well she won the race didn't she?

when this was going on I was thinking "she's more popular than you, she's got more name recognition than you, more sponsors than you, she's got more pal mares than you... now is the time to *crush* her, regardless of friendship.

What happens on the performance stage and what happens off of it are two separate things.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I would say her ambition was top 3. Once first was secured, there was zero incentive to chase a PR.

I agree she won the race but she could have run faster and only left Flanagan once she saw Linden was getting too close for comfort.

Cragg probably benefited from running with Flanagan on the early stages so that makes their alliance different from the Chrabot-Sanders one which was one sided. But once Flanagan lost her wheels, there was no competitive benefit for Cragg to wait for her.

faster for what? Shits and giggles? She's a grown-ass woman, earning a paycheck, crushing dreams and snagging Rio slots. Mission accomplished

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I think the fact that Cragg had her own rough patch earlier on during the race that Flanagan helped her negotiate makes it very easy for me to commend rather than condemn her.

Well done Amy C.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

The first ambition of every pro marathoners is to win, NOT to run as fast as possible, like us amateurs. Breaking world records or qualifying for something is always a secondary goal to winning it all. They are there to make money, not to brag about a PR.

If it was their intention to run as fast as possible, they wouldn't slow down to wave to the fans. They would dictate their own pace instead of strategizing their pace based on the pack.

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My marathon PR is "under three, high twos. I had a two hour and fifty-something."

I don't disagree :)

I just find the parallel with our prior discussions interesting. People were very harsh on Chrabot-Sanders, but I didn't see anybody comment on Flanagan-Cragg. I am interested in understanding the differences in what are somewhat similar situations.

Exactly. The purpose was simply to qualify for Olympics. Hopefully with her friend and training partner. Mission accomplished.
Her ambition was to qualify.

No, Cragg did not. The whole goal was for BOTH of them to make the team. That was the only GOAL. Personal ambitions clearly did not matter. PR's, wins, money whatever.

They said before the race they were going to run together and stay together, no matter what. They said training alone was too difficult and they needed each other to get through the trials, and get through the training for Rio, so they needed to do this together. One making it and one not was simply not an option. You need to read their pre-race interviews.

Considering the heat, a PR was probably going to be difficult. Amy's PR was 2:27 so for her, yes it was possible. No way Shalane was going to PR, no way, as she was injured in the fall. Her PR is like 2:21. Did Shalane's meltdown cost Amy a PR? Maybe but I seriously doubt Amy cares. She needs Shalane as her training partner for Rio, and that trumps pretty much everything else.

Sometimes its not about the money, the win, the PR. Its about being a best friend, a training partner, a teammate and simply sticking with a plan for a bigger goal (Rio).

It will be interesting to see what happens in Rio. I doubt it will be as friendly. If both are in a medal position, hell yes, they will stay together. If one is clearly having the better day, I would assume the other will allow the other to go.

Cragg said that in the middle of the race, Flanagan helped drag her through a really rough patch. In a race like there, where the elite field is so, so small, it makes sense to "share the load." What happened there was more like TO, Frodeno, and Kienle breaking away after the descent from Hawi. Working together to all help each other. I'd say that was reflected in the fact that they finished 1st and 3rd, both punching their tickets to Rio...

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Interesting view. To simplify, are we saying it is OK to work together as long as all parties each benefit from the alliance?

"It will be interesting to see what happens in Rio. I doubt it will be as friendly. If both are in a medal position, hell yes, they will stay together. If one is clearly having the better day, I would assume the other will allow the other to go. "

For sure, just like it will be interesting to see the dynamics between Rupp & Meb.

You also have to realize that the rules are different for professional marathon racing and professional ironman racing. In a marathon, the only prohibited pacing is pacing by lapped runners and by non-participants. (Of course, they also don't recognize records set in races where it's possible for women to pace off of men.)

Uh, this was the Olympic trials, right? Winning is nice, but unlike other races the goal of everyone on the start is to qualify. Three winners and dozens of losers. She's going to Rio, that is all that matters. You won't see the same level of cooperation there.

But if it was to run as fast as possible it seems like she did surrender that.

There is this strange magical force that takes over when you get in front of an endurance sports race like a marathon and the competitors all start to fade away and you are really starting to run away with it, and move away from everyone - sometimes, you can actually get off the gas!


I was good moderately good runner and triathlete, but it was a rare race when I was in that situation - out front, others fading away and running away with it. Suddenly you go from a sort-of TT mode with your foot on the gas, all the time, to a mode where, you realize, I can back off a bit, and still win this. It's a luxurious moment, I can tell you!

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Rather a presumptuous statement. "Dozens of losers" is a rather uninformed opinion. I know the gal in 10th quite well, who made a huge leap from past years and couldn't be happier--a breakthrough performance season. Happen to also know other gals in the field personally, who are so thrilled with their performance they couldn't have asked for a better turn out. For many women (and men), competing in the Trials is a life dream, even if making the team is unrealistic. The losers are actually winners & undoubtedly will mark it down as one of their greatest accomplishments of their career.

And all the coverage of them working together is a much better "story" for their future sponsors. I'd say it was brilliant and will probably pay them both a lot more than a win and a chance that the 3'rd becomes a 4'th.

Of course there are folks for whom the trials is their Olympics as they had zero chance of making the team. But that doesn't change the fact that this was a selection race and you either made it or did not. For those with lower goals, sure they can win based on their own standards ... I do the same ... But in the context of the purpose of the race, anyone not in the top three lost. That is just a cold hard fact.

she won

Yes. As long as they operate within the rules. For example, drafting can be a significant benefit in road racing (running). You're better off sharing that load with someone than each of you running by yourself. That's just smart racing.

If you really want it to be a truly solo effort, there are disciplines for that.

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

There's a good Runner's World interview from today with Shalane Flanigan about how the race unfolded. It gets into their team tactics pretty well:

http://www.runnersworld.com/...t-the-olympic-trials

Thank you for that link!

Best line in the interview is when she says she does not know why she had hydration issues: "I feel embarrassed at this stage that I don�t know, but it�s the first time I�ve run a marathon in this type of weather and these kinds of conditions. London [2012 Olympics] is probably the closest�it was like 60s, not terribly warm, but I still had some trouble there as well, with cramping. The fact that my face turned bright red shows that something�s not right."

For those of us who still make stupid mistakes when training and racing it is reassuring to hear that a top pro with access to the smartest people in the business does not have all the answers to something as basic as race hydration. Mid-70s in LA in February is not that unusual - you would think they would have planned for that.

Wine & donuts, huh?

We've come a long way since the beer & pizza days

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"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
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