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Drafting at 70.3 WC
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I have seen this discussed a LOT on this forum and for a while I thought people were overreacting.....Boy was I wrong. The drafting packs today were absurd. I have hammering away at a pretty good pace and a pack of 20-30 people went by me like I was standing still. I am glad I opted to race clean and not join the packs....It happened mulitple times. It was absolutely disgusting!!! People complain about people doping and winning their AG, I think people drafting is just as bad.....Very disappointed in many racers today....
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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x2
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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x3
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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Your at a race with the best what 2000 athletes in the world. Either accept it, race your own race, or just move on to another race series. You aren't going to race an WTC top level event clean. We can all play the blame game, but it's not going to get better, it's just changing the density of the actual drafters. So either talk with your wallet and go somewhere else, or accept we all are the problem.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [BDoughtie] [ In reply to ]
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So you mis-understood my comments. I do not blame WTC at ALL. I never complain about WTC and love racing Ironman and 70.3 Ironman, that is why I support them financially through race fees. They put on great races, well organized and great events.

At some point, athletes need to be accountable for their own actions. I feel good about my race, I raced clean and earned my time. I get pissed when people blatantly draft in huge packs. It is the first WC I have qualified for and was disappointed that you most likely have athletes that could have solid races racing clean yet they choose to cheat.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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This was my first WC and the drafting was abominable. I saw at least 6 packs and was stuck around one for a portion of 117. I tried 5 times to get through and away and finally got ahead and stayed ahead after the 5th try only to have the same pack pass me with 3 miles to go. The worst part was the referee who came through after they freight trained by me the first time and all the ref did was wave his arms like 'spread out'. He followed them for a few more minutes and waved his arms again. I took the opportunity to get through (attempt number 1) as the pack slowed down and expected to hear cards being drawn. Instead moto-ref motored on by. Wtf? Isn't it your job to make them spread out by giving penalties? Give it to the lot of them, bet it won't happen again if you do. By waving your arms and moving on, all you are doing it precipitating the behavior.

That said, a great town, great venue and fantastic course. The weather could not have possibly been better and it was very cool seeing all of the different countries represented.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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You're to blame. You should take PEDs to avoid packs.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [Minicane] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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I think Brooks understood perfectly. If you want it to be different, demand it of the RD. If we all boycotted over-crowded/ under-officiated races than things might change. Or get less crowded!

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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MadisonMan wrote:
So you mis-understood my comments.
I do not blame WTC at ALL. I never complain about WTC and love racing Ironman and 70.3 Ironman, that is why I support them financially through race fees. They put on great races, well organized and great events.

At some point, athletes need to be accountable for their own actions. I feel good about my race, I raced clean and earned my time. I get pissed when people blatantly draft in huge packs. It is the first WC I have qualified for and was disappointed that you most likely have athletes that could have solid races racing clean yet they choose to cheat.


Read this post and then reconsider. http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...post=5239028#5239028

"The biggest joke is that when I complained about the massive 50/60+ draft packs that were forming on the 117, the answer from the head referee (very nice and approchable guy btw) he said WTC had taken on race morning 3 of the motorbikes that were supposed to bust drafters to turn them into media motorbikes... "

If this guy is telling the truth, then this just epitomizes where WTC's priorities are. Sacrifice the integrity of the 2000+ person race so that WTC can get a few more photos for publication. Because, that's what "media motorbikes" means; you certainly don't make a last-minute call to convert a motorcycle from a drafting to media and expect it to provide livestream video, so this was all about getting a few more guys with cameras out there at the expense of them being drafting marshals instead.

If true, this also is an indication of the bush league operation that WTC really is when you scratch below the surface. This is a friggin' World Championship and they are making gametime calls for stuff like this? Who is running the show? It is so bush league that I am skeptical to believe that this account is actually true.

But, if it is, everyone who raced and was impacted by drafting, ie everyone, should be furious.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [3Aims] [ In reply to ]
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3Aims wrote:
x3

X4

There were packs of 50+ on the 117. If they DQ a few packs on a few races, I am sure this would change. Not doing anything is implicitely accepting the drafting.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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The packs were worse than Clearwater. Mutiple packs and pacelines with officials following behind and not doing anything about it. As a slow swimmer and strong cyclist, it is frustrating to ride a clean race and watch so many athletes cheat and podium. No longer excited about racing 70.3 Worlds in Austria next year. On a positive note, Mont-Tremblant is an amazing venue, course was well managed, volunteers were awesome, etc.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [frenchieTT] [ In reply to ]
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x5.. I only saw three big peletons though, each with riders running a pace line about a bike length apart with 20-30 riders in each group. I hope their bike splits were awesome.

Dave
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [kny] [ In reply to ]
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WTC's 'world championships' are no different than(American) Football WC: self-declared, and no official world-wide sporting institution behind it. Long as folks suck up to WTC and shell out for the privilege and bragging rights of the almighty m-dot, nothing is going to change. I went to the first so-called 70.3 worlds in Clearwater in 2006 While solidly buried MOP, I came home disillusioned. The drafting being effectively and officially sanctioned by not penalizing the ridiculously numerous and massive drafting packs was real eye opener. Good to see that nuthin' changed in 8 years.

Flame away ;).
Last edited by: stephanl: Sep 7, 14 18:28
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [BDoughtie] [ In reply to ]
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Folks love to just bitch, bitch, but spend their money going to a race knowing exactly what will happen.

I know I complained about drafting at the first 3 WC's I went to.. But after many comments like yours, when I went to Edmonton, I was not going to worry about it.
What I did is all that I cared about. There was nothing I could do about what others did so why put all that negative energy into the race I was doing which
was a celebration of my seasons success.

.

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [BDoughtie] [ In reply to ]
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BDoughtie wrote:
Your at a race with the best what 2000 athletes in the world. Either accept it, race your own race, or just move on to another race series. You aren't going to race an WTC top level event clean. We can all play the blame game, but it's not going to get better, it's just changing the density of the actual drafters. So either talk with your wallet and go somewhere else, or accept we all are the problem.

Fully agree with this. WTC championships are self-proclaimed and are intended to enhance their market share. Nothing wrong with this at all--but in this model, there isn't a lot of incentive to change their enforcement of the rules UNLESS they have a significant drop in registrations as a result of their practices. I don't see this happening, as a good number of the participants are there for the overall experience, in addition to the competition. I suspect that for a good number of them, the value of the experience outweighs the competition itself. Now, this is notwithstanding the values of specific people; but taken as a culture, the packs are part of the WTC experience.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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its the new comers to the sport and some of the oldies that just say i you cant beat them join them.

I had a newbie tell me last week the draft zone was 1.2 meters. I corrected him saying its 12 meters.

He didnt believe me. Even after showing him the rules on my phone.

I dont draft. My times on the bike pretty much confirm that.



Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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And I just wanted my comment to have some meaningful background. When you put that many people (especially the talent of those people) on a course, your going to have drafting. Athletes aren't going to race "clean" if they can get away with it, and race organizers let them get away with it. And it's not going to get better. We are a sport that is built on you the AG athletes. Pissing you off doesn't make them money, and you all obviously aren't bothered by drafting because you sign up in record numbers for races every single year. Economics at work a hell of a lot more than athletics here in this decision making process.

So just come to accept it, that's what AG racing is, especially at this big races. So cue this same thread in 4 weeks after Kona.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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Almost 10 70.3's after the first one and every year people are surprised that drafting is this bad?

It's absurd to be shocked.

Many WTC events are ITU light for the age group fields.

Brian Stover
Accelerate3 Coaching
twitter & IG = @accelerate3
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [desert dude] [ In reply to ]
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Just look at the bike course and then it should be clear to anybost with half a brain that this was going to be a problem.

Choosing a draft averse and fair bike course it not high on WTC's priority list.

Must live in a cave to not have gotten that message yet.



desert dude wrote:
Almost 10 70.3's after the first one and every year people are surprised that drafting is this bad?

It's absurd to be shocked.

Many WTC events are ITU light for the age group fields.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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You guys are really naive for signing up for this expecting a clean race. There are huge drafting packs every year. It's the norm, not the exception.

WTC would pack 5000 athletes on a course if they thought they could get away with it. Cha-ching!

Start a thread on what a real world championship 70.3 would look like and STOP GOING TO WTC "World Championships".

Prediction: Austria next year will have huge drafting packs. Shocking!

I choose to close out my tri season at a local non-WTC 1/2 where I can start in wave 1 and generally have the course to my self while I swim, bike, run up and down the Cali coastline and my family gets to hang at the beach.. And the cost to sign up 3 weeks before the race is $206 (with active.com fees). And I'll be home for dinner.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [windschatten] [ In reply to ]
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yeah it's crazy that people think it's not going to be problem. Can't wait for Oct when they complain about IMH and it's drafting.

Even the pro's know that WTC AG races are often going to be draft fests.

Jan Frodeno

Slowtwitch: Does the necessity of being hyper aware of everyone around you to avoid getting a drafting call in this type of racing make it hard on you?

Jan: You know its the way the sport is...... And I think we do have good marshals out there - within their measures they are absolutely fair. It's a good thing y'know? In the pro race, it works. With age groupers I see it as quite difficult. Because there are just too many out there for a course of this size.

Brian Stover
Accelerate3 Coaching
twitter & IG = @accelerate3
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [djmercer] [ In reply to ]
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X6. I couldn't believe how big the packs were. And it seemed like everyone in them was quite content to stay there. Frustrating, but nothing you can do about it when you are out there. The best part of my day was coming into T2 and seeing 5 or 6 guys in the tent. At least they were popping some people.

____________________________________________________
TriSports.com | Towpath Bike Shop | Nuun | Honey Stinger | My Blog | Twitter
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [desert dude] [ In reply to ]
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"Almost 10 70.3's after the first one and every year people are surprised that drafting is this bad?

It's absurd to be shocked. "



As MadisonMan stated it was his first WC event. I think it is absurd for someone to expect such blatant cheating at a WC event.
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Re: Drafting at 70.3 WC [MadisonMan] [ In reply to ]
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Where the pros drafting? That's all the really matters. Rest of us just have to do the best we can!
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