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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [CPA_PFS] [ In reply to ]
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Every person who drives a vehicle and kills someone (a cyclist, a runner, a walker, a mom with a stroller, ...)
regardless of whether they stay at the scene, regardless of whether they were drunk or high, etc. and short of a real
'accident' (let's say a car from the other lane swerves into their lane and the reflex is to swerve away and you
hit someone, or a tree falls on the road causing an accident...in other words something REALLY unexpected) should
get their license suspended for 5 years.

That's my solution (part of it). That will force them to commute on a bike.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [trihard4me] [ In reply to ]
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trihard4me wrote:
Let see..... how many people in the 40 some years I've been driving have I killed someone on the road..... NONE. How people have l hit with my car..... NONE. How many people does an average person hit on the road... for 99.9% of people it's NONE.

I had a guy drive out of a side road straight into me about 10 days ago. Hit the bonnet (I think) then landed on other side of the road. Ambulance etc.. called. I had a really lucky escape, impact to left elbow/hip/knee/foot, lots of soreness and could barely move next day but nothing broken. I'm about 95% fine now.

Guess what, it really was "an accident". The guy was genuinely sorry, actually horrified and had never hit anyone before. Having spoken to him since he comes across as a decent person. He (we think) had been looking beyond me as he approached the junction as you can see through the fence.. Yes he made a mistake, could it be said that he was driving without due care? People make mistakes while driving, most of these thankfully have no repercussions. I hope you (and all of us) are always able to state "None" to your questions.

Part of the solution really is education. We need to make people realize how vulnerable other road users are, that the "weapon" we drive doesn't protect us all that well from other such "weapons", and that roads are for sharing by multiple modes of transport.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Francois] [ In reply to ]
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There are some witnesses stating the cyclist swerved into the lane in front of the patrol car. Lets pump the brakes alittle bit.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Rokko] [ In reply to ]
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Rokko wrote:
Wow. Just wow. I honestly can't believe you are spewing all of this.

First, you must be new because this is what trihard4me does on a regular basis.

Second, whilst I admire the fact that they are putting themselves in danger to protect us that does not mean that they are somehow above the law. He killed a cyclist. He should be charged.

He won't be charged and that is unacceptable.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Eppur si muove] [ In reply to ]
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Eppur si muove wrote:
trihard4me wrote:
Hybris is absolutely correct for some of these cops.

Are they driving Priuses?


Q: Why is passing a cyclist while driving a Prius like having sex with a deaf person?
A: They can't hear you coming, either


"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [dreaming~big] [ In reply to ]
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"Not so sure why this is funny? It's perfectly appropriate for diacrit over the upsilon in Greek to be translated into English either as an "hu" or a "hy"."

you're right. i am hymbled.


Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
"Not so sure why this is funny? It's perfectly appropriate for diacrit over the upsilon in Greek to be translated into English either as an "hu" or a "hy"."

you're right. i am hymbled.


A point ... well made. :)
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [dreaming~big] [ In reply to ]
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Uh, are you sure that's what he meant? We have very few guys on this board who are familiar with transliteration of words derived from Greek. I actually thought he may have been confusing hubris with the Hybris Worm, i.e., he might be a geek with a bad spelling habit or a bit of confusion before his a.m. coffee?

-Robert

"How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world." ~Anne Frank
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Robert] [ In reply to ]
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Honestly, I figured he was one of those Brits or Aussies who routinely mangle the English language.

~~ kate
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [JackL] [ In reply to ]
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JackL wrote:
trihard4me wrote:

Let see..... how many people in the 40 some years I've been driving have I killed someone on the road..... NONE. How people have l hit with my car..... NONE. How many people does an average person hit on the road... for 99.9% of people it's NONE.


I had a guy drive out of a side road straight into me about 10 days ago. Hit the bonnet (I think) then landed on other side of the road. Ambulance etc.. called. I had a really lucky escape, impact to left elbow/hip/knee/foot, lots of soreness and could barely move next day but nothing broken. I'm about 95% fine now.

Guess what, it really was "an accident". The guy was genuinely sorry, actually horrified and had never hit anyone before. Having spoken to him since he comes across as a decent person. He (we think) had been looking beyond me as he approached the junction as you can see through the fence.. Yes he made a mistake, could it be said that he was driving without due care? People make mistakes while driving, most of these thankfully have no repercussions. I hope you (and all of us) are always able to state "None" to your questions. .

Well good for you, I am glad you are alright .....BUT YOU would be singing a different tune if you were severely injured, paralyzed, could not walk, etc. I am glad you and your new found friend are pals now. Maybe you all can sit around a camp fire and laugh about it. For this poor guy in LA and many many many others it's NOT a blow off matter.

People make mistakes while driving and YOU are thankful there are NO respercussions????? Well maybe if I mistakenly discharge my gun in the air and the bullet travels into a nearby home killing an a person...... Should I be prosecuted? According to you NO. Hey.... it was a mistake, I did not mean to kill anyone, I was just playing with my "weapon". A 5000 pound auto is considered a weapon too. Aren't you late for a jury somewhere? You are a defending attorney's wet dream.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [starkrayz] [ In reply to ]
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starkrayz wrote:
Rokko wrote:
But this fact does not mean all cops are good at all times. There are bad cops out there. There are corrupt cops. Cops that use excessive force. Cops that run over cyclists in bike lanes.


To put it simply, Los Angeles leads the country in the employment of "thuggish" cops. It really isn't anything new to those of us who live out here. It doesn't help that the chief (Lee Baca) is a scumbag himself who works his magic to get constituents and celebrities out of jail. I don't think in the 15 yrs I've lived out here that I haven't seen a cruiser breaking the law, whether it be driving well above the speed limit (no lights) on the 405 or sailing through a neighborhood stop sign (a weekly observance living near an intersection and a police station). Any attempt to report ANYTHING to a watch commander will put you on an unfortunate blacklist which has happened to me and 2 separate neighbors (whose children have repeatedly dealt with near-misses by police cruisers).

Point is, outside of LA I'm sure there are squeaky-clean police officers who protect the public. And there possibly is a percentage of LA officers who somehow manage to avoid corruption. But I can certainly sympathize with anyone who lives out here who is getting sick & tired of the LAPD's behavior in the past 2 decades.

PS. We have several large dogs, 3 machetes, and multiple firearms. A perp would be long dead before a "cop" arrived at our house.

LASO is not LAPD. Two different departments, two different jurisdictions, and two different cultures. I'm not saying that both departments don't have their issues, but if you're conflcating the two, then your other observations are questionable..
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [dreaming~big] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe he's a Greek Geek? ;)

-Robert

"How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world." ~Anne Frank
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [vikingstumps] [ In reply to ]
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vikingstumps wrote:
There are some witnesses stating the cyclist swerved into the lane in front of the patrol car. Lets pump the brakes alittle bit.

I was waiting for someone to come up with the "suicide swerve" excuse.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I had the same laugh at hybris initially and feel fortunate I didn't post anything. I am now tempted to throw down "hybris" in other online forums purely as bait for the pedants and then enjoy the irony of their hubris.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [stillrollin] [ In reply to ]
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stillrollin wrote:
CPA_PFS wrote:


I think the officer should be and likely will be fired, unless he can demonstrate some overwhelmingly mitigating circumstances to explain his actions. His actions killed someone who was not a threat to himself, others or society ... who was literally one of the people the officer was employed to protect. He had demonstrated incompetence at his job.


Never underestimate the power of the thin blue line. Or the Union.

As we see all too often, a cyclist doesn't receive the benfefit of the doubt. In this case, the aforementioned will be serious forces to be reckoned with.

And I would underestimate the likelihood that someone's limited opinion about blue lines and police unions is almost entirely the product of television and movies.

Cops get disciplined and even fired for this kind of thing all the time. Most cops are not out to protect their co-workers because of some code. Cops generally don't like to work with bad cops, as its a dangerous job and bad cops make it even more so. Nobody has any idea how this case will play out, but there's little reason to believe that the LASO won't take it seriously.
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Post deleted by markg [ In reply to ]
Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [AlanShearer] [ In reply to ]
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AlanShearer wrote:

And I would underestimate the likelihood that someone's limited opinion about blue lines and police unions is almost entirely the product of television and movies.

Cops get disciplined and even fired for this kind of thing all the time. Most cops are not out to protect their co-workers because of some code. Cops generally don't like to work with bad cops, as its a dangerous job and bad cops make it even more so. Nobody has any idea how this case will play out, but there's little reason to believe that the LASO won't take it seriously.

And you would be wrong. Father was Chief of Police and BIL was a Detective Lieutenant. In their respective senior positons both had to deal with a lot of shit. Some of which they were willing to share.

Though I was a fan of Hill Street Blues.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [JackL] [ In reply to ]
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JackL wrote:
trihard4me wrote:

Let see..... how many people in the 40 some years I've been driving have I killed someone on the road..... NONE. How people have l hit with my car..... NONE. How many people does an average person hit on the road... for 99.9% of people it's NONE.


I had a guy drive out of a side road straight into me about 10 days ago. Hit the bonnet (I think) then landed on other side of the road. Ambulance etc.. called. I had a really lucky escape, impact to left elbow/hip/knee/foot, lots of soreness and could barely move next day but nothing broken. I'm about 95% fine now.

Guess what, it really was "an accident". The guy was genuinely sorry, actually horrified and had never hit anyone before. Having spoken to him since he comes across as a decent person. He (we think) had been looking beyond me as he approached the junction as you can see through the fence.. Yes he made a mistake, could it be said that he was driving without due care? People make mistakes while driving, most of these thankfully have no repercussions. I hope you (and all of us) are always able to state "None" to your questions.

Part of the solution really is education. We need to make people realize how vulnerable other road users are, that the "weapon" we drive doesn't protect us all that well from other such "weapons", and that roads are for sharing by multiple modes of transport.

I agree that education is part.

In your story, however, it sounds like it wasn't an "accident" -- that he actually was at fault and negligent.

I understand that the guy was genuinely sorry. Just because someone is negligent while driving doesn't make them a bad person. As you said, we all (or at least most of us) have been negligent while driving from time to time, and we're just fortunate that our negligence didn't cause any harm, at I suspect this lulls us into a false sense that our driving habits are acceptable. But that doesn't mean people should not be held accountable beyond civil liability when they do cause harm or are negligent. I like Francois's suggestion of a license suspension (or at least a restricted license) when at fault, even for a minor collision.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [stillrollin] [ In reply to ]
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stillrollin wrote:
AlanShearer wrote:


And I would underestimate the likelihood that someone's limited opinion about blue lines and police unions is almost entirely the product of television and movies.

Cops get disciplined and even fired for this kind of thing all the time. Most cops are not out to protect their co-workers because of some code. Cops generally don't like to work with bad cops, as its a dangerous job and bad cops make it even more so. Nobody has any idea how this case will play out, but there's little reason to believe that the LASO won't take it seriously.


And you would be wrong. Father was Chief of Police and BIL was a Detective Lieutenant. In their respective senior positons both had to deal with a lot of shit. Some of which they were willing to share.

Though I was a fan of Hill Street Blues.

The operative word is "was."

I'm not saying there isn't corruption in police departments, currently or in the past. But the level of professionalism, especially among police departments in California, has dramatically improved over the years, so much so that references to unions and codes protecting bad cops is by far the exception. (Police unions raise all kinds of problems, but their ability to protect and keep bad cops on the job is overstated.)
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [logella] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Everybody,

This is eerily similar to a police car hitting and killing two triathletes in 2008:

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...reply;so=ASC;mh=100;

The officer was sentenced to 4 months in county jail after pleading guilty to misdemeanor vehicular manslaughter. Apparently he could serve the time in a sheriff's furlough program or home detention.

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...rum.cgi?post=2322904

I am sorry for those triathletes.

Mark

Fast-Finishes.com
Triathlon and Running Race Timing
Athletic Event Management
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [markg] [ In reply to ]
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markg wrote:
vikingstumps wrote:
There are some witnesses stating the cyclist swerved into the lane in front of the patrol car. Lets pump the brakes alittle bit.


I was waiting for someone to come up with the "suicide swerve" excuse.

My understanding is that they can do a pretty good job at reconstructing the scene to determine the point of impact and what happened. While some may be cynical, the cops investigating the scene will not fabricate evidence to make it favorable to the officer driving the vehicle. If the officer lies about what happened and they find it out, he will most certainly be fired.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [AlanShearer] [ In reply to ]
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AlanShearer wrote:
markg wrote:
vikingstumps wrote:
There are some witnesses stating the cyclist swerved into the lane in front of the patrol car. Lets pump the brakes alittle bit.


I was waiting for someone to come up with the "suicide swerve" excuse.


My understanding is that they can do a pretty good job at reconstructing the scene to determine the point of impact and what happened. While some may be cynical, the cops investigating the scene will not fabricate evidence to make it favorable to the officer driving the vehicle. If the officer lies about what happened and they find it out, he will most certainly be fired.

How can you possibly know that?

Most of what you have previously said makes sense. This, not at all.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [AlanShearer] [ In reply to ]
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It seems as if Police vehicles have more accidents with bicycles then any other profession..... Why is that? You don't hear too much about Accountants hitting cyclists or Doctors hitting cyclists. Even truck drivers, UPS drivers and pizza delivery driver you don't hear then hitting cyclist. Do cops have something against us??
Last edited by: trihard4me: Dec 10, 13 11:36
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [trihard4me] [ In reply to ]
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trihard4me wrote:
It seems as if Police vehicles have more accidents with bicycles then any other profession..... Why is that? You don't hear too much about Accountants hitting cyclists or Doctors hitting cyclists. Even truck drivers, UPS drivers and pizza delivery driver you don't hear then hitting cyclist. Do cops have something against us??

Can you back that up with actual statistics? Of course not, because you just made it up.
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Re: LA cop hits and kills cyclist in bike lane [stillrollin] [ In reply to ]
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stillrollin wrote:
AlanShearer wrote:
markg wrote:
vikingstumps wrote:
There are some witnesses stating the cyclist swerved into the lane in front of the patrol car. Lets pump the brakes alittle bit.


I was waiting for someone to come up with the "suicide swerve" excuse.


My understanding is that they can do a pretty good job at reconstructing the scene to determine the point of impact and what happened. While some may be cynical, the cops investigating the scene will not fabricate evidence to make it favorable to the officer driving the vehicle. If the officer lies about what happened and they find it out, he will most certainly be fired.


How can you possibly know that?

Most of what you have previously said makes sense. This, not at all.

Because as a lawyer that represents police departments in union negotiations and police disciplinary matters, I have an understanding how most departments in California work internally. As the officer involved is both the subject ot a criminal as well as internal investigation, IA will be involved. IA was either at the scene or it monitoring the investigation there. Those investigating will be under as much scrutiny as anyone.

Like I said, you watch too many tv shows.
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