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Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships
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Night one:

NC State blitzed everyone with a Championship record 6:06.53 in the 4x200y. They dominated this relay impressively. This was easily the fastest 4x200y in history and a big upset. The Wolfpack time doesn't count as an American record as two of the swimmers are non-Americans. Texas easily broke the American record in second place and NC State still won by over 2 seconds.

Ryan Held split a 1:31.37 leading off for the Wolfpack, Soeren Dahl brought it home with a ridiculous 1:30.67.

Perhaps even more impressively, American Olympian and IU swimmer Blake Pieroni and USC's Dylan Carter (another Olympian from Trinidad) both posted 1:30s on leadoffs, those are the second and third fastest 200y times IN HISTORY.

To finish it off, Townley Haas is showing signs of having another huge taper and dropped the fastest 200y relay split in history with a 1:30.42 on the anchor for Texas.

Harvard's Dean Farris, Texas' Jack Conger, Cal's Andrew Seliskar and Stanford's Tom Kremer all dropped 1:31s. Let's be clear, any of those times would be the fastest split in the pool just a few years ago.
Last edited by: hiro11: Mar 23, 17 6:57
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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I've gotta convert to SCM for perspective.

Townley Haas' split converts to a 1:40.18. That's ridiculously quick, considering the WR is a Biedermann supersuited 1:39.37 from 2009.

put Haas in Biedermann's suit, and he's in the 1:38 range from a flat start.

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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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unreal

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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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JasoninHalifax wrote:
I've gotta convert to SCM for perspective.

Townley Haas' split converts to a 1:40.18. That's ridiculously quick, considering the WR is a Biedermann supersuited 1:39.37 from 2009.

put Haas in Biedermann's suit, and he's in the 1:38 range from a flat start.
Yeah, that's the one issue with NCAAs: yards times are meaningless to anyone not in the US. As a result, this meet gets little press outside of the US. If you ask the swimmers, they'll tell you that this is one of the premier meets in the world in terms of the depth of competition and excellence at the top.

Certainly, lots of SCY stars aren't successful in LCM so it's always a little tricky to convert times. Still, if you win at NCAAs you're world class.
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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Go Pack!
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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We attended last night. Amazing how many incredible 200 frees we watched.

Came away extremely impressed with USC's Dylan Carter's 200 - 1:30.95 I think. USC was not in the last heat and he swam his lead off leg from the front. He certainly was not pushed by any other swimmer. Unreal walls - got a half to full body more underwater than the others in his heat. And a very big pull once he popped up - only took 10 to 11 strokes per 25. I can not wait to see how he does when side-by-side with the likes of Haas, Held, Pieroni, etc. I am pulling for Pieroni to win but think that Carter has the best chance to dethrone Haas based on his turns.

I know that I had unrealistically high expectations when Haas went off the blocks to anchor for Texas. I was actually anticipating him to break 1:30.00.

David K
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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And PVK's American record in the 500 finally goes down. Damn.

blog
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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hiro11 wrote:
JasoninHalifax wrote:
I've gotta convert to SCM for perspective.

Townley Haas' split converts to a 1:40.18. That's ridiculously quick, considering the WR is a Biedermann supersuited 1:39.37 from 2009.

put Haas in Biedermann's suit, and he's in the 1:38 range from a flat start.
Yeah, that's the one issue with NCAAs: yards times are meaningless to anyone not in the US. As a result, this meet gets little press outside of the US. If you ask the swimmers, they'll tell you that this is one of the premier meets in the world in terms of the depth of competition and excellence at the top.

Certainly, lots of SCY stars aren't successful in LCM so it's always a little tricky to convert times. Still, if you win at NCAAs you're world class.

Haas didn't have a bad Olympics in 2016.
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
And PVK's American record in the 500 finally goes down. Damn.

It's about time, I've thought for several years that PVK's 4:08.54 was a record just waiting to be broken. Clark Smith went 4:08.42 so just a hair faster; someday someone like Yannick Agnel (not him specifically b/c AFAIK he is retired) is going to blast a 4:06 and really reset the record. If you take his 3:32 WR for the 400 scm, he should have been able to go 4:06 for a 500 if he had ever swum any 500s tapered, shaved, and at his peak.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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Isn't Agnel French? It would be kinda hard for him to hold the American record. Could have the US Open record though.

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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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ericmulk wrote:
stevej wrote:
And PVK's American record in the 500 finally goes down. Damn.


It's about time, I've thought for several years that PVK's 4:08.54 was a record just waiting to be broken. Clark Smith went 4:08.42 so just a hair faster; someday someone like Yannick Agnel (not him specifically b/c AFAIK he is retired) is going to blast a 4:06 and really reset the record. If you take his 3:32 WR for the 400 scm, he should have been able to go 4:06 for a 500 if he had ever swum any 500s tapered, shaved, and at his peak.
Clark Smith himself pointed out that Dolan dropped a 4:08 in 1995. Smith called his own new record "soft". Still, it's great to see Smith swimming well again. Haas and Auboeck almost got him.

Anyway, last night:

Dressel 18.23 in the 50. Absolutely destroyed the field, second fastest time in history. Held second and Schooling third. Note that it took 19.06 to make the final this year (wow). Dressel's start is in. sane.

4 guys under 1:41 in the 200IM. Szaranek and Licon tied for the win, both just touching out Murphy and Bentz. Bentz is swimming well at this meet as is Szaranek.

Licon dropped a 49.75 breast relay split in the medley. That's sick.
Last edited by: hiro11: Mar 24, 17 7:23
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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hiro11 wrote:

Licon dropped a 49.75 breast relay split in the medley. That's sick.

That, and Texas' entire relay breaking 3:00 smashing all of the records... meaning the average split was under 45. Sick

Strava
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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hiro11 wrote:
ericmulk wrote:
stevej wrote:
And PVK's American record in the 500 finally goes down. Damn.


It's about time, I've thought for several years that PVK's 4:08.54 was a record just waiting to be broken. Clark Smith went 4:08.42 so just a hair faster; someday someone like Yannick Agnel (not him specifically b/c AFAIK he is retired) is going to blast a 4:06 and really reset the record. If you take his 3:32 WR for the 400 scm, he should have been able to go 4:06 for a 500 if he had ever swum any 500s tapered, shaved, and at his peak.

Clark Smith himself pointed out that Dolan dropped a 4:08 in 1995. Smith called his own new record "soft". Still, it's great to see Smith swimming well again. Haas and Auboeck almost got him.

Ah, I see, thanks for that info. I haven't watched any replays or heard/read any interviews yet.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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Night three, this shit was crazy:
Chase Kalisz turned in an absolutely filthy back half of the 400IM and broke the American record by over a second with a 3:33.42. Andrew Seliskar swam very well for second with a 3:36, just touching out British swimmer Szaranek.

In 100 fly, Olympic champ Schooling broke Tom Shields' American record (and Tom Shields is an SC fly swimmer of some note), set a PB by 3 tenths and STILL LOST to Dressel. New American Record for Dressel with a 43.58. Can Dressel swim a LCM 100 Fly? The US could use a little help in that regard.

Here's the video of the 100 fly:


In the 200 free, Peironi and Carter proved that their relay splits were no flukes with an identical pair of 1:31.16s. Still Haas clobbered them all with a 1:30.65, the second fastest time in history. Of note: freshmen Dean Farris, Cameron Craig and Maxime Rooney all swam 1:32s. Haas is only a sophomore. US men's middle distance is in very good shape for the future.

Licon beat Schlognstenjcjbieuvesxmxuessdkjn in the 100 Breast. Only a night of swimming like this makes a 50.6 look mundane.

Murphy won the 100 back for a 4-peat in his NCAA career with a 43.99. Longhorn sophomore John Shebat, who is having one hell of a meet, got second with a 44.35.

The 200 medley relay capped this insane night. Texas just barely beat Bama, both broke the NCAA record. So many ridiculous splits. Dressel's free: 17.93 (he's making 17 something second splits unsurprising). Schooling: 19.45 in fly. Conor Oslin (who?) beat Olympic champ Murphy in the back with a 20.39 split. Licon's 50 breast split: 22.91, that would win a 50 free in a pretty good high school meet.
Last edited by: hiro11: Mar 25, 17 5:02
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [hiro11] [ In reply to ]
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hiro11 wrote:

In 100 fly, Olympic champ Schooling broke Tom Shields' American record (and Tom Shields is an SC fly swimmer of some note), set a PB by 3 tenths and STILL LOST to Dressel. New American Record for Dressel with a 43.58. Can Dressel swim a LCM 100 Fly? The US could use a little help in that regard.


Apparently, the 100 fly and 50 free are back-to-back in Tokyo, so I don't think you'll see Dressel swim the 100 fly there. He might be the best fly option for the medley relay, though.

It's been a crazy two weeks of swimming. At the Women's NCCA DI Championships, Ledecky had a great 500 free and Simone Manuel crushed the 46.00 barrier in the 100 free. Dressel was epic in the 100 fly and 100 free at the men's DI Championships, but the race of the meet was the 1650. 3 different guys led in the last 200 yards, 4 guys finish within 1.04 seconds of each other, all under NCAA/American/US-Open record time. The winner, Clark Smith, had pulled a groin muscle 2 days earlier on the last turn of his winning 500 free effort. He could barely get out of the pool, had to be helped off the deck, and sent a team-mate to the podium in his place to collect the trophyette.

But maybe the best couple swims of the last ~two weeks belong to Claire Tuggle. She went 1:47.71 in the 200y free and 4:49.32 in the 500y free at the NCSA Junior Nationals. Did I mention that she's 12 years old? 12 years old!!! There were several teams at the Women's NCAA DI Championships who could have improved their 4x200 free relay times with Claire in their lineup. That 500 free time broke the oldest girls age group National Record on the books, set by Sippy Woodhead in 1977.

"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"
Last edited by: gary p: Mar 26, 17 17:20
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [gary p] [ In reply to ]
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gary p wrote:
hiro11 wrote:

In 100 fly, Olympic champ Schooling broke Tom Shields' American record (and Tom Shields is an SC fly swimmer of some note), set a PB by 3 tenths and STILL LOST to Dressel. New American Record for Dressel with a 43.58. Can Dressel swim a LCM 100 Fly? The US could use a little help in that regard.


Apparently, the 100 fly and 50 free are back-to-back in Tokyo, so I don't think you'll see Dressel swim the 100 fly there. He might be the best fly option for the medley relay, though.
It's been a crazy two weeks of swimming. At the Women's NCCA DI Championships, Ledecky had a great 500 free and Simone Manuel crushed the 46.00 barrier in the 100 free. Dressel was epic in the 100 fly and 100 free at the men's DI Championships, but the race of the meet was the 1650. 3 different guys led in the last 200 yards, 4 guys finish within 1.04 seconds of each other, all under NCAA/American/US-Open record time. The winner, Clark Smith, had pulled a groin muscle 2 days earlier on the last turn of his winning 500 free effort. He could barely get out of the pool, had to be helped off the deck, and sent a team-mate to the podium in his place to collect the trophyette.

But maybe the best couple swims of the last ~two weeks belong to Claire Tuggle. She went 1:47.71 in the 200y free and 4:49.32 in the 500y free at the NCSA Junior Nationals. Did I mention that she's 12 years old? 12 years old!!! There were several teams at the Women's NCAA DI Championships who could have improved their 4x200 free relay times with Claire in their lineup. That 500 free time broke the oldest girls age group National Record on the books, set by Sippy Woodhead in 1977.


Ya, Clark now owns the 500, 1000, and 1650 records. First time in many years that one guy has held all three.
Agree that Dressel was phenomenal; 40.00 for 100 free and 43.58 for fly are beyond belief.
And we'll see how the young Claire Tuggle comes along; as you know swimming history is filled with early burnouts. :)

ETA: Let's not forget Will Licon going 1:47.9 for 200 breast, which is only about 19.3% slower than Haas's record for 200 free. As a non-breaststroker, I just find 1:47.9 really, really hard to comprehend.


"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."
Last edited by: ericmulk: Mar 27, 17 18:37
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [ In reply to ]
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40.00





I wrote this, you should read it:
https://www.slowtwitch.com/...n_Swimming_6700.html
Last edited by: tallswimmer: Mar 27, 17 5:03
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [tallswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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Looked at the analysis. Dressel flips so much faster than everyone else... like 0.15 to 0.20 per turn. You can't give that up and hope to win.

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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [realAB] [ In reply to ]
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realAB wrote:
Looked at the analysis. Dressel flips so much faster than everyone else... like 0.15 to 0.20 per turn. You can't give that up and hope to win.


Noticed the same with Simone Manuel, consistently .15-.20 seconds per turn faster than most of her closest competitors. Smoliga, who finished second in the 100 at NCAA's, spotted Manuel nearly 3/4 of a second in total turn time in that race.

"They're made of latex, not nitroglycerin"
Last edited by: gary p: Mar 27, 17 6:16
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [gary p] [ In reply to ]
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Every year, the NCAAs remains my favorite meet. The team spirit, the pressure, the elation and the PERFORMANCES... all incredible. If they swam this meet in LCM, I honestly believe it would be faster on average than World Championships. This year was yet another insane year, perhaps the best NCAA meet in history (?). So many records, so many incredible times.

As a measure of how great the last day was, Will Licon's incredible 1:47.91 American record capper to one of the finest careers in NCAA history seems to have been completely forgotten.

Only on a day when Clark Smith wins one of the greatest races in NCAA history (holy crap!) and Dressel goes 40.00 (W. T. F.) does that happen.

Ryan Held had the meet of his life. Ryan Murphy swam lights out and no one noticed. Conger, Kalisz, Shebat, Auboeck, Haas etc, all produced other-worldly times. All of this is especially impressive in a post-Olympic year.

Two moments that will stick with me from the final day:
At about the 1,450 mark in the 1,650 when you could tell Clark Smith was just not going to let this one get away from him. His last 150 was like watching Lezak run down Bernard: he was willing himself to win. He threw down everything he had built in four years at Texas as a legendary worker in practice on the last 50, you could see it all coming out.

Dressel's last 25. Powering into the wall, arms flying, hydroplaning, head down. His stroke is just incredible to watch: it's not controlled and beautiful, it's just raw power. I think he's the most explosive sprinter I've seen since Jager.
Last edited by: hiro11: Mar 27, 17 7:19
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [ericmulk] [ In reply to ]
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The 1650 was the best race I watched this past weekend.
4 guys about a second apart and all 4 under the old record.
And Bentz's last 100 of the 400 IM was sick.
Brought it home in :48.7!

The meet was so fast.
Dressel made Chadwick's :40.9 look slow.
It's also interesting to notice his stroke this year.
Looks longer, more powerful - should bode well for LCM.
Between those two, Conger, Peroni and Held the US 400 Free relay should be solid for the next Olympics.
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [stoobie] [ In reply to ]
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You forgot Ryan Hoffer... 41.23 in grade 11 ... he'll be a freshman at 2018 NCAA

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cerebral_palsy
2020 National Masters Champion - M40-44 - 400m IM
Canadian Record Holder 35-39M & 40-44M - 200 m Butterfly (LCM)
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [stoobie] [ In reply to ]
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writing off Adrian already???

:-)

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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [realAB] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah, someone offered an interesting point on him.
Most of the gains these guys experience come from their underwaters.
Ryan already has great underwaters and they wondered how much he could really improve.

I'm not saying that will be the case and I hope he does continue his development.

I will say that the biggest thing for me regarding Hoffer are what is LCM times are relative to SCY.
Murphy, Dressel and Schooling were already fairly strong in LCM relative to their SCY times at similar ages.
I think Dressel was even 1:48ish in his 200 LCM in H.S. (might be off on that one...)

Hoffer's fly times in LCM are solid, which is encouraging.
I'm also curious to see how Michael Andrews continues to develop.
Will he narrow his event focus?

In any event, I think the future of US swimming looks great.
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Re: Men's 2017 NCAA D1 Swimming Championships [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]
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Great catch!

Not yet...and with Ervin (another Cal guy) still putting up great times, I hope they keep going!

Was really interesting a couple weeks ago.
He changed his race strategy focusing on the 2nd 50.
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