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Elliptical Trnr vs Running
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Quick Background:
I had knee surgery (lateral release due to malalignment of the patella) last February, eased back into running in July, coached Cross Country for our high school team (during which time I ran with the kids), and now my knee is hurting again.
Question:
I do not want this to keep me from doing triathlons, so I want to know the about the possibility of using an elliptical trainer for about 95% of my run workouts. Is this possible? How well will an ET prepare me to run the 13.1 miles for half-IM's this year? What does one lack by using the ET instead of running? Could it be made up for somewhere else? Basically, how effective are elliptical trainers?

[b]Thank you for any help and replies.[/b]
Zach
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Re: Elliptical Trnr vs Running [senorespanol] [ In reply to ]
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I am a bit reluctant to offer my advice since I am not a medical professional, coach, personal trainer, elite athlete, etc. I also don't know how much information you already have, so forgive me if my response rehashes over how much you already know. I am just a slightly above average triathlete who has experienced my fair share of injuries in the past few years.

I haven't used elipitcal trainers very much, since I don't like them. I feel like they have too much return in them, in otherwords, when you step with one foot, it lifts the other one. I don't feel like I get a very good workout out of them for the time I spend. Personally, if I couldn't run much as a triathlete, I would start with powercranks if I had the cash. Lots of positive feedback on how they improve running without needing to run as much. If I didn't have the cash, I would increase my cycling volume, and also spend as much time as I could stand on a stairmaster. The thing I don't like about this is that you have a somewhat low cadence on them compared to running, but at least the legs are independent of each other like in running. So the idea is that you get most of your aerobic conditioning from cycling, and get your muscular conditioning from the stairmaster. I have never used this method for triathlons, but being unable to run much in the past due to injuries, I do know that I was able to keep up a relatively good level of fitness on the stairmaster. The problem is I couldn't imagine doing it for much more than 30-45 minutes. Maybe a mixture of water running and stairmaster, with a high cycling volume would do well.

Anyways, I sympathize with you on not being able to run. I have been fighting lower leg problems for several years now, which finally culminated into a stress fracture. It sucks big time, but I'm not ready to give up on the fight.

I actually wanted to also suggest getting multiple opinions on your injury. I have seen many doctors and many PT's in the last 2 years for various injuries, and it seems they all have different opinions. The one thing that I was common with the knee is that it requires the muscles to be balanced. I spent a lot of time strengthening my legs when I had misalignment and ITB problems this past winter (2 hrs, 3x per week). I was at a very good PT center where the University of Michigan athletes are treated. They kicked my butt in there, but they fixed me up. Have you been through a rigorous strengthening program for your knees?

Good luck, Jack

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"What the mind can conceive and believe, the mind and body can achieve; and those who stay will be champions."
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Re: Elliptical Trnr vs Running [senorespanol] [ In reply to ]
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Purely anecdotal evidence, but one of my clients has been using the elliptical since early July in an attempt to get through her first full season on a pretty beat up leg (due to a tendency to be a tad clumsy on her part).

She has done virtually all of her run training on the machine including interval work and long "runs" of up to 90 minutes. She is definitely working it hard and longs for the day when she can get off the darn machine!

Despite not being able to really run for 3 months, she has not lost a thing and her run splits have improved with each race.

She has only done Olympic distance races, but I see no reason why the elliptical wouldn't work just as well for 1/2's.

G


It's a little like wrestling a gorilla.........you don't stop when you're tired.........you stop when the gorilla is tired.
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Re: Elliptical Trnr vs Running [Jack in Mi] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the advice, Jack.
I have not gone through a rigorous strengthening program, although I would love to. I have the time and energy, just not the facilities or the know-how. I live in Alaska and there is not a lot a help as far as that goes. What sort of strength training did you do?

Zach
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Re: Elliptical Trnr vs Running [senorespanol] [ In reply to ]
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wow, Alaska huh. This may be an ignorant statement you hear from people in the lower 48 all the time, but I can't imagine there are a lot of skinny dudes riding around on aerobars up there.

Anyways, I did a lot of stability drills. Stand on one leg, slightly bent and do various motions to work all the stabilizing muscles in the leg. Sometimes they would have me stand on an unstable platform and bounce a ball, or I would wrap a theraband around one leg and move in it various directions while standing on the other. Another drill had cones set up around me in a semi-circle and I would have to bend on one leg and touch the various cones. All of these were pretty difficult. The other thing I would do was leg press. I would do two-leg, one-leg, and one-leg eccentric. The eccentric just means up with two, down with one. Basically, I would do the most amount of weight with two legs, then maybe 70-80% of the two-leg weight eccentric, then 40-50% of the two-leg weight on one leg. 3 sets of each. The goal was to get to failure on 15 reps, in otherwords not be able to do the 15th or 16th repitition. These were extremely hard, especially the eccentric and one leg. I would start at a given weight on the first set. I would do as many reps as I could up to 18. Even if I could do more than 18 I would stop. The next set I would increase the weight. As long as I could do at least 13, and no more than 18, I would leave the weight were it was. The PT said that all the athletes at Michigan have to be able to do something like 20, one-leg reps, of their own body weight before they could participate in activities. That was pretty much the goal he gave me.

I also did adductors (or abductors, I can't remember which-it was the one where the resistance is against you as you pull your legs together). Only, he had me straighten my legs in front of me, in otherwords, I sat down, and my legs were straight at a 90 deg angle from my torso, with my toes pointed towards the ceiling. These were very hard as well, as it was difficult to keep the legs straight while doing the exercise.

I always warmed up for 10 minutes on a stationary bike before hand, and stretched, holding each stretch for a minute. I went into the PT with pain in my knees everyday, and after I had left I didn't have any pain, and I had a full season, putting more miles running and on the bike than last year, without any pain.

The basic problem I was having was tracking of the knee, which may not be as serious as what you had. Essentially, some of the muscles in the leg can get stronger on one side than the other, and pull the knee over, causing it to rub incorrectly and result in pain. I think I might have some diagrams of the exercises they gave me, if you want me to scan them and send them to you. Just send me your email address - I'm aeroj27@hotmail.com.

Another thing that I did was get the "Pain Free Triathlete" from www.julstro.com. This really helped relieve the immediate symptoms of my ITB pain, although I feel the strengthing exercises is what really got rid of the problems. Julstro.com has a forum you can post questions to, you might also want to try that.

As far as the elliptical goes, I just gave my personal opinion, which isn't based on extensive use, I know a lot of people that seem to like it, I'm just not sold on it. But if it's all you can do, it's definitely worth a shot. Hope this helps,

Jack

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"What the mind can conceive and believe, the mind and body can achieve; and those who stay will be champions."
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Re: Elliptical Trnr vs Running [Jack in Mi] [ In reply to ]
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Jack,

Not an ignorant statement in the least. Most people here have never in their life heard of aerobars, or thought of doing triathlons for that matter, and if they did it would involve sports more like hot cocoa sipping, doughnut dipping, or at the most snowmachining. And they probably think aerobars are some kind of new fat free candy.

Thanks a ton for those insights and excercises. I will e-mail you to get the excercises. I went to a chiropractor/physical therapist today who actually does do triathlons and he gave me a couple excercises as well as wanting me to get checked to see if orthotics would be beneficial. Your knee problem is exactly the same as mine it sounds like.

It's great to have people like you on the forum that will offer a lot of help.

Zach
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