I've had tires on my GP4000s on my FLO 30s since last year. I ended up flatting last week and it was still a PITA to get the tire on and off. I love the ride of the 30s but changing out tires is a big problem....at least with the GP4ks. I broke a tire iron getting them on the first time.

Did you change the rim tape that came with the Flo 30s? I suppose Veloplugs would make things easier. The difficulty in installing tires on the 30s (I also use GP4000s) has meant that I have not used the wheels. I can get the tires on with a LOT of effort, however, I would not want to deal with that after flatting in the middle of nowhere.

I'm still using the included tape. I can't the tape would make much difference. If anyone has found it does help I'd love to hear about it.

My only regret was not getting the 28 spoke FLO30 rear. I'm light, but finding I want a stiffer wheel... the 11 speed build seems a bit flexy...

I have been doing hours and hours of reading to help me decide on a wheel set to upgrade from the stock hoops on my 13 Trek 1.2. I had pretty much decided on the Flo 30s. Love the look and have heard nothing but good things about them. Work commuting, group rides and charity events (MS150, Pedal the Cause, etc) are the extent of my riding. I'm currently on the list to be notified when the next order happens (supposedly mid-July). As a 215 pound rider, I plan to get the 28 spoke rear. Does anyone think I should have any concerns at all? I gotta admit, I am a little nervous about flatting now, after reading how tough it is to change out tires. I plan to take wheels, tires, tubes and a cassette to my LBS and have them do everything at first. However, I guess I'll also add to that some Veloplugs. Does anyone see any issues a bigger rider like me may have with this setup?

What size/length presta valve do you need for the Flo 30s?

I'm running 40mm valves with no problem.

You should be 100% fine with a 28 spoke rear.

I race on my FLO 30's. With my 24 spoke rear I had to open my rear brake more because of minor flexing when I race crits.

The Flo's are tough to change tires, but I can't say they are much worse than my old Mavics.

For the record there is no difference between an 11spd or 10spd build. Can I ask what frame you are riding? I know I'll sound like the guy trying to depend his wheels... but... often times it's the frame that's flexing. With a 2 cross build on both sides the standard FLO 30 isn't really a "soft" wheel. Sometimes customer upgrade to the 28 spoke build and find the "flex" worse. What really is happening, is the stiffer wheel is causing the frame to flex more.

I just troubleshot a "flexy" rear wheel for a customer who had an S5 frame. Anyway, after several discussions, I was able to see his bike and found out that his rear brake was really loose. The "flexing" wasn't flexing at all, his brake was simply wiggling around. And he's a big strong rider on a 24 spoke build.

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Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

Ahh, that makes sense. Thanks for the reply! It didn't make sense to me that a 2 cross build would be flexy either. I haven't had any problems since I adjusted my rear brake. Getting a LOT of q's from fellow roadies on these wheels. they are the best bang for the buck on the market!

Would the same apply to the Flo 90 ? I have the Clydesdale version and if there would be one thing i don't like about the wheel it would be the flex. My training wheels are 28 spoke DT swiss wheels built by Wheelbuilder and are extremely stiff and cause little to no flex at all in my P2. If i try to squeeze the spokes i feel much more tension in my DT Swiss wheels vs my Flo 90. Also if i grab the rim and try to pull it to the frame, it bends a lot more with less force.

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Don't forget to attack!

Yes the same would apply on the 90. What is the width of the brake track on the DT Swiss wheel? Are the brakes set up the exact same on the DT Swiss wheel vs. your FLO 90? How is the DT Swiss wheel built... spokes, lacing pattern, tensions?

I'm asking all of those questions because there are a lot of variables. My previous post wasn't to suggest that FLO wheels are the stiffest in the world, but rather to shed some light on the other potential side of the equation. Your DT Swiss wheel could be stiffer depending on how it's built. Or it could actually be softer causing your frame to deflect less. Pulling the rim to the frame doesn't mean the wheel is moving... it could mean the frame is bending.

Make sense?

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Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

Yes, that makes great sense. I've got two sets of wheels to compare to, one is using a Velocity Deep V rim and the other using a DT Swiss R585 rim. Spokes are 2 x crossed on both drive and non-drive side. The rim is obviously narrower (around 19mm i think) but I have had to dramatically increase the gap between brake pads and rims with the Flo. I could run on the tightest gap with the Wheelbuilder wheels (around 1mm on either side), whereas now I need a 3-4mm gap on either side or otherwise the rim hits the brake.

I disagree with the statement about pulling the wheel towards the frame doesn't mean the wheel is moving - that would be true if the force at which you pull the wheel would be unknown. What I know now is that pulling the DT Swiss wheel towards the frame requires a lot of force to result in minimal rim displacement (vs the frame as reference) whereas for the FLO wheel, it only takes little force to see a lot of displacement.

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_____________________
Don't forget to attack!

I understand what you are saying about "pulling the rim". I didn't know you had a known force. From what you are telling me, wheelbuilder had put together a build that is a little stiffer than our build.

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Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

For reference... I was comparing my FLO30 to a 24 spoke 2 cross Kinlin XC279 built by Hoops Wheels. I'll gladly trade a minor amount of stiffness or aerodynamics...

I've had the some trouble with Conti GP4000s and Michelin Pro 4s on the FLO 30s. It is damn near impossible to mount the tire onto the rim. I don't know if it has to do with the width of the wheel or what what but I've never had this much trouble getting a tire onto a wheel. Apart from that, the black brake track completely rubbed off after one ride in the rain and the rime tape is coming apart by the thread of the tape.

I have gone back to running my OEM wheels because I can't risk flatting and not being able to change the tire. Total waste of $ as far as I'm concerned.

You need to be a man about mounting those tires. It does take a little more effort to get a gp4000 on than some wheelsets, but not much.

Thanks, that's extremely helpful advice.

The only real answer is to push harder. Once you get the tires on the first time and run them in remounting won't be as difficult.

I don't know if it's been mentioned, but for the first install (hoping they stretch after that), you can try a Kool-Stop Tire Bead Jack.

I have Flo 30s and use GP4000s. Maybe a little bit tougher, but have had no problem. Have changed tubes several times (from butyl for training and latex for racing)... and no issue. No flats at all.

Also, I rode them in a hellacious storm at Norseman (crazy rain and hail)...where I was shooting down switchbacks and riding brakes hard...and my brake track is still black. Too bad yours came off...but does it really matter?

I would say give them a chance.

I'm glad to hear this because Order 15 shipped early, yesterday in fact, so I'm hoping to have them rolling this weekend!

With respect to the tires, the first installation can often be a little more challenging. Tires have a tolerance, as do wheels. I've had the same make and model tire go on easily with my bare hands, and the next one require tire levers. However, once on, the tires tend to stretch out.

Can I ask how you are installing the tire? Let me explain. When feeding on the last side of the tire, you eventually get to the point where your hands can no longer force the tire over the rim. At that point I'm assuming you are using a tire lever? If so, are you placing the tire lever in the middle of the excess tire OR are you working from one side towards the middle? If you are beginning in the middle of the excess tire, you'll have a terribly hard time.

You also mentioned that your rim tape is coming apart. It sounds like you may have snagged it on something. If you'd like, I can send you a new piece. Just message me your contact info and I'll get you a new piece in the mail.

Take care,

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Chris Thornham
Co-Founder And Previous Owner Of FLO Cycling

Don't know if this has been mentioned before, but an old cyclist's trick for tight tire installations is to throw them in the dryer for 15-20 min to get them warm, flexy and pliable.

Alternatively, put them outside against a south facing wall for a while [if you're fortunate enough to still have hot weather at this time of year].

I kind of agree with this. I have another brand of 60mm wheels with the 4000s on them. I had to push so damn hard with my thumbs to get those things on that I heard the carbon crack on the other side where my fingers were holding the wheel. I fear the day where I have to change a tube on the side of the road!