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Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar)
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http://www.bikeradar.com/...t-on-tubeless-44186/

My own $0.02: I feel like tubeless is a bit of a gamble. Perhaps you have lower odds of flatting and you might be able to achieve lower on-road crr/more comfort but if you flat you're pretty screwed. I recently tried to take some Vittoria tubeless tires off my CX/Road bike (to put on Schwalbe Kojaks :) and I gave up after about 30 minutes of zero progress and opted to just cut them off. The Kojaks went on in about one minute apiece and I wasn't even rushing. For myself, personally, I don't think tubeless is worth the tradeoff on the road.

Particularly interesting excerpts below:
"But in those systems, there is something called an engine that offsets some of the factors like weight. We really don’t feel like this [road tubeless] system is fully baked yet. Some of that is because Continental has high standards. For instance, we ensure our clinchers can handle twice the pressure they are rated for. If it says 120psi on the sidewall, it will go to 240psi before it blows off the rim – and the rims usually break before that. To get to 240psi with tubeless, our tyre would weigh 350g, and that's not competitive. Also, in all our rolling-resistance testing, a GrandPrix 4000S and a light butyl inner tube outperforms any of the tubeless scenarios."


Mavic employee: "Of course when it is set up properly the benefits are unarguable. That said, for the average consumer the process of setting up a road wheelset to be tubeless is a very difficult and often frustrating process. Road tubeless must have a lot more rubber to be sealed, which makes the casing more rigid and the rolling resistance higher. This is not mitigated by the absence of a tube, despite what many people say. Coming to market with road tubeless, just to keep up with the trends, is not something we do. When we can come to market with something that has consumer benefits and is consumer friendly, we’ll make a push. Rest assured, we are not ignoring this topic."
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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I was intrigued when they came out and thought about making the leap with my road bike (which I ride for fun and training)

I decided upon some research that they looked like a HUGE PITA and pretty much a solution to a non exsistant problem.

NOW for MTB with some no flat foam in there, they may hold some promise. JMHO
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [Jamie] [ In reply to ]
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Well I just went tubeless on my road bike and yesterday it turned out to be great. I was riding and got a cut in the sidewall, lost about 40 psi while it resealed but I was still able to keep going with barely a concern. Now I did have replace the tire when I got home since it was a sidewall cut (training tire now) and noticed that tire was really hard to get on and off, and the new one went on without an issue. Also in a worst case scenario I carry a spare tube to through in the tubeless tire.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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Putting tubeless tires on tubeless ready tires is as time consuming as putting on a regular clincher.

I am done with tubes. IRC tires FTW btw.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [robabeatle] [ In reply to ]
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Hmmmm. Maybe just my particular rim/tire combo was a pita: Vittoria Cross XL Pro TNT with Stan's Iron Cross rims. There was zero chance I could get the tires off by myself without cutting them off. Shame to waste them but I was never going to use them anyways.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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"Coming to market with road tubeless, just to keep up with the trends, is not something we do. When we can come to market with something that has consumer benefits and is consumer friendly, we’ll make a push. Rest assured, we are not ignoring this topic."

Funny comment from Mavic. They are all about trends, though I guess they prefer the ones they invented.

Tubeless on road bikes just doesn't cut it. I don't even think they make sense for MTB, though I don't ride MTB much. They don't solve any problems that a latex tube can't solve nearly as well, and you can put sealant in them also. Wouldn't it be nicer with a thin latex liner between the rim and tire, to make them easier to air up, eliminate burping, and hold the sealant? Tubeless are more of a PITA to deal with, plus heavier, more expensive, and higher Crr.



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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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http://velonews.competitor.com/...-tire-removal_366875

I have a set of Schwalbe one with RS61 wheels on my winter bike- LOVE THEM!
In 6 months of steady winter commuting: 0 punctures, they roll superbly, decent wet grip, and mounting was no problem (see above, used 2 plastic tire levers).

res, non verba
Last edited by: RoYe: May 3, 15 10:55
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [GreenPlease] [ In reply to ]
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Like everything, you weigh the pros and cons and make a decision. I've use Hutchinson tubeless on all three sets of training wheels and wouldn't change. Unfortunately my HED race wheels state non-tubeless only or I would use them there.

Interesting article.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [rruff] [ In reply to ]
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rruff wrote:

Tubeless on road bikes just doesn't cut it. I don't even think they make sense for MTB, though I don't ride MTB much. They don't solve any problems that a latex tube can't solve nearly as well, and you can put sealant in them also. Wouldn't it be nicer with a thin latex liner between the rim and tire, to make them easier to air up, eliminate burping, and hold the sealant? Tubeless are more of a PITA to deal with, plus heavier, more expensive, and higher Crr.

Pretty much my take as well...and we're probably the only 2 guys running latex tubes in our MTB tires ;-)

http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [Tom A.] [ In reply to ]
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I've never tried latex tubes. I'm intrigued though. Are the Mtn bike latex tubes all pretty much the same brand to brand? The same question applies to the road latex. Are they all similar, or do you favor one brand over the other?
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [XXXXXXX] [ In reply to ]
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XXXXXXX wrote:
I've never tried latex tubes. I'm intrigued though. Are the Mtn bike latex tubes all pretty much the same brand to brand? The same question applies to the road latex. Are they all similar, or do you favor one brand over the other?

Before trying them, read (and understand!) this (applies to MTB as well): http://austintriathlonstore.blogspot.com/.../01/latex-tubes.html

AFAIK, Geax (Vittoria) is pretty much the only supplier of MTB latex tubes. For road latex, I've had good experiences with Vittoria, Bontrager, and Challenge models.

http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [XXXXXXX] [ In reply to ]
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MTB are tough to find. Here are some Michelins: http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/...tex-tube/michtubm240

I've bought Vittoria road latex from them also for ~$8 each. They appear to be out of the normal size but have Michelin and Challenge. Vittoria is my favorite, Michelin next, and Challenge last. Challenge have slimy stuff on them I don't like.

Buy talc and coat the inside of the tire and the tube. Make sure the tube is slightly inflated and not folded or wrinkled before you get the 2nd tire bead on. Then check to make sure all the tube is where it belongs.

If you've pinched tubes during installation and didn't correct your error (ie figure out what you did wrong and quit doing it), then forget about latex tubes until you have a good protocol. Otherwise you might kill yourself.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [Tom A.] [ In reply to ]
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Pretty much my take as well...and we're probably the only 2 guys running latex tubes in our MTB tires ;-)

I know! Buy extra so they don't stop stocking them. Are yours 26"? I don't see any 29er tubes.

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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [rruff] [ In reply to ]
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rruff wrote:
Pretty much my take as well...and we're probably the only 2 guys running latex tubes in our MTB tires ;-)

I know! Buy extra so they don't stop stocking them. Are yours 26"? I don't see any 29er tubes.

Yep. 26"...I prefer to get the off-road handling I desire through frame geometry rather than the proxy of manipulating wheel size ;-)

http://bikeblather.blogspot.com/
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [Tom A.] [ In reply to ]
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Tom A. wrote:
rruff wrote:

Tubeless on road bikes just doesn't cut it. I don't even think they make sense for MTB, though I don't ride MTB much. They don't solve any problems that a latex tube can't solve nearly as well, and you can put sealant in them also. Wouldn't it be nicer with a thin latex liner between the rim and tire, to make them easier to air up, eliminate burping, and hold the sealant? Tubeless are more of a PITA to deal with, plus heavier, more expensive, and higher Crr.


Pretty much my take as well...and we're probably the only 2 guys running latex tubes in our MTB tires ;-)

Make that 3... I have tubeless in the front, latex rear. I was curious to see if there would be any difference in terms of flat resistance running stupid low pressure. I ran latex tubes in my MTB when I used to ride it 20 years ago (those old Air-B tubes) and they always worked great.

My tires set up tubeless very easily, and I don't have to pump the tubeless up as often--but changing tires is a hell of a lot easier. The latex tube hasn't been any more likely to flat even though I'm running it ~18psi, so I'm not seeing a big advantage to tubeless. One interesting thing is that I'm running a 26" latex tube in a 650B wheel and it works fine.
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Re: Interesting Read on Tubeless Tires (BikeRadar) [roady] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the info. I was going to go tubeless this summer, but I think you all talked me out of it. I'll give this latex thing a go. Sounds like less mess to me.
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