
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [stringcheese] [ In reply to ]
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okay, so...

1. erg mode, or drop possible?
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together?
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what?
4. how long, timewise?
5. what day?
6. what time?

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Can we add a SlowTwitch weekly race instead of another workout?

1. race = drop
2. race = every man for himself
3. race
4. 45-60 mins
5. Wednesday?
6. Evening, Pacific time

---------------------------------------------
Of course it hurts. The trick is not minding it hurts.
Last edited by: maukiwauw: Feb 21, 18 16:51
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
okay, so...

1. erg mode, or drop possible?
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together?
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what?
4. how long, timewise?
5. what day?
6. what time?

1. Drop possible...or a race. Been on Zwift for 3 years, but I haven't bought into the group workout thing quite yet. Tried one once, but hated the 15 mph flat ride that got posted to Strava. Yeah, I'm vain that way. Judge away.
2. Leaders are good. Let the fliers go.
3. Stiff workout is good. Even if it's too hard for me, a second pack will form and I tag along.
4. 1 hr if on a weekday. 2 hrs if on weekend. Anyone can always drop out if they only want to do the first hour.
5. You're gonna get 7 different answers for what day of the week works best, so just choose one.
6. Same thing as above, so pick a time. Personaly, I cant do a ride from 10am to 6pm MST because of work.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Haven't had a chance to try current ride (time doesn't work for me) so I'd like a second offering. Maybe a harder weekend ride?
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [maukiwauw] [ In reply to ]
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maukiwauw wrote:
Can we add a SlowTwitch weekly race instead of another workout?

1. race = drop
2. race = every man for himself
3. race
4. 45-60 mins
5. Wednesday?
6. Evening, Pacific time

Yes!...The ST Weekly World Championships.

Does Zwift have the capabilities to break out the competitor's by w/kg?

"Good genes are not a requirement, just the obsession to beat ones brains out daily"...the Griz
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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1. erg mode, or drop possible? Don't care
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together? Don't care
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what? Stiff
4. how long, timewise? 1 hour weekday. 2 if weekend.
5. what day? Don't care
6. what time? Don't care

Where is the info for the Tuesday ride? Pretend I have not logged into Slowtwitch more than 5 times since Christmas, because that's probably accurate.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Race series.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Not your target market, but since you asked. I would not do a group ride. I don't do them "outside" either. The one thing I HATE about Zwift is drafting.

Fortunately a fellow S-T'er told me about using a TT bike so I would not get a benefit of drafting. I'm enjoying Zwift a lot more now. I was close to canceling my membership. Where do I send me $10 for that one piece of advice :)

Now if I could get details of past rides, (i.e. average watts) that would be a huge improvement to Zwift.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Rowan Jones] [ In reply to ]
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I have done a similar Social ride with a Dutch group and really enjoyed it.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [TryScott] [ In reply to ]
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TryScott wrote:
1. erg mode, or drop possible? Don't care
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together? Don't care
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what? Stiff
4. how long, timewise? 1 hour weekday. 2 if weekend.
5. what day? Don't care
6. what time? Don't care

Where is the info for the Tuesday ride? Pretend I have not logged into Slowtwitch more than 5 times since Christmas, because that's probably accurate.

it's called "Slowtwitch Indoor" and it takes place at 4pm Pacific time every tuesday. it's mostly in erg mode, which is fine for me, because i happen to have a campy cassette on the bike i'm using, which is on a smart trainer that has a shimano cassette body. in erg mode you don't really need to shift, so i can find a gear and i'm good.

it's pretty much no drop, and your workout is scaled to your ability. so i was riding along at 2.5w/kg, others were at 3-something, others lower than i was. but you do have to do the workout. it's an interval workout. but it changes every week i think. you should be able to find it no trouble.

my thinking is maybe a friday workout for the second workout. thur or fri.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Drop ride, but with a gentle (not 5 minutes at 450W) start. 30 miles, up the mountains.

UK evening time.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [RCCo] [ In reply to ]
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RCCo wrote:
UK evening time.
^^^^
This.

4PM Pacific time is Midnight in UK, and 1AM in Spain (and most of western Europe).

Sr. Salitre
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I’m a big proponent of zwift racing as I’ve said on here before

So I think it’d be fun to have a slowtwitch race series. Maybe make it a TT series which i don’t think exist

I don’t enjoy the slow group rides, although would join for a bit to support you and the community as you launched.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [mvenneta] [ In reply to ]
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mvenneta wrote:
I’m a big proponent of zwift racing as I’ve said on here before

So I think it’d be fun to have a slowtwitch race series. Maybe make it a TT series which i don’t think exist

I don’t enjoy the slow group rides, although would join for a bit to support you and the community as you launched.

my sense, right now, is maybe a thursday morning (pacific time) ride, maybe 10am. for an hour. that would move it to:

6pm UK time
7pm spain time
1pm east coast US time
noon chicago, dallas, houston time

i think i'll throw this up in a poll.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I'd be really into racing as a group on Zwift. But 4pm Pacific as the first ride is? I live in California and unfortunately am not independently wealthy enough to be free at 4pm on a weekday.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
okay, so...



1. erg mode, or drop possible?
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together?
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what?
4. how long, timewise?
5. what day?
6. what time?

I use Zwift at least twice a week, often more but I haven't done any of the ST Zwift rides to date since I'm in Ireland and don't like starting rides at midnight.
I'd be very interested in taking part if there was a new group ride starting some time between 18:00 & 20:00 on weekdays or 08:30 & 11:00 at the weekend. I might even contemplate early morning rides but the window would be narrower so probably a poor option to facilitate European riders in 2 or 3 time zones.
  1. Drop possible. I think this is a lot of what makes Zwift more motivating for many of us than just staring at a power figure.
  2. Leaders - preferably 2, each riding different paces (see no.3)
  3. My preference would be a group ride. One leader setting a reasonably stiff pace (say 2.5-3.0W/kg) with the second facilitating another group about 0.5W/kg down for anyone who plans a slower pace. This also to provide a fallback option for anyone who gets dropped from the front to re-group.
  4. 60-80mins on weekdays or 80-120mins at the weekend.
  5. Preferably Thursday evening or Saturday morning (GMT)
  6. Starting between 18:00 and 20:00 GMT on weekdays or 08:30 and 11:00 GMT on weekends

I would also suggest including an optional race that kicks off near the end of the ride for those interested.
Several of the existing group rides do this and I think it works well. The group leader picks a distance to go or a landmark where the race will commence. For example it might start at 4km to go. Anyone who wants to race has to ensure they are behind the leader for the race start. When the appointed point is reached the leaders gives the word and anyone interested goes for it. Everyone else can continue to the finish at a steady pace if they prefer. I think this works well.
The race serves a couple of purposes. Mostly, it's fun and satisfying if you're feeling up to it and it fits with your training goals. But it may also discourage some competitive flyers from breaking up the group early on. If they fancy a race they need to be back behind the leader towards the end, and won't want to have burnt all their matches. That might keep the group together for longer which tends to make it more enjoyable IMO.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [stringcheese] [ In reply to ]
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stringcheese wrote:
maukiwauw wrote:
Can we add a SlowTwitch weekly race instead of another workout?

1. race = drop
2. race = every man for himself
3. race
4. 45-60 mins
5. Wednesday?
6. Evening, Pacific time


Yes!...The ST Weekly World Championships.

Does Zwift have the capabilities to break out the competitor's by w/kg?
Yes. Plenty rides are set up with different categories based on W/kg.
Zwift uses categories A, B, C, D and E. Normally A to D are different W/kg groups and E is applies to non-differentiated rides.

I think the person setting up the event can chose whether the start is simultaneous for all categories or if they go off in waves. Also whether they can see everyone else in Zwift or only others doing the event. I've never set up an event so I don't know the mechanics of this.
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [mvenneta] [ In reply to ]
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mvenneta wrote:
I’m a big proponent of zwift racing as I’ve said on here before

So I think it’d be fun to have a slowtwitch race series. Maybe make it a TT series which i don’t think exist

I don’t enjoy the slow group rides, although would join for a bit to support you and the community as you launched.

We do a TT series (3rd time) with a small group of Canucks. It is tough. 1 segment/week on the TT bike to rid drafting and power-ups. Do it whenever you can, how many times you want during that week. Submit your best time (picture).

Here is the current iterations tour. We are currently on Week 6. Not looking forward to week 7 and 9.
Stage 1: London Mall Forward Sprint (200m)
Stage 2: Jungle Loop Forward (7.8km)
Stage 3: Fox Hill (3km)
Stage 4: Watopia Hilly Forward KOM (900m)
Stage 5: Richmond UCI Route (16.2km)
Stage 6: Watopia Reverse Sprint (200m)
Stage 7: Reverse Epic KOM (6.1km)
Stage 8: London Classic from Banner (5.4km)
Stage 9: OTR Zwift race route (40+km)
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [Ai_1] [ In reply to ]
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Ai_1 wrote:
Slowman wrote:
okay, so...



1. erg mode, or drop possible?
2. every man for himself, or leaders keep the rider together?
3. stiff workout, or leisurely ride? or what?
4. how long, timewise?
5. what day?
6. what time?

I use Zwift at least twice a week, often more but I haven't done any of the ST Zwift rides to date since I'm in Ireland and don't like starting rides at midnight.
I'd be very interested in taking part if there was a new group ride starting some time between 18:00 & 20:00 on weekdays or 08:30 & 11:00 at the weekend. I might even contemplate early morning rides but the window would be narrower so probably a poor option to facilitate European riders in 2 or 3 time zones.
  1. Drop possible. I think this is a lot of what makes Zwift more motivating for many of us than just staring at a power figure.
  2. Leaders - preferably 2, each riding different paces (see no.3)
  3. My preference would be a group ride. One leader setting a reasonably stiff pace (say 2.5-3.0W/kg) with the second facilitating another group about 0.5W/kg down for anyone who plans a slower pace. This also to provide a fallback option for anyone who gets dropped from the front to re-group.
  4. 60-80mins on weekdays or 80-120mins at the weekend.
  5. Preferably Thursday evening or Saturday morning (GMT)
  6. Starting between 18:00 and 20:00 GMT on weekdays or 08:30 and 11:00 GMT on weekends

I would also suggest including an optional race that kicks off near the end of the ride for those interested.
Several of the existing group rides do this and I think it works well. The group leader picks a distance to go or a landmark where the race will commence. For example it might start at 4km to go. Anyone who wants to race has to ensure they are behind the leader for the race start. When the appointed point is reached the leaders gives the word and anyone interested goes for it. Everyone else can continue to the finish at a steady pace if they prefer. I think this works well.
The race serves a couple of purposes. Mostly, it's fun and satisfying if you're feeling up to it and it fits with your training goals. But it may also discourage some competitive flyers from breaking up the group early on. If they fancy a race they need to be back behind the leader towards the end, and won't want to have burnt all their matches. That might keep the group together for longer which tends to make it more enjoyable IMO.

funny you mention this format, because it's exactly what i had in mind: you ride more/less together for 45 minutes and then the dogs are let off the leash for the last 20 minutes. then a 5min cooldown and we're done.

i like the idea of 2 paces, if you try for the first group but get popped, you can drift to the second and your ride isn't over.

i'm thinking thur, 18:00 GMT. but maybe 3 leaders: 1st group leader, then 2nd group leader and sweep. 1st group 2.5w/kg, and then whatever you want for the last 20min, 2nd group about 1.75w/kg? that too slow?

bear in mind, i still know next to nothing about zwift. so tell me what i've gotten wrong here, or what i'm missing.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Second Slowtwitch Zwift Weekly Ride [B.McMaster] [ In reply to ]
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B.McMaster wrote:
Not your target market, but since you asked. I would not do a group ride. I don't do them "outside" either. The one thing I HATE about Zwift is drafting.

Fortunately a fellow S-T'er told me about using a TT bike so I would not get a benefit of drafting. I'm enjoying Zwift a lot more now. I was close to canceling my membership. Where do I send me $10 for that one piece of advice :)

Now if I could get details of past rides, (i.e. average watts) that would be a huge improvement to Zwift.
If you have a GarminConnect account, you can upload your ride data to that automatically.
You can do the same with Strava, Training Peaks, Today's Plan, Mapmyride/run, Fitbit, & Withings. I haven't tried any of those.

Open the Zwift App and go to Settings, then Connections. Pick your platform and away you go.

I have two GarminConnect accounts.
My main one that I've had for years is used to upload everything from my Garmin 920XT.
I've got a second one that I set up just for Zwift rides. At the end of every Zwift ride I just select save on the exit screen and the activity goes from Zwift to GarminConnect complete with power data and virtual world speed, route etc. This is very useful since I don't have a powermeter so my watch data is missing that. If you do a workout in Zwift, this will have intervals assigned as laps so you can see the average power levels, HR etc for each.
You could send Zwift data to your existing account but I don't want to have duplicate data and I want to leave everything recording from my watch so this suits me.

Another option for recording what you did in a ride but at a higher level, is to take a screenshot of the Ride Report at the end of the session. I usually take a screenshot of the Timeline tab of the Ride Report for each session as this shows average power, TSS, avg HR and provides a plot of power against time for the session. You can use the camera icon on the map screen of the phone app to save a screenshot of what you see on your main game screen to your phone at any time while running Zwift.
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