Bike Shops
Coaches
Fitters
Race Calendar
Running Stores
Store
Stack & Reach
Training Log
Triathlon Clubs
We Noticed
MAIN INDEX
RULES & LEGEND
LOG IN
Slowtwitch Forums
:
Triathlon Forum
:
Reynolds Poll Correct Answer
Tri
Classifieds
Lavender
Jobs
Womens
Notices
Print Thread
Slowman
Jun 8, 12 7:33
Post #1 of 17
(1289 views)
Reynolds Poll Correct Answer
Quote
|
Reply
Alrighty, I hope I have my memory and my facts in order.
Nope, it's not aluminum foil. Reynolds Aluminum and Reynolds, the company that makes bicycle sub-assemblies, are not the same company.
It's bicycle tubes. When I started making and selling my own bicycles, the state of the art was "double-butted" steel tubes. The process for making butted tubes (tubes that have a thinner inner middle section and a thicker end) was invented by Reynolds in - get ready - 1897. The Reynolds company that's synonymous with the bike industry was formed in 1898. The first double-butted tube - thicker at each end - debuted in 1934.
My first racing bike was a used Raleigh International. English bikes were, as you might guess, near the top of the heap when cycling and I found each other in the 1970s, if for no other reason than the most significant bicycle tubing company in the world was headquartered there. It was stylish to own a Reynolds 531 bike, and when that company debuted Reynolds 753 it the product became even more exclusive, as Reynolds would not sell that tubeset to bike makers it did not personally train to weld with it.
The big three tubing makers were headquartered in places where bikes tended to be made: Reynolds in England, Columbus in Italy, and Tange in Japan. While not always the case, bicycle tubing companies often made rifle barrels as well, because the process of precision-drawn, high tensile, tubes was similar for both products. In wartime, companies were often retasked for wartime production, and Reynolds delivered, among other things, wing spars to the Spitfire factory (Reynolds has always been Birmingham-based, and Spitfires were made down the road in Jaguar's Birmingham factory).
In the 1990s North San Diego, where I had my Quintana Roo factory, was then and still is a hotbed of golf manufacturing. A fellow named Jim Pfeil was an executive at a company making, among other things, carbon golf club shafts. But this was a commodity business, labor intensive finishing, destined for Taiwan, and eventually China. Pfeil decided to start a company manufacturing carbon fiber bicycle forks, and he bought a license from Reynolds - the bicycle tubing business - and commenced making forks under the name Reynolds Composites.
Pfeil sold Reynolds Composites to MacLean Quality Composites, a spin-off of MacLean-Fogg, an industrial company edging toward its centennial, with its own august history. Reynolds is now located in greater Salt Lake City. There is a cottage composites industry in this metro area, anchored by MacLean Quality Composites, a sub-assembly fabricator that, for a long time, made Trek's tubular composite products. Enve is another wheel company in Ogden, north of Salt Lake.
I have grown to believe that if an entrepreneur listens to his business, it will tell him what it wants to be and where it wants to go. Reynolds' owners heard, at various points along the way, that its future was not in forks, nor in tubular carbon products, rather in wheels. It also - rightly, in my view - understood that it would be wrong to brand itself a in a way that tied its fortunes to a specific material. Cannondale, for example, had a rough go unhitching its horse to aluminum. Litespeed had an even rougher time convincing customers that it was a bicycle brand, not a titanium fabricator. Reynolds is now known as Reynolds Cycling, rather than Reynolds Composites.
There is still a company making steel bicycle tubes in England, and it's been headed by a Brit by the name of Keith Noronha. You'll still find him at events worldwide - like the Handmade Bicycle Show - that honor the products Reynolds is historically known for. That company is called Reynolds Technology.
Meanwhile, Reynolds Cycling has as its metier making anything it wants out of composites, whether for the cycling industry or otherwise. It can also make both composite and non-composite wheels. Reynolds Technology is enjoined from the license arrangement from selling anything made out of composites. It focused on its high-end steel fabrication, both for bicycles, but increasingly for other industries that can appreciate and use this technology, such as cars and motorcycles.
Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
Record10Carbon
Jun 8, 12 8:00
Post #2 of 17
(1227 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
Am I mistaken in the thought that Reynolds was the first company to have a bicycle specific tube-set that had a metallurgy that would actually cause the material to stiffen as oppose to soften when subject to the (proper) heat at the joints? I want to say it was 851 and TiG. Prior (to my thoughts) it was not too hard to see where an improperly welded or brazed frame would have more inherent flex due to a heavy handed (or any handed other than cold glue) assembly of the tube-set. For years I myself tried to get things "hot enough" with out being "hot" and keep things "cool enough" yet flow.....but anyways....if I am not mistaken, Reynolds was one of the first to alleviate some of that tension (and then rapidly watch the industry go to Aluminum and then Carbon).
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
planetsbr
Jun 8, 12 8:18
Post #3 of 17
(1192 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
re: steel tubes, when I was younger my friend had a Cinelli road frame (with Campy super record) I lusted over, loved the lug work. I considered finding one and building it up to ride, but then I thought I'd be like those old dudes that drive around candy apple red 60's convertibles. Then I realize I AM an old dude.
.
.
Record10Carbon
Jun 8, 12 8:20
Post #4 of 17
(1187 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [planetsbr]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
LOL - I remember spending days and days in Colorado Springs filing the edges of a set of lugs to look like leaves....we had so much less time to stress about things (and post on the internet that Al Gore had not yet invented).
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
planetsbr
Jun 8, 12 8:35
Post #5 of 17
(1159 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [R10C]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
From an Arcade Fire song ...
"... I used to write letters, I used to sign my name
I used to sleep at night before the flashing light settled deep in my brain"
styrrell
Jun 8, 12 9:17
Post #6 of 17
(1087 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [R10C]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
With metallurgy harder does not = stiffer.
Styrrell
-BrandonMarshTX
Jun 8, 12 10:59
Post #7 of 17
(954 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
I got it right! My first 'real' bike in 1989 was a Falcon road bike with the green and gold sticker. Reynolds 531. Bike was made in England. I later had a 'custom' bike made by a company in Houston, but I think welded by Tom Teesdale, that was Reynolds 653. It had 650c wheels, a sloping top tube. I think that frameset is still at my parent's place actually.
Brandon Marsh -
Blog
|
Website
|
@BrandonMarshTX
|
Vitacost
|
Cervelo
|
RocketScience
|
1stEndurance
|
HEDWheels
|
CobbSaddles
|
SmithOptics
|
Swiftwick
|
CompuTrainer
|
SoleusWatches
|
ATC
|
RogueRunning
|
Power13
Jun 8, 12 13:02
Post #8 of 17
(812 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
I worked with Keith Noronha on a number of projects over the years. Great guy and consummate professional.
__________________________________________________
“I want to tell the world of cycling to please join me in telling Pat McQuaid to f##k off and resign." - Greg Lemond
Slowman
Jun 8, 12 13:40
Post #9 of 17
(789 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Power13]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
true that. i talked to keith at length earlier today.
Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
Record10Carbon
Jun 8, 12 13:42
Post #10 of 17
(785 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [styrrell]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
styrrell wrote:
With metallurgy harder does not = stiffer.
I know that - the goal being a stronger weld that was less prone to flex and either break out of a lug, or flex next to a TiG and in turn fracture. No bearing on the ride of the frame.
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
BBAddict
Jun 8, 12 13:54
Post #11 of 17
(767 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [styrrell]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
With any material, harder != (cpu language for "is not equal to") stiffer!
--anal material scientist sick of people confusing hardness with stiffness (modulus of elasticity/young's modulus)
Shut up legs.
Salmon Steve
Jun 8, 12 14:01
Post #12 of 17
(760 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
Don't know why but I always felt 653 was 'sexier' than 753.
FatandSlow
Jun 8, 12 22:31
Post #13 of 17
(670 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [-BrandonMarshTX]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
I didn't get it right. My first "good" bike was a 1972 Paris Sport with 531 tubes. But not double butted - I didn't have enough money.
My parents gave that bike to an employee of theirs while I was in the Army.
Ranks right up there with a comic book or baseball card story.
Tribato
Jun 9, 12 8:06
Post #14 of 17
(596 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Slowman]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
the fact that i knew the answer to your query is making me feel REALLY old! in the early 90's i worked in a "pro" bike shop and one of the first things the owner did was sit me down and tell me about the "big 3", columbus, reynolds, & tange and what kind of customer he thought was right for each. he also showed me a specialized allez that was made from lugged carbon tubes for people that wanted "plastic bikes".
do you recall the original specialized transition made of tange prestige tubing that specialized made to introduce their new fangled carbon tri-spoke? it had wishbone seatstays and came in neon orange, neon pink & matte black. i had an orange one and it's a huge regret that the frame somehow got lost in a move as i had one of my fastest rides ever at wildflower on that bike.
speaking of tom teesdale, i found an old neon green/blue splatter paint QR superform on CL which i bought to be my dedicated winter bike for the trainer. the seat tube looks closer to 80 degrees than 76 or 78 and down by the bottom bracket it says it was built by tom teesdale. did some of your older QR's have STA's steeper than 78?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Michael in Fresno
"Do you spend time with your family? Good. Because a man that doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man" V. Corleone
Record10Carbon
Jun 9, 12 8:14
Post #15 of 17
(589 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Tribato]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
The question is - Do you remember the ad for the "DuPont" bicycle wheel that spinning at 30mph has less wind resistance than
"turning the page of this magazine
".
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Tribato
Jun 9, 12 8:21
Post #16 of 17
(586 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [R10C]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
The question is - Do you remember the ad for the "DuPont" bicycle wheel that spinning at 30mph has less wind resistance than "turning the page of this magazine".
AWESOME!!! i do recall that ad in "TRIATHLON TIMES" before it morphed into "INSIDE TRIATHLON". if memory serves me right the yellow dupont logo was in every ad. ah the 90's...good times! didn't they have another one that stated "if you ride these wheels at ironman it's like giving yourself a 2 mile head start"?
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _
Michael in Fresno
"Do you spend time with your family? Good. Because a man that doesn't spend time with his family can never be a real man" V. Corleone
Record10Carbon
Jun 9, 12 8:27
Post #17 of 17
(581 views)
Re: Reynolds Poll Correct Answer [Tribato]
[
In reply to
]
Quote
|
Reply
Yep - at the time martec was making the bikes for Giant, both the Specialized Allez Epic and the Giant Cadex with the only real variant being the seat stay design. I was racing for Bikes Plus / Specialized and we would break no less than a bike a wheel (tearing the BB shell right out of the frame). It was about that time that Kestrel was starting to mass produce bikes other than the 4000 and carbon was finally hitting the market in a real way. There was an old guy at a shop in Colorado Springs that called the carbon bikes "fat fishing poles" - it made sense at the time. I can tell you one thing, a Specialized didnt ride ANYTHING like a Reynolds tubed 3Rensho.
----------------------------------------------------------
What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Print Thread
this forum
this category
all forums
All words
Any words
Whole Phrase
The New Specialized Wind Tunnel
Will this be a game changer for Specialized, in both sales and product design, or will it not move the sales and design needle versus those in Specialized's competitive set?
Yes, Game Changer
Minor move forward
Won't budge the needle
