Instead of getting all the WTC haters to talk their tribuddies out of it...you first have to get all of the WTC haters to talk themselves out of it. ;)

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Post of the day!

Here is the reality….95% of people who do an Ironman LOVE WTC. and they should, they deliver what these people want.

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-Of course it's 'effing hard, it's IRONMAN!
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^^ This!

WHAT!!! Damn you justarunner, I was going for post of the day. You are welcome for the setup!!!

Gracias. You'll see in a lot of my posts I take some anger out on WTC. But i'm realistic, the vast majority of WTC employees are great people. I've met a bunch of them and they're phenomenal. Their seems to be a disconnect between the upper echelon of WTC and all those below them.

But at the end of the day, the race staffs put on a phenomenal race, bust their ass, and I know what to expect for my dollars spent. So I have no remorse in signing up for an Ironman. I plan to switch to short stuff after this experience but I'll be back to race Iron distances again in the future and will do them whether they are WTC or whatever brand can offer me a solid race.

I think a lot of the people on this board spit out a lot of anger (myself included) but at the end of the day, you have to talk with your money, and most people are talking with their money...by giving it to WTC.

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Why Arizona? It's a good race but these days you have many choices. Why not pick one that isn't 16 months away. Canada for example was fantastic.

why do you want to do IM AZ?

only valid reasons:
- you have familyfriends there to visit
- you think you can KQ
- you want a douchebag ironman tattoo and brag that you did a branded event.

otherwise, do a grass roots series like HITS, capitolaman, vineman, etc etc

From Websters: sar·casm noun
: the use of words that mean the opposite of what you really want to say especially in order to insult someone, to show irritation, or to be funny

I know him. He's way too cheap to travel that far.

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Only valid reasons huh?

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I'll be narrow minded also-

Why would you do hits, capitolman, vineman,etc
Only valid reasons:
- can't afford IM brand race
- can't compete in a large competitive field
- you have family or less likely a friend to visit

you are mixing in competitive field and ability to pay which are mutually exclusive. Dont care to race some lawyer/ceo doing 12 hours when there are kids here in the ghetto running 14 min 5ks.... if they had the cash to do these races.....

There is a lot of talent out there and it is definitely not in an expensive race.

While there is much validity in your second comment, this is completely unrelated to your first comment. There are many reasons to do a WTC event over a lesser known event. There are also many reasons we cannot get those kids from the ghettos on bikes, into pools, and on trails for ironman. But the fact that some doctor or lawyer did Ironman is not what kept that kid in the ghetto. I actually wish ST spent more time on that second point than worrying about how a bunch of pros get paid. I think it is profoundly sad that Ironman races in the Unites States look like upscale country clubs in white suburbs. It would be very nice to see some diversity.

I enjoyed Timberman as an event when I did it in 2010, but learning about WTCs business practices, getting into bed with Armstrong, continued disdain for the pros that act as standard bearers for the sport, and whether or not its a good event, I wont give them my business.

Been doing that for a while now.

You're welcome

Sorry, but this really won't make a difference. There may seem like a lot of WTC haters, but if you look closely, there really are not that many. Its just the ones that exist are pretty vocal.

I agree with this, but as soon as we start to believe that one voice doesn't matter, democracy and capitalism are both weakened.

I might feel that choosing to not race WTC events anymore will not have a significant impact and will just make it easier for someone else to register for the race, but I still have to vote with businesses with my money. I can't control anybody else's money.

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"Some folks plan for the optimum race, others like to get upset when others out plan them. "

That and 100% of the WTC haters are on ST which only makes up 1-3% of Triathletes.

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Wrong....post of the year!

I just want to understand that WTC haters are trying to protect capitalism.

Time for wtc to probably start some youth development process alongside with USAT. I see many good tri juniors programs out there (forumla endurance - non profit)

Glad we can agree and disagree in different threads. :-) I actually would not say that I hate WTC. I actually respect their business acumen of a lot of their decisions, I just don't think it is good for the sport (maybe for the participation event, but not the sport) and I in general don't like to see the fatalistic thought process of "well everyone else is ok with it and my one vote / $ won't make a difference so I'll go along"

I don't think Capitalism needs protecting, but to say you are not responsible for your actions because everyone else's actions out weigh them is not how I chose to go through life.

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"Some folks plan for the optimum race, others like to get upset when others out plan them. "

Do Beach to Battleship instead (late October). $300 cheaper. Better organization than WTC races. No bike loops. Better medal (if that's your thing). Swim current all but guarantees a PR.

You sparked me to checkout the website for this race. Looks like a sweet course!

Can you promise no one will swim over me. ;)

I agree and love B2B. Signed up on 7-29 before the 8-1 price increase. As for IM Arizona, apparently not everyone understood that my post was a poke at all the WTC haters. I have no desire to go to Arizona, but I have been thinking about IM Florida. So if registration lasts longer that 30 seconds, I might have a chance to get in. So the same request applies to Florida ;)