Oh, it's in my hamstrings mostly.
I swim about 15k a week, combination of hard sets and distance, never any cramps in the pool, not even after sprint sets and 2 hours of swimming.
Cramps have happenings both in wetsuit as non wetsuit slims.

bit of a longshot since you swim more and are no doubt much faster in the water, but do you give a good kick for the last few hundred meters to get the legs going? How hard are you running into T1?
Most people say to do the above and run into T1 at a decent clip but dont overexert. Me, im the opposite to the rule- i actually dont kick, and if i do its a lazy kick, and i pretty much 'jog' into T1. Otherwise i cramp, like yourself. I have tried both ways, but if i kick towards the end in an effort to get more blood to the pins, i cramp into T1. Running too hard on the beach into T1 also = cramp.
Have you tried doing a race pace swim and jumping out of the water and running like your going into T1 in practice? Its prob the adrenaline etc getting to you. Maybe relax the last portion of the swim a bit, nice and controlled, slow down the run into T1 a touch perhaps.

I have a rather lazy cick except perhaps the first 100 meters after the start and certainly don't speed up to the end. No sprint into t1. Perhaps I kick a little harder in a race but normally I also do these tempo in training sets to.
It might also have something to do with rest/taper. Last time i didn't have the problem was in a race (od but only 1k swim)

How many flip turns do you do in open water races?

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"Go yell at an M&M"

funny

Sorry I can't help but I thought that was funny :)

jaretj

Use magnesium spray and your cramps will be a thing of the past.

As you might have guessed: none. Thanks for the input though!

Sorry, have been posting on mobile device and my (Dutch) Android OS converts some already typed english words to a dutch-like word.

Never heard of it. Is it a food supplement or a spray to use directly on mussels/skin? I do use magnesium supplements (Pro-Magnor) in preperation of my races and through heavy training blocks.

I also have problems with kramps after the swim . Reaching down to close the shoe strap my stomach cramps really bad.
Sometimes have to leave the second one open for a while. After few minutes i can go down and close it. I guess my problem might
be my core needing some more training.

My thought about the hamstring just guessing.
Could it be that when swiming your hamring is "on" for long while and gets tens.
The fot is straighened out for a long while swiming, maybe trying to relax the fot (ankel) a little more while swimming?


Sorry for my bad English and it's monday morning =)

If you mean I should practice more in open water in advance, you might have a point. The nearest open water swim (if temperatures in Belgium alllow) is almost half an hour drive from where I live so I tend to prefer training in the pool as this saves me quite some time. If the open water possibility is near (hollidays, training camps) I like swimming in sea, lake, ... a lot and do it almost daily then. However It's really hard for me to simulate race speed in these occasions as this normally are longer (easy) swims and I am not surrounded by what seems a pack of very angry swimmers.

I also do believe that the main training opportunity for swimming (certainly for improving and gaining speed) is in the pool. Furthermore, as my 70.3 race is in 5 days, I cannot change this any more.

Just was wondering if anyone else has had these issues and might have any idea's to cope with these cramps. Perhaps some specific actions during taper could prefent a lot (specific stretching, food, ...).

I am trying to qualify for IM70.3 worlds 2015 in Budapest and I doen't have a lot of margin. So half a minute to a minute lost in T1 or the beginning of the bike might make the difference there.

You are quite welcome. I'm sure the the fact that in pool swims you bend, flex, and extend your legs ever twenty seconds or so, and in open water swims you keep your legs pretty much in stasis for twenty to forty minutes is irrelevant.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

I don't think it's irrelevant but what do you suggest I do about it? I can't start doing flip turns in open water ever 20 seconds. Even if this would prevent the cramping from happening, it wouldn't get me any faster to the end of the swim.

Do you suggest I "pause" during the swim to relax or adapt my technique (don't really see how) during a few seconds every few minutes? This might do more bad than good: mess-up my rhythm, loose the (front) group I'm swimming with,...

Also it doesn't explain why it only happens in approximately 50% of the races. I've swam a 3k and never had any issues and last weekend it happened in a 1.5k event.

I get the same in all race distances. I think a lot of it is kicking hard in the swim, and then trying to transition to running from there. This, yet again, why swimming is undervalued in it's impact on the event. It's not time critical, but it has a bigger "cost" than it's given credit for. Going out hard will impact it the most.

I believe it has ZERO...0, zilch, nothing, to do with electrolytes or hydration. It will get better with doing more training, and in particular more hard swimming to manage lactic on the swim more efficiently and better swim fitness and pacing.

The more fit I've become, I've gone a lot faster AND muscle cramping has disappeared.

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I've been training for about 5/6 years now and significantly keep getting better in all 3 events. However the last 2 years this started happening once in a while and I don't have an answer to it (yet). Improving isn't really helping but perhaps from a certain point it will...

I neither believe it has to do with hydration. Rather a combination with type of taper and race speed (kicking harder?). Perhaps also warmer water temps, a wetsuit and sighting are possible co-reasons.

I've also had something similar in in a duathlon also after 5k in the run with stille the remainder of the run 10k, a 105k mtb and another 30k run to go. Nothing to do with starting to hard then but I bhlame a taper of 8 days doing nothing instead of keeping the mussels going a little bit. I do believe I create more lactate after a taper than in full training mode.

For the 70.3 swim next week, I plan on swimming my own tempo from the start (easy on the legs) rather than starting with a sprint (hard on the legs) to follow the lead group. And hoping for enough time to get to the front after 1.9k without issues.

Just curious...are you trying to point your toes in a way that is unnatural for you?

I've gotten them t while diving into the water and while dolphining.

I had hamstring cramps - like LOCKED SOLID in a race yesterday. Even my quad got into the act. Oh boy it hurt. I had to stop and found a sand bar to stand on, straighten the legs and rode it out. Finished the race using pull only. = slow time!!

I have had problems in the past with mega biking then jumping into Kits pool for training which is saltwater. Cramps so bad I had to hang onto the side. But nothing recent.

Anyway yesterday:
I was on the bike an hour before the swim just for fun/warm-up
Salt water?? I had no issues swimming everyday, long distance the last 3 weeks in fresh water 75 DegF. The ocean was 65 DegF
I have been drinking diet cokes, and coke absorbs magnesium
I forgot to take magnesium tablets over the past week.

My legs feel fine today swam felt great no issues. 54 years old btw. Never had issues like this in my life before but also never did these events on a race basis.

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Not that I'm aware of. I swim pretty much like I always do and it was a start in the water so no dolphin diving.

Most of the races I do are in fresh water. However the two races I did in saltwater I didn't have the cramp issues.

I do drink some diet coke. It wont hurt skipping that for a week even if it doesn't help me.

Here is a wild idea that probably won't work but I think is worth trying...

Either in you next race or in a training session that is very much like a race (high stress).

Put a salt tablet under your tongue (so you can taste the salt) just before the start and see if you have the same problem.

jaretj

I really think the culprit to hamstring cramps is an imbalance in the leg musculature.

So running and biking work the legs in a certain way that is not balanced i ie too much push.

Walking is balanced because there is roughly equal pull and push.

Work on using the pull muscles, the groups that pull the back of the leg in tension.

I am not sure what swimming does, kicking certainly excites the nervous system of the leg and perhaps the imbalance then overloads the system.

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This has been clinically proved to be true. The only consistent markers of muscle cramps are (1) having had them in the past, and (2) fatigue in the cramping muscle.

Not hydration, not temperature, not electrolytes or supplements or anything else holds up to close scrutiny as a cause of cramps.

The cure for cramps is to train more so you're not so fatigued. Swimmers do the 3-4k masters workout with rest intervals, turns every 17 seconds, etc. Then they swim nonstop for 30-60 minutes, pushing pretty hard, and get cramps.

Duh. It's like doing 1-3 minute easy intervals as marathon training.

Swim more long continuous sets, and do long kick-only sets with deep, hard kicking.

I agree lots of swimming works overall the body in a pretty balanced way, especially if you backstroke, or kick on back, and all of the other strokes. I was in the gym the other day doing hamstring curls and right at the top of the range - yeow I could feel that nerve start to fire, precursor to the cramp.

But I am not so sure to throw things that affect the body's "electrical" system under the bus completely. Cramps are electro-chemical > to (what I call) mechanical action, in their fundamental process. So I am sure it is affected by substances, say for example lactic acid, that causes involuntary signals to fire in the localized nervous system.

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