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Body Marking
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I keep wondering if bodymarking at big ironman races like Ironman Texas is optional? There were a lot of people going for a KQ and it seems to me that not having your age on your calf or any where else for that matter gives you an advantage and could be cheating or giving them an unfair advantage. I am not saying your should be dq bur at least you should
Be marked before entering the run course.


Its one thing if the ink rubs off and you are wearing compression but not getting body marked. it definitely gives an advantage in the last few kilometers to no have your age marked if your are passing someone.

What should Ironman do? Should there be a penalty or sanction?
Last edited by: labala: Apr 25, 17 5:39
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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I thought body marking was supposed to be a safety precaution to ensure you could be identified if you lost your number or weren't wearing it in the water etc.
I don't agree that it's like cheating if someone doesn't advertise their age group to other runners...unless this were mandatory.

Is your argument that you deserve to know if you need to beat someone so you can summon up the will to push harder, when you might otherwise let them go?
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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There is no rule, WTC or USAT, that actually requires body marking. I had marker bleed ruin a brand new tri suit about 7 years ago and I have skipped body marking at every race since... but I made sure there wasn't a rule I was breaking.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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To your questions
No
No

Most races doesn't matter anyway as they're self seeded and/or rolling starts
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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Body marking is mostly a throwback to Triathlon yesteryear before chip timing. That said, I think it's a good tradition, and actually still serves some good purposes. I announced a race 2 weeks ago, and the only way I could identify participants was their race bib (turned around backwards most of the time) or their body marking. Also:
  • Helps age group participants compete with each other.
  • Helps race photographers identify athletes.
  • Helps referees fairly administer penalties.
  • Mark of achievement for some competitors who aren't too cool to immediately wash it off.
  • Can be used by backup timers in case your chip fails.
  • Helps identify course cutters and cheaters.

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Re: Body Marking [nickwhite] [ In reply to ]
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My take has been that body marking is really for the photographers so they tag you and sell you ridiculously priced photo packets.
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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labala wrote:
I keep wondering if bodymarking at big ironman races like Ironman Texas is optional? There were a lot of people going for a KQ and it seems to me that not having your age on your calf or any where else for that matter gives you an advantage and could be cheating or giving them an unfair advantage. I am not saying your should be dq bur at least you should
Be marked before entering the run course.


Its one thing if the ink rubs off and you are wearing compression but not getting body marked. it definitely gives an advantage in the last few kilometers to no have your age marked if your are passing someone.

What should Ironman do? Should there be a penalty or sanction?

I'm one of those peeps you're referring to. I don't really see the point of body marking--although I did mark myself up the night before. I think that the 2 applications of sunscreen plus shaving my legs morning of the race negated some of the marking. By the end there really wasn't much except my Nytro tattoos. FWIW 15 years ago I don't think age was being written on anyone's calves. As you said, some racers where compression socks (mostly run, some on bike) so the marking area where the age goes is covered up.

The only way to require it would be for the race to give everyone tats and have the ag tat placed on the back of the lower thigh. The tats seem to stay on and were visible on people for the entire race and even the day after.

The only thing you can really do is look at the start list; memorize the bib numbers of the people you are directly racing against and check their bibs during the run.

leslie myers
http://www.foodsensenow.com
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Re: Body Marking [Honey] [ In reply to ]
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I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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labala wrote:
I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.
on most days, even if i know or don't know the age of people in front of me; I'm pushing as hard as I possibly can. Knowing their age won't necessarily make me run faster......

leslie myers
http://www.foodsensenow.com
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Re: Body Marking [nickwhite] [ In reply to ]
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nickwhite wrote:
  • Helps age group participants compete with each other.

How is this a reason when we now have a majority races doing rolling starts? You could be the first in your AG to come across the finish line BUT still not get 1st place because another who started 5 minutes after you finished the race 3 minutes faster....
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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labala wrote:
I keep wondering if bodymarking at big ironman races like Ironman Texas is optional? There were a lot of people going for a KQ and it seems to me that not having your age on your calf or any where else for that matter gives you an advantage and could be cheating or giving them an unfair advantage. I am not saying your should be dq bur at least you should
Be marked before entering the run course.


Its one thing if the ink rubs off and you are wearing compression but not getting body marked. it definitely gives an advantage in the last few kilometers to no have your age marked if your are passing someone.

What should Ironman do? Should there be a penalty or sanction?

What they should do is what Ironman Europe did several years ago - get rid of bodymarking completely. I did both IM South Africa and Texas this month. South Africa (under the IM Europe portfolio) did not have body markers period. No age, no numbers, no nothing. No one bought tri tats, no one marked themselves. The helmet number, bike number and bib are sufficient. As with other IM Europe races, I got a full suite of photos from Finisher Pix, which proves that they don't need them. Since I race in a sleeved suit, my 4 digit number at Texas was nothing more than an illegible black smear on my forearm.

You would think that they would standardize this across all races. The only reason I can think of that body marking persists in North America is that maybe the companies that sell number tats are paying WTC to keep it alive. Really, what else can it be?
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Re: Body Marking [SwizBeats] [ In reply to ]
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SwizBeats wrote:
nickwhite wrote:

  • Helps age group participants compete with each other.


How is this a reason when we now have a majority races doing rolling starts? You could be the first in your AG to come across the finish line BUT still not get 1st place because another who started 5 minutes after you finished the race 3 minutes faster....


Not correct. A majority of triathlons do not have rolling starts. But for Ironman, it would be less helpful.
Last edited by: nickwhite: Apr 25, 17 12:10
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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labala wrote:
I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.

Could just color code all the bibs. Blue bibs: 30-34, red bibs: 35-39, etc.


--Chris
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Re: Body Marking [chriselam] [ In reply to ]
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chriselam wrote:
labala wrote:
I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.


Could just color code all the bibs. Blue bibs: 30-34, red bibs: 35-39, etc.


Great idea!!!!!! I am one of those guys that stopped doing body marking as well. It comes off half the time to. I know the guys i am up against for the most part, i normally talk to the guys that are passing me as well. Honestly to when people pass me on run its not like i am going to be able to catch them.

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Body Marking [nickwhite] [ In reply to ]
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nickwhite wrote:
SwizBeats wrote:
nickwhite wrote:

  • Helps age group participants compete with each other.


How is this a reason when we now have a majority races doing rolling starts? You could be the first in your AG to come across the finish line BUT still not get 1st place because another who started 5 minutes after you finished the race 3 minutes faster....


Not correct. A majority of triathlons do not have rolling starts. But for Ironman, it would be less helpful.


Isn't Ironman the only triathlon people care about...
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Re: Body Marking [BBLOEHR] [ In reply to ]
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BBLOEHR wrote:
chriselam wrote:
labala wrote:
I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.


Could just color code all the bibs. Blue bibs: 30-34, red bibs: 35-39, etc.



Great idea!!!!!! I am one of those guys that stopped doing body marking as well. It comes off half the time to. I know the guys i am up against for the most part, i normally talk to the guys that are passing me as well. Honestly to when people pass me on run its not like i am going to be able to catch them.
When you say "talk to the guys that are passing me" are you asking their age? I'd love to see that conversation followed by two adults hammering the last 5k of a race.
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Re: Body Marking [TryScott] [ In reply to ]
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TryScott wrote:
BBLOEHR wrote:
chriselam wrote:
labala wrote:
I think they could just place a small square on your Bib number with your age at the end of the year. They already put you name on there why not put your age?

In a race where your age matters (KQ) and your competitors have it marked and you don't you have an advantage. At least you can identify your competitors while not allowing them the same reference.


Could just color code all the bibs. Blue bibs: 30-34, red bibs: 35-39, etc.



Great idea!!!!!! I am one of those guys that stopped doing body marking as well. It comes off half the time to. I know the guys i am up against for the most part, i normally talk to the guys that are passing me as well. Honestly to when people pass me on run its not like i am going to be able to catch them.

When you say "talk to the guys that are passing me" are you asking their age? I'd love to see that conversation followed by two adults hammering the last 5k of a race.

Hammering for me would be running at best maybe a 7min mile in a half, i can still carry on a conversation at that pace, although sometimes people don't seem to want to talk with me i find. If i were racing a Sprint/Olympic and its a race to beat everyone I don't care about AG, but guess thats me so i could care less if someone as the age on their calf in a race.

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Body Marking [labala] [ In reply to ]
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Been to some ITU events where it is mandatory. No bib number there though.

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Re: Body Marking [realAB] [ In reply to ]
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ITU, bib or no bib, it's mandatory for body marking. More races are moving to the temporary tattoos which work mostly (except people who don't read the directions, and put the wrong side down on a wet counter in the washroom and have sketchy looking numbers (the counter however, won't get DQ'd since it's well marked)...

In terms of calling it cheating, that's a stretch... Realistically you're in a race with everyone around, if you have gas in the tank, you should be passing anyone near the finish, regardless of age group... If you win the race, guaranteed you'll beat everyone in your AG... With the amount of compression clothing and sleeved tri kits, it's tricky to see any numbers these days...

The color coded bibs are a great idea, although it won't do chasers much good after the bike, since the bib has to be on the front during the run...
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Re: Body Marking [BBLOEHR] [ In reply to ]
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My idea is to color code the timing chip straps for age groups. They could match the swim caps which are already color coded for swim waves. I don't think this would be too hard to do and would make it pretty easy to tell if someone was in your age group. But there really isn't a solution for the rolling start which is a whole other thread.
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Re: Body Marking [chriselam] [ In reply to ]
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Good idea if you can remember what the colors mean. Maybe if they could make the colors universal across all IM races that would help. I remember I did IM Cozumel I think it was, and they didn't put ages they put letters. Nobody knew what the letters meant. It was some system the race had but noone else really knew what they signified. Did it go A-? oldest to youngest? Vice versa? it was kind of funny.

It is the mind itself which builds the body.
-Joseph Pilates
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Re: Body Marking [DougEFresh] [ In reply to ]
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Remembering colors shouldn't bee too bad... "what color is my AG again?" (looks at ankle/bib) "ok, that's right, we're teal..."
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Re: Body Marking [Trauma] [ In reply to ]
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Ha - you're right. Your own bib could be useful there!

It is the mind itself which builds the body.
-Joseph Pilates
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Re: Body Marking [Bifff] [ In reply to ]
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Bifff wrote:
My idea is to color code the timing chip straps for age groups. They could match the swim caps which are already color coded for swim waves. I don't think this would be too hard to do and would make it pretty easy to tell if someone was in your age group. But there really isn't a solution for the rolling start which is a whole other thread.


Agreed on the rolling start, but it does at least give a better idea. Also i don't think would be that hard to implement.

2024: Bevoman, Galveston, Alcatraz, Marble Falls, Santa Cruz
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Re: Body Marking [DougEFresh] [ In reply to ]
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You wouldn't need to remember anything except what color your bib is (look down) and if you are male or female (look down again.)


--Chris
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