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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Felt Bicycles] [ In reply to ]
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Felt Bicycles wrote:
To simplify the installation process and improve the overall setup, as some of you have noted, Felt developed a new bracket system and accompanying hardware to alleviate any potential issues such as have been described in this forum thread. Here is how you can tell whether or not you have the updated bracket: (see attached)

Authorized Felt retailers have these new brackets available or available to them, so if you’re interested in an upgrade, contact your authorized Felt dealer for ordering information. This will be provided free of charge.

How many athletes and/or shops have to "poorly install" these old brackets and get badly hurt before you don't just make new brackets available but actively process a recall through these great retailers of yours? Or at least tell these dealers that you have this part available?

This is a pretty frightening thread honestly. Not really sure how I can buy any more Felt's after this.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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Looks like for a 2nd time in less than a year I'll be getting a free part from felt... That should have been proactively recalled to begin with.

Time to contact my local felt dealer...
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Felt Bicycles] [ In reply to ]
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Felt Bicycles wrote:
In our experience in working with consumers on an individual basis regarding issues involving the Bayonet 3 aerobar assembly, the primary cause has been improper installation. To simplify the installation process and improve the overall setup, as some of you have noted, Felt developed a new bracket system and accompanying hardware to alleviate any potential issues such as have been described in this forum thread. Here is how you can tell whether or not you have the updated bracket: (see attached)

Authorized Felt retailers have these new brackets available or available to them, so if you’re interested in an upgrade, contact your authorized Felt dealer for ordering information. This will be provided free of charge.

Finally, there are many terrific bicycle mechanics who produce great work. But we strongly encourage all riders to seek out an authorized Felt retailer for work on their IA Series, DA Series, or any other Felt bike. Missing components such as washers, incorrect bolt sizes, improper torque settings, or any other deviations from the manufacturer’s specifications can result in suboptimal performance. All information regarding the proper installation and adjustment of all Felt bicycles can be found at the following link: http://www.feltbicycles.com/manuals[/url]. Any and all work performed on your Felt bike, whether by the rider or a bike shop, should adhere to the guidelines outlined in the manuals and technical documents.

We strongly recommend ensuring that your bike is safe to operate before each and every ride. This includes checking tire pressure, looking for any loose bolts, inspecting your brakes, etc. Generally speaking, it’s good practice to take your bike to an authorized dealer regularly to ensure it’s in proper working order, the frequency of which depends on how often and the conditions in which you ride. Sweat and riding near saltwater conditions can corrode parts on your bike, so these factors are cause for shorter intervals between professional services. Every rider’s sweat rate and the frequency by which they ride near saltwater is unique, so again, we advise checking your bike for rust on a regular basis and consulting with your authorized Felt dealer if you have any questions.

For more specific information or questions, our customer service team is ready to assist you. Please contact them at
info@feltbicycles.com[/url]

I was interested in a Felt AR bike, but the lack of interest your company seems to show in this serious issue has definitely turned me off.

In all honesty, I wonder if this would have been kept quiet if superdave was still with felt.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [littlefoot] [ In reply to ]
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littlefoot wrote:

I was interested in a Felt AR bike, but the lack of interest your company seems to show in this serious issue has definitely turned me off.

In all honesty, I wonder if this would have been kept quiet if superdave was still with felt.

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...20pedestals#p6321456

This case wasn't a FELT.

You show the current pedestal assemblies any structural engineer worth his salt, and he'd tell you that this is failure-prone and not advised, given the load patterns, etc. Especially if the "towers" are not bridged.

You won't see me on any pedestal superbike unless the drop from pads to base bar is minimal.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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In their instructions they to specify you need a stabilization bar after a certain stack.

I have a 1.2cm stack and don't use one. But Ive seen others with super high stacks in "super bikes" that look really squirrelly
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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For what it's worth, my local bike shop told me they did indeed just receive a dealer tech notice from Felt on proper aerobar clamp install procedure. In the notice, Felt mentions there is not a recall on the design but that they are offering a new clamp design at no charge for those who want one.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Felt Bicycles] [ In reply to ]
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Felt,


Thanks for the link and advice but isn't there a better way to get this message to customers?


It was pure chance I logged onto ST and scanned for Felt IA threads. Similarly, I only knew about the brakes because I contacted the Felt online shop directly about another matter and was told to replace the whole brake system. So, if I hadn't messed up the screw thread on my rear brake and sought advice about replacement parts, I'd still have the old brakes, and if I hadn't by chance logged on here, I wouldn't be trying to get the new brackets before I race this weekend (looks like my 2014 IA FRD has the unsafe version).


The highly reputable shop I bought my IA from in south London doesn't stock Felt anymore so how can i get the correct brackets within 2 days?
If it cant change them are the old brackets safe to race on, assuming correctly torqued?

This video was a pro closed road race, what happens on a country road going round a blind corner? Ffwd 2 mins in:
http://www.cyclingweekly.com/videos/watch/watch-ag2r-development-rider-crashes-high-speed-as-time-trial-bars-snap-after-going-over-bump


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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Freddie] [ In reply to ]
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I would second this request.

I can say that once I identified and issue and reached out to FELT they were fairly painless to work with. The exception being when I specifically asked about the brakes when I purchased the bike and they assured me I had the new ones (I didn't).

But given that most of us (I'm assuming) took the step to register our bike. Wouldn't it make sense for FELT to notify us of any tech bulletins so we can proactively reach out to our local dealers and get the upgraded parts?
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Not replying to you specifically but ever since SuperDave left Felt feels like the way they handle issues like this or the direction they are going is not favorable imo. I was considering an IA as my next bike (when that happens) but seems to be it'd be easier to source a frameset then deal with parts that are suspect that are hard to find outside of Felt itself.

If Canyon ever gets their act together in the US and offers a frameset only for the Speedmax I'd might have to seriously consider just picking one of those up as my next bike. The frameset offerings for the DA/IA are really expensive compared to buying a whole bike. A little disappointed in that actually with Felt.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [loxx0050] [ In reply to ]
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Here is my experience so far.
-At Felt's direction I contacted my local dealer instead of contacting Felt directly
-Asked them about the new clamps as well as the new Calpac.
-Local dealer did not know anything about IA's, clamps or Calpacs. I had to explain (and spell) what a Calpac was.
-Local dealer called Felt for direction
-Felt then told local dealer to have me email Felt with pictures of bracket, serial number and size of IA and that Calpac would not be available until after Kona.

Seems crazy to have to contact local dealers that may or may not know anything about TT bikes only to then to be asked to email Felt directly.

I met some of the Felt guys at Oceanside 70.3 earlier this year and they were really great. Can't say enough about the way they took care of me. However, this whole issue with the extension clamps has been really frustrating. I contacted them directly about the failure of this part and started this thread over a year ago and it is still unresolved. They just don't have the customer service end of this figured out. It doesn't need to be this hard.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Greatzaa] [ In reply to ]
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Wait...there is a new calpac?

Haha
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [loxx0050] [ In reply to ]
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loxx0050 wrote:
If Canyon ever gets their act together in the US and offers a frameset only for the Speedmax I'd might have to seriously consider just picking one of those up as my next bike. The frameset offerings for the DA/IA are really expensive compared to buying a whole bike. A little disappointed in that actually with Felt.

can i ask you this, because i'm getting whipsawed by you folks and i just don't get it. and let me state here my financial entanglements: canyon is a partner here. felt is a sometimes partner. premier has a marketing arrangement with us for chains, not for bikes.

what i'm hearing is:

1. boy, i like that speedmax
2. canyon is having early stumbles in the U.S. market
3. jeez, why can't people offer good customer service, i'd go right there if they did

and then premier offers:

1. a bike that looks, tastes, feels, sounds an awful lot like a speedmax
2. slowtwitchers are about ready to erect a statue to dan kennison for his customer service
3. his bikes come in very nicely priced
4. he'd probably sell you a frameset if you asked him

what is it exactly you want?

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
and then premier offers:


4. he'd probably sell you a frameset if you asked him

Yes he would. Apparently because people did ask him.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I think different people want different things. In the context of this thread and as an IA owner concerned about safety, I'm keen for my bike to have the safest brakes and brackets. I've contacted Felt dealer for guidance.

My past experience with Felt on an issue with my AR road bike (last year) was absolutely superb - one of the best customer service experiences I've received from any company in any sector. So, I'm optimistic that they'll help with brake/ bracket issue in a reasonable manner.

Happy to update on progress.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
loxx0050 wrote:
If Canyon ever gets their act together in the US and offers a frameset only for the Speedmax I'd might have to seriously consider just picking one of those up as my next bike. The frameset offerings for the DA/IA are really expensive compared to buying a whole bike. A little disappointed in that actually with Felt.


can i ask you this, because i'm getting whipsawed by you folks and i just don't get it. and let me state here my financial entanglements: canyon is a partner here. felt is a sometimes partner. premier has a marketing arrangement with us for chains, not for bikes.

what i'm hearing is:

1. boy, i like that speedmax
2. canyon is having early stumbles in the U.S. market
3. jeez, why can't people offer good customer service, i'd go right there if they did

and then premier offers:

1. a bike that looks, tastes, feels, sounds an awful lot like a speedmax
2. slowtwitchers are about ready to erect a statue to dan kennison for his customer service
3. his bikes come in very nicely priced
4. he'd probably sell you a frameset if you asked him

what is it exactly you want?

A nice aero frameset that doesn't cost more than a full bike setup.

Only reason I interested in the Speedmax is the full setup for a bike read to ride is listed as $2500 (or so). So I would like to buy a frameset sub $2000 but preferrably $1800 or less for a great frame with a good (an non problematic aerobar setup). or $1500 with no bars is fine....but I don't know if they will do that. The use of direct mount brakes pleases me to from a wrenching standpoint especially where they are located (like how most road bikes are that are non-aero shaped).

Look at it this way:
Felt:
DA1 Frameset - $2999
B14 (full bike) - $1999 (same looking frame but front end and fork are different)
IA FRD Frame Kit - $6999
IA1 Frame Kit $4999
IA2 Full Bike $7499
IA10 Frame Kit - $2499
IA10 Full bike - $4999
IA16 full bike - $2999

I don't feel the DA1 frameset with a different front end/fork is worth that much more than a full B14 or an IA16 bikes. That pricing seems way out of line to me.

Nothing against Premier actually as I forgot about them. Wouldn't rule them out as they are a better value than a DA1 Frame Kit and on paper seem better than an IA10 Frame Kit (since that doesn't seem have bars either). But again, for their asking price I'd rather get a Canyon full bike for a couple hundred less.

For reference I do like Felt bikes as I own a previous gen B12 (last of the threaded BB's too) and am pleased with it in general. But I do eventually want a newer bike (just because not that I need it). I've even seen firsthand IA owners with aerobar extension slippage issues this past summer.

All in all I'm a little cheap and prefer something I can wrench on without having to contact the manufacturer to get ahold of proprietary parts if I can help it.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [badoc] [ In reply to ]
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badoc wrote:
I think different people want different things. In the context of this thread and as an IA owner concerned about safety, I'm keen for my bike to have the safest brakes and brackets. I've contacted Felt dealer for guidance.

My past experience with Felt on an issue with my AR road bike (last year) was absolutely superb - one of the best customer service experiences I've received from any company in any sector. So, I'm optimistic that they'll help with brake/ bracket issue in a reasonable manner.

Happy to update on progress.

i've been talking to felt about this. they're taking it quite seriously, it's front of mind, and i'm quite sure that there'll be a proper response. the engineer on these bars was an engineer for profile design for some years. there is proper intellectual heft behind the bars.

now, what i think is going on, just my guess, is it's kind of like that equifax breach, where they knew a couple of months before we knew that there was a breach. you want to have your ducks in a row when everybody starts demanding action.

in felt's case, this company is very committed to working through its dealer network. and, look, i don't know how many people have thought about this, but if there's any kind of replacement or service work or recall or anything of that nature - which there will be for every bike company! - bear in mind that there is a dealer network at which to execute these service events.

but to the point, i can only surmise that part of what felt is doing right now is alerting dealers, arming dealers with the necessary parts, service bulletins, etc., if such a service event is in its future (and i have no idea if it is).

just, this is sometimes why, i think, there is a lag between the popping up of a potential issue and the public, organized response. i think you must add to this the perfect storm of a new owner (rossignol) along with a new product manager and i don't mean the guy who replaced superdave, but the guy who replaced the guy who replaced superdave (the guy in between got, from what i heard, a nice job outside the industry).

when we lose your faith in felt's ability to respond to customer service issues, we may as well throw in the towel. they don't really get much better than felt.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [loxx0050] [ In reply to ]
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if what you're saying is that you really want an affordable frameset and you want to take it from there, you are ahead of my editorial. here's a hint: when i write about building a plasma premium frameset, and an andean frameset, realize i could have gotten whole bikes from these companies. i asked specifically for framesets only.

behind the scenes i'm pushing for this. i'm kind of insulted by $6,500 framesets. we are all asking ourselves, and the industry is asking, what bike shops are going to be like in 5 or 10 years. i think one possible future is a pro shop a lot like they were when i started racing 40 years ago, where there were no complete bikes (or if there were nobody wanted them).

you buy your frame and then you hang parts. the parts you want. your shop does it or you do it. the frameset should cost between $1,000 and $4,000 depending on what comes with it (if you see everything that comes with the plasma premium you'll see why it's a bit pricey).

this is a necessary and compelling part of the pro bike and tri industry that is missing. i promise you this opening is going to be filled.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [kileyay] [ In reply to ]
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Barring the bullshit 3T interlocking seatpost angle adjustment system, the Felt IA is the best super bike out there from a component integration perspective. It's a tank from a heft perspective that doesn't feel too stiff when riding on rough roads (not like a KM40 or Softride, but nice). The brakes are great. The bars are great. The seat post is secure, the stem/bar interface is fantastic.

I do hate that there is a second width on the bars that makes them less attractive as well, so that's -2 points.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [chicanery] [ In reply to ]
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chicanery wrote:
Barring the bullshit 3T interlocking seatpost angle adjustment system, the Felt IA is the best super bike out there from a component integration perspective. It's a tank from a heft perspective that doesn't feel too stiff when riding on rough roads (not like a KM40 or Softride, but nice). The brakes are great. The bars are great. The seat post is secure, the stem/bar interface is fantastic.

I do hate that there is a second width on the bars that makes them less attractive as well, so that's -2 points.

Honestly, even with the issues I've had - I have zero buyers remorse and I apologize if I gave the impression that I do. If I had to make the choice again, I would buy the IA2 again in a heartbeat.

That being said; When you buy a super bike you expect a certain level of support and care from a vendor. And I think that's maybe where FELT fell down a bit here. I'm sure they will make it right and learn lessons going forward
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Greatzaa] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry I have been away for a while. I am currently recovering from a second round of surgery due to injuries sustained with my Felt bayonent 3 bracket failure. I do appreciate all of the input - I think this is how these things get fixed and at the same time I find a couple of things rather frustrating.

- I was actually able to get a hold of Felt right after the accident. I asked if they were any issues with this particular bracket, and was told no. I then found this forum and it's clear that that is just not the case. This is a very small sampling of cyclists and an alarming number of examples of bracket failures have been given. From a statistical standpoint , the total numbers of these types of failures are guaranteed to be much higher. Unfortunately there is no way for the consumer to know the number of failures, accidents or settlements that have occurred. And I understand it is a business, but a little honesty, I feel would go a long way. Why in the world would Felt have a redesigned bracket, if the current bracket had no issues?

-The continuous assertion by both Felt and others that the bracket failure was secondary to poor maintenance or poor installation. These are possibilities sure, but how can you know that w certainty? There is no mention of the possibility of a poor design by Felt.. My bike was maintained, the installation was done by a certified Felt distributor who sells an awful lot of Felt bikes. Many others have voiced the same experience. Several of my acquaintances who are engineers looked at the bracket and the first thing they said is that this is a poor design. There is an acute angle that looks like a significant stress point. The original post picture and my picture showed it failing along that exact crease. On the new bracket schematics provided by Felt, that area is rounded out and the acute angulation/stress area is gone. I find that to be somewhat telling. Just my opinion though.

- There has been a great deal of concern expressed over bracket (and brake) failures and subsequent potential crashes. A few have implied that maybe it's not that big of a deal. Let me assure you, its a big deal when it happens to you. I'm not saying that Felt doesn't make a fast bike. I Loved that bike, right up until my aero bar snapped out from under me. I would just like for Felt to let people know of the potential danger. Bike shops shouldn't have to stock spare parts (post #23) for the NEXT customer that has a failure like this. All bike companies have recalls. Felt has several recently - the steering tube cracking on TT bikes - recall issued in 2014 (bikes dating back to 2010), cyclocross frame breaks recall in 2014, OEM seat post on mountain bikes recall 2015, etc. I applaud them for doing the right thing and recalling those parts. In the back my mind I can't help but wonder what had to happen for those parts to be recalled? How many people REALLY got hurt? If brackets are failing and rear brake set ups just stop working and it takes this much discussion to get a reaction, how can you have trust in the company? Again, I agree Felt makes great bikes, but they need to do the things necessary to keep them safe.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:

now, what i think is going on, just my guess, is it's kind of like that equifax breach, where they knew a couple of months before we knew that there was a breach. you want to have your ducks in a row when everybody starts demanding action.

And of course the risk for both Equifax and Felt is that while you're "getting your ducks in a row" more people could get injured.

I'm not an MBA, but I always thought Tylenol was the business school case study on how to handle these things. Take instant and completely responsibility and pull product first. Then get your ducks in a row. Protects customers and your brand. Maybe Felt can't afford to do that, like Tylenol could. Equifax definitely should have done that. Their brand is ruined forever. I hope Felt's isn't, as an owner of 3 Felt bikes (which have astonished me with their ability to handle abuse).
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [trail] [ In reply to ]
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 I completely agree. Take responsibility. Be proactive instead of reactive. How about a little pushback against the status quo? Be the company that aggressively gets out in front of the problem before the injuries start to pile up...
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Mrfuzzypants] [ In reply to ]
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I reached out to my bike shop and asked for a set a clamps. They said they would get back to me to get things setup (this was yesterday).

I kinda want to ask them to just send me all the stuff that should be replaced...like the Calpac apparently?
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
badoc wrote:

this is sometimes why, i think, there is a lag between the popping up of a potential issue and the public, organized response. i think you must add to this the perfect storm of a new owner (rossignol) along with a new product manager and i don't mean the guy who replaced superdave, but the guy who replaced the guy who replaced superdave (the guy in between got, from what i heard, a nice job outside the industry). when we lose your faith in felt's ability to respond to customer service issues, we may as well throw in the towel. they don't really get much better than felt.

There has been no replacement for me at Felt. Scott, as the product manager, was there when I left. I'd participate in this and a dozen other forums as a means to keep tabs on a sector of consumers as well as dispel misinformation on the products I'd help conceive and create but it was never my job to be here nor was "customer service" in my job description. Jay and Gerard (not Vroomen) in customer service remain and were the guys that executed when someone here would contact me with an issue. I'd just operate the Slowtwitch switchboard for Felt's customer service team. Recently, the value in having participation in internet forums was prioritized at Felt and a ST user account created for Felt Bicycles. This is a noble step in providing an ear for the ST voice.
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Re: Felt IA aero bar fail [SuperDave] [ In reply to ]
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SuperDave wrote:
Recently, the value in having participation in internet forums was prioritized at Felt and a ST user account created for Felt Bicycles. This is a noble step in providing an ear for the ST voice.

funny how felt, trek, cervelo didn't think having a robust presence on internet forums or at least on this internet forum wasn't an important thing. and then i see dan kennison pop up with nothing other than an idea, no ads, no marketing, and he's got an owners thread with 500 or most posts on it.

fine. no big deal not having anybody on this forum. instead just pay a PR firm $3000 a month to send slowman press releases.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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