It's a feedback loop. The kickr drives a power and sees what the power meter reads. If the kicker is demanding 200 but sees the PM is only sensing 180W, it upps the resistance till the PM reading matches intended power interval. It obviously happens much faster than it takes to explain.

Version 1.1.3.26 is up today. Enabled power meter control of Kickr and it worked great. Got the green dot and did two Trainer Road sessions. SRM and Kickr now very close.

Only two problems I saw:

seemed like it took the Kickr longer to come to a new power level that using the internal power meter -- a slower ramp

Did lose control of the Kickr once about 45 minutes in. Long Scream has very short, 4 second I think, rests intervals. After one, the Kickr did not go back up to the greater resistance. I put it into a spindown calibration. The Kickr did not successfully go into calibration mode, so I cancelled. The Kickr was then back to erg mode as it should.

All in all, very nice -- and quick updates. Thank you Wahoo!

Just installed .26 and it looks like it's working fine with my Power2Max. Didn't do an exhaustive test, just a few 1min intervals increasing +10 W from 100 to 200W and they most intervals were spot on with my lap power on the Garmin.

Is there a trick to getting the Wahooligan (aka Wahoo Fitness Beta) app? That Aussie post says

Step 1 is to download the latest Wahoo Fitness beta app. Follow the link below and tap install on the webpage and tap install when prompted. The test app is called Wahooligan and is a beta version of the Wahoo Fitness app. Follow the link below on your iDevice, tap “Install” and tap “Install” when prompted.
Link to App: https://rink.hockeyapp.net/...7abc/app_versions/14
when I open that link (tried on MBP, iPhone 5, 6...), I'm prompted to sign in on hockeyapp. After doing that and opening that link again, it opens up in Dashboard/Apps and says "No apps found for this account or device."

Wahoo noted on my blog they were removing the beta app link because it wasn't supposed to become public.

Anyone figured out how this software handles a TR FTP test when the KICKR switches from erg mode to resistance mode? Does it give an accurate value for the FTP test effort, was wondering if the "Use power from electronic trainer" box should be deselected for tests so the result is absolutley accurate from the PM? If it's taking power values from the KICKR while in resistance mode then I'm guessing there will still be error?

I don't think the fix is limited to ERG mode so the numbers should be similar. Run a Garmin in parallel and get the average lap power for the 20 min interval anyway.

Bummer, thanks Felt_Rider:(

I upgraded the firmware to 1.1.3.26 to see if this might make any difference, but it didn't. I feel like on top of whatever is going on with everyone else's Kickrs, I may have a particularly unhealthy one - it's a replacement one (my original one was great until it stopped being discovered by blutetooth all of a sudden..) and it always felt flimsy, noisy, and gave me suspiciously easy watts. Will see what Wahoo Support says..

so you can't get green dot ? or ? ........... i couldn't either until i followed the instructions word for word. For some reason i was trying to get the app so pair with my external PM instead of just inputing it's ID

Making sure I understand. .23 is now out of beta and included in the .26 firmware update?

I think the problem for Frisky is not having access to the wahooligan app.

No need to hit the "Use power from electronic trainer". What will happen is the Kickr will just imitate a mag trainer. TR will still read the Quarq power. So it should work just perfect :).

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CEO at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast

Of course, thanks for clarifying that Nate.

Probably an unfair question to ask you given that this is Wahoo software and an unofficial beta but do you have any idea if the "Use power from electronic trainer" option should be selected or deselected when running this software and an external PM in general use with TR software? The actual power figure reported on the screen with TR is still not quite in line with my Vectors (but much closer than it was) and I wonder if perhaps I should be deselecting this option?

Oh, and thanks for the amazing software - TR is truly awesome and has revolutionised my winter training! Keep up the great work!!

It should be deselected. I just did a workout with version .26 of the beta with the Kickr and Quarq PM. Best results yet. Over a 110 minute workout, NP was identical measured directly from the Quarq (using my Garmin) and from the Kickr (using TR). Difference of only one watt in average power.

I just want to get a clarification. Once I get the .26 update, would I still need the iOS app running to get TR to use the power from my power2max? Also is there are way to update my Kickr without using an iOS device? Thanks

I check for the green dot before I start the workout, but otherwise I don't have the Wahooligans app running (I don't completely kill it--it's in the background--but it's not tracking the workout). All I have running is TR. I don't know of any way to get the update except through an iOS device, and even then, if you didn't get your hands on the beta earlier, I think they've now prevented access to it until the official public release.

While I think you can still upgrade to .26 you need the modified Wahooligan app to be able to configure the external PM into the Kickr. Unfortunately they pulled that app from the initial download location because they're not allowed to publish unapproved apps outside the Apple App Store.

I would assume the workout "felt" harder considering you now have the "correct" power and not 15-20 below what you thought you were doing.

That should also be reflected in higher HR's as well...

Is that what you are seeing?

Sorry, where do I find this firmware app? I can't seem to find it anywhere?
Thanks

Yes. The workout felt right, and the data looks right.

Thanks man :).

You should NOT have that checked if you're using the Kickr...I think. I haven't used it but one of my employees has. He didn't have it checked and his numbers were right in line. I'm guessing if you check that box it would just re-broadcast what your Quarq is putting out, so there's really no reason to have it checked.

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CEO at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast

This beta has me confused. I just did a light 45 minute spin, and the Kickr power (through TR) and my Quarq power (through my Garmin) are off again (by ~13 watts). After having been nearly identical yesterday. Strange.

I suppose that is why there seems to be a delay for Wahoo to release this as a solution as they work through the firmware updates. I upgraded to .26 over the weekend and Saturday's training looked even tighter in the overall metrics than .24, but maybe I got lucky on that one workout. I will see how it goes this coming week, but one thing I will continue to do is use my Garmin Edge to record the Quarq so that data will be on the money. I also continue to glance at both the Edge display and the data on TrainerRoad laptop reading as a comparison during the ride. So far the Quarq / Edge display seems be a few watts higher than what I see on the laptop display. The Kickr's power is not being used at all and I trust the Quarq so I feel confident in hitting my interval targets.

Right now I use the same TR workouts each week as I like a certain structure, but this also helps me regulate and progress in the intervals based on RPE as well. I keep track of these weekly workouts in a spreadsheet and by using the % button in TR I bump each workout up by a couple of watts each week until I begin to really struggle with completing the intervals. Once I begin to struggle with completing I sit at those targets until my body adapts to the stress load. So not only do I have my Quarq data to look at in WKO I also go by feel on increasing the training load incrementally. If my body adapts I then begin to increase the load again. There seem to be a multiple ways of skinning this cat and this is how I am trying to use the Kickr (with its imperfections) in order to meet my goal.

I feel like I can use this trainer and I like the way it feels and works with TR so I am content on keeping it. I am not sure how I will feel once I can add wireless control to my eMotion rollers, which I hope will allow me to use my power meter to control ERG in TR. If that works well I may start splitting my training time between the two. To me the eMotion rollers have an awesome feel to them, but I would like to have ERG control for the short intense intervals to control the TrainerRoad sessions. I have done TR workouts with the rollers, but I have to watch the display constantly and I would rather be able to just grit my teeth and the let the programmed workout control my love for discomfort.

It sure helps that there are a number of us discussing the Kickr because it sure seems like Wahoo isn't going to help anyone. I suppose they operate on "silence is golden" to those who are shelling out $1K per unit and are confused as to how to use this trainer with greater accuracy. Makes me all the more grateful to the Brand Reps willing to openly help users on this board and other forums.

+1 on this.

I have my initial impression in an early post in the thread and since then have continued to be pleased with this workaround. Over a handful of additional workouts, things continue to match for me within 1-2 watts. For whatever reason (gear selection? just my unit), I don't seem to get drift during my workouts apart from maybe the first 3-5 minutes. In my opinion this is worth a try for anyone seeing this problem. I will say that a friend also gave it a try and didn't have as much success; he was still seeing some drift during his workout...

In TR, if you have a Quarq and a Kickr paired and you DON'T have "Use trainer as power source" checked we'll record the Quarq data every second. The Kickr firmware won't affect that.

Any live number difference you see between your Edge and TR is likely due to display smoothing settings on either/both units.

So just to be clear, the Kickr firmware won't affect us picking up your ANT+ power meter and recording that data.

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CEO at TrainerRoad
Co-host of the Ask a Cycling Coach Podcast