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Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco
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Dimond and Falco are the 2 biggest beam bike brands today. Why did Zipp stop making beam bikes? I don't really know the history that well on these bikes so I figured I would ask. If they were the big thing years ago, why are they making a comeback?

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Last edited by: BryanD: Oct 19, 14 18:40
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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When the uci outlawed beam bikes it made it uneconomical to make them. Zipp quit and over time it killed softride as well. Titanflex kept going but it's a small operation.

My take is that on one hand the larger triathlon market and on the other the decreased cost and increased availability of carbon production has made it profitable for other small manufacturers to get into beam bikes again.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [Kevin in MD] [ In reply to ]
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Also charging $6,000 makes it profitable (I have no idea what they cost to manufacture...just mad I can't afford one!)
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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I still do not know why they do not have a seat tube. The seat tube should help aero dynamics by creating a much better leading edge for the wheel than a tire. Even the part that does not shield the tire would create a bunch of lift of low yaw numbers, which is helpful. It made sense when the beam had some suspension in it, but both the Dimond and the Falco are rigid.

I think they are making a comeback because they look really cool. The dimond is also pretty aero, but I think it would be even more aero with a seat tube.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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chaparral wrote:
I still do not know why they do not have a seat tube. The seat tube should help aero dynamics by creating a much better leading edge for the wheel than a tire. Even the part that does not shield the tire would create a bunch of lift of low yaw numbers, which is helpful. It made sense when the beam had some suspension in it, but both the Dimond and the Falco are rigid.

I think they are making a comeback because they look really cool. The dimond is also pretty aero, but I think it would be even more aero with a seat tube.

I tend to read beam bikes in much the same way--and I used to race a Softride back when they were in production. Today's top frames are highly optimized, and it's difficult to beat a triangular structure for strength and stability. There's no free lunch--taking material away from one area generally means that it needs to be used somewhere else. All frame designs represent some compromise, and I'm not completely sold on the notion that beam bikes in general automatically will be faster than a frame with a seat tube.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [jackmott] [ In reply to ]
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jackmott wrote:
They still have a lot more give than a seat tube equipped bike.


That is probably true, but you could always just have have the seat tube mounted to the beam with some compliance. Or even design the seat post with some leaf springs for vertical compliance. I would not be shocked if something like the Felt IA with its elastomers in the seat post would be pretty close to the Dimond.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [Kevin in MD] [ In reply to ]
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Kevin in MD wrote:
When the uci outlawed beam bikes it made it uneconomical to make them. Zipp quit and over time it killed softride as well. Titanflex kept going but it's a small operation.

My take is that on one hand the larger triathlon market and on the other the decreased cost and increased availability of carbon production has made it profitable for other small manufacturers to get into beam bikes again.

I think part of the reason is that today's tri market no longer gives a damn what the UCI says or does. Once the superbike manufacturers gave the finger to the UCI, the green light was there for beam bikes to make a comeback.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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What? No love for the Titanflex? It is a very comfortable ride, good results in the wind tunnel, affordable. If you have a bad back it is the way to go!
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [getcereal] [ In reply to ]
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Never heard of Titanflex

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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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I still do not know why they do not have a seat tube. The seat tube should help aero dynamics by creating a much better leading edge for the wheel than a tire. Even the part that does not shield the tire would create a bunch of lift of low yaw numbers, which is helpful. It made sense when the beam had some suspension in it, but both the Dimond and the Falco are rigid.

I think you might be onto something. I am not an engineer, but I did ride a Softride to some success back in the early 1990's. What I heard back then, was that the exposed rear wheel of the Softride ( and the Zipp) was ONLY better, when you were riding a disc. When riding any other type of wheel with a rim, the bikes tested worse than bikes with a seat tube in front of the wheel.


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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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chaparral wrote:
jackmott wrote:
They still have a lot more give than a seat tube equipped bike.



That is probably true, but you could always just have have the seat tube mounted to the beam with some compliance. Or even design the seat post with some leaf springs for vertical compliance. I would not be shocked if something like the Felt IA with its elastomers in the seat post would be pretty close to the Dimond.

Keep in mind there is no seat stay on a beam bike and no seat tube. While the seat tube fairs the rear wheel in a conventional superbike, the seat stay causes drag.

Perhaps the fastest would be a bike with a seat tube, but no seat stays by beefing up the chain stays like on a Dimond. Just draw a line from the BB to the seat on the Dimond and fill in behind it with fairing up to the wheel and that is what i am talking about....just leave the seat stays out.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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every time I ride this bike...it put a smile on my face. so much more comfy that my P3-5 or road bikes. I m old now..i like comfort!!! I would not be interested in a beam bike if it wasn't bouncing..i need the bouncing to be comfy



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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [jonnyo] [ In reply to ]
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#legend


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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BryanD wrote:
Never heard of Titanflex

http://www.titanflexbikes.com/

It really is a nice comfortable, fast ride!!!
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
chaparral wrote:
jackmott wrote:
They still have a lot more give than a seat tube equipped bike.



That is probably true, but you could always just have have the seat tube mounted to the beam with some compliance. Or even design the seat post with some leaf springs for vertical compliance. I would not be shocked if something like the Felt IA with its elastomers in the seat post would be pretty close to the Dimond.


Keep in mind there is no seat stay on a beam bike and no seat tube. While the seat tube fairs the rear wheel in a conventional superbike, the seat stay causes drag.

Perhaps the fastest would be a bike with a seat tube, but no seat stays by beefing up the chain stays like on a Dimond. Just draw a line from the BB to the seat on the Dimond and fill in behind it with fairing up to the wheel and that is what i am talking about....just leave the seat stays out.

I did not mention anything about seat stays.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [jackmott] [ In reply to ]
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jackmott wrote:
maybe there is no advantage to a seat tube, if you use the right tire and a disc?

A disk is probably really important on a beam bike. Even then, a seat tube is going to create a much better leading edge than a tire.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
chaparral wrote:
jackmott wrote:
They still have a lot more give than a seat tube equipped bike.



That is probably true, but you could always just have have the seat tube mounted to the beam with some compliance. Or even design the seat post with some leaf springs for vertical compliance. I would not be shocked if something like the Felt IA with its elastomers in the seat post would be pretty close to the Dimond.


Keep in mind there is no seat stay on a beam bike and no seat tube. While the seat tube fairs the rear wheel in a conventional superbike, the seat stay causes drag.

Perhaps the fastest would be a bike with a seat tube, but no seat stays by beefing up the chain stays like on a Dimond. Just draw a line from the BB to the seat on the Dimond and fill in behind it with fairing up to the wheel and that is what i am talking about....just leave the seat stays out.

Wouldn't that pretty much be a Z frame?

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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [leegoocrap] [ In reply to ]
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The old lotus frame?



Last edited by: FTDA: Oct 20, 14 11:59
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [leegoocrap] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, a Z frame. The old Lotus like this version, not the other Lotus that Boardman rode in Barcelona that has the "uni-seat/chain stay"


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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [FTDA] [ In reply to ]
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LOL....we both pulled this up a few minutes apart....
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I hate to tell you this...but my post was first.

on a more serious note, I would love to see a current manufacture take a stab at this style of frame.
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Except a downtube is also good for aero. It is able to treat the flow coming off of the front wheel. A downtube will also work better in yaw than the top tube on that lotus bike. Ideally a bike would have a seat tube and down tube, but a thin top tube is probably worth the small amount of drag for structural reasons.

Also, flat pedals?
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Re: Beam Bikes - Dimond and Falco [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I've watched the videos on youtube where the guy makes his own Z frame (actually his wifes...)

I'm a cheap vacuum bag away from trying to make one... (probably failing in epic fashion though.)

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