I hear you, but you need to compare apples to apples. Don't forget to add the price of getting the mud on your bike and yourself, plus the cost of an AC system capable of producing freezing temperatures in your living room, when you are riding the Computrainer.

"After I returned home got undressed and showered, I noticed all of the gear I was wearing in order to do this ride and not worry about frost bite. Bike shorts ($75), Wind block shorts ($30), heavy duty tights($100), long sleeve base layer ($25), long sleeve jersey ($70), Heavy Cycling jacket ($100), Balaklava($15), Heavy gloves ($25), two pair of socks ($20), toe warmers ($2), Winter cycling boots ($175), and helmet ($100). Total $737. "

Is all that necessary, or could you just throw on some long underwear, with sweat pants and a sweat shirt over it, put on some gloves and a stocking cap, and go ride.

For example, right now it's 22 degrees and snowing. I'm gonna go run (shooting for 6 miles). I'm gonna put on long underwear, some old sweatpants, a hoodie, and my old college baseball jacket. Top it off with gloves and stocking cap.

I'm not argueing against a CT, I plan on buying one in the near future; I was just asking "how many people need $737 worth of cold weather exercise gear when "$80 worth will do?"

I could justify spending $1000 on a CT, I could reasonably justify spending $800 on cold weather stuff ... not after I've spent a lifetime of "playing in the cold" in nothing but layers of sweatpants and sweatshirts. No way I'm going to admit that I was tougher when I was 10 than I am now.

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Or, you could move here. ;-)

Did a 10k this morning; 60 degrees at the start. Day turned out sunny and about 68 degrees. And it was the coldest day yet this year. I almost had to put on long pants.

I live in San Diego and do 90% of my riding on the Computrainer. Go figure.

And it was the coldest day yet this year. I almost had to put on long pants.

Are you trying to piss me off?

I live in San Diego and do 90% of my riding on the Computrainer. Go figure.

You should be beaten.

On a serious, note I can understand why someone would ride on the CT, due to the amount of feeback you can get. You can set up your variables to your race conditions (even the exact courses, right?). Okay, even with all that I don't understand why you are not outside. Please, for those of us that go through cold, gray days with snow and no sun ... please go outside tomorrow and let us live vicariously through you.

OT: Is it true that in SD, you get a "weekly forecast" from your meteorologist, rather than a daily forecast? I have some buddies from SoCal (played college baseball with em), and they were amussed that in the Midwest we get a "weather update" every hour ... that's about how long it takes for the weather to do a 180. My fav was a buddy from Hialeah (Miami) whose "winter jacket" was a hooded sweatshirt. Sure was fun watching these guys walk across and icy parking lot.

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Does your wife know you spent that much money on bike gear?After spending that wad you probably have to ride some old junker.What is your winter beater now days?
Cullen

Actually, my reasons are far more mundane. I have to ride either before the family awakens (its dark out) or after the kiddies are in bed. Sometimes I can convince the boys to watch a DVD sitting next to me in the garage. I get an allowance of about 8 hours a week for "out of the house" training, and I spend them all running.

As for "setting up variables", I do the same workout almost every time. 10 minute warmup; 2x 15-20 minutes at threshold effort; 5 minute warmdown. Not terribly scientific, but it keeps me off the streets. ;-)

Actually, the weather is quite variable here. Today, it was 68. I think yesterday it was 68.5. ;-)

And, of course, you might have heard about the county-wide little barbecue we had here about a month ago...the wind changed direction (as it does at about one day a year) and 300,000 acres went up in smoke. I live 10 miles from the closest part of the fire, and didn't see blue sky for 4 days.

Actually, my reasons are far more mundane. I have to ride either before the family awakens (its dark out) or after the kiddies are in bed. Sometimes I can convince the boys to watch a DVD sitting next to me in the garage. I get an allowance of about 8 hours a week for "out of the house" training, and I spend them all running.

I just typed a post in another thread explaining the same situation. I have a lot of respect foir a person that knows what the higher priority is: family or training. I run at 5am, swim/bike after school (teacher), and do my long stuff on the weekends when my son goes down for a nap.

The day my training interferes with family (time and expense-wise), it's over (for me). My wife and son will never judge me based on my triathlo times.

It would be nice to have more training time, but never nicer than having a close family.

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[reply]
[b]"

I'm not argueing against a CT, I plan on buying one in the near future; I was just asking "how many people need $737 worth of cold weather exercise gear when "$80 worth will do?"

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I would have to disagree with this statement. Running is very much different than biking. I wear shorts running until 30*. However, "$80 worth will do" for a VERY short time on the bike when the temp dips below 20*. I am not advocating for the amount spent above but when it is very cold you need decent gear to spend time on the bike. Until you have been on a 45mph decent when the air temp is 20* it is hard to understand.

Until you have been on a 45mph decent when the air temp is 20* it is hard to understand.

I did something like that on 12/10. 36 degrees, 30mph wind ... you can figure out the windchill. I had the same hoodie w/ light jacket and 2 pairs of sweatpants. It wasn't the cold that ruined it ... it was the ride uphill against the 30mph going 6kph. Going the other way at 45-48kph was what made it all worth it. I'd ride through Greenland if I could keep a 30mph pace in the aero position. What a feeling.

It's gonna be cold no matter what. How long does it take to ride down a hill at 45mph with the wind in your face? 10 seconds at most? I can endure that.

So, what do you wear to keep warm on the bike? What's the alternative to spending $700 on riding gear?

I ask b/c tomorrow morning, 10am I'll be out on the country highways (no corn to break the wind), and it'll be in the 20s and the wind will be in the 30mph range, and there I'll be going 5mph against the wind (25-30mph down hills into the wind), and 30mph with it. [This is provided there isn't snow everywhere]

Note: I have never ridden for multiple hours in winter temps, so if that's the case, I cannot comment (even though I already have). When it comes to that I have to question the pros vs. cons of riding multiple hours in freezing temps.

{Edited to add this part} I may have gotten myself into a debate that I didn't want into. My initial reaction to the post was "$737 worth of stuff, some salesman saw him coming". I don't know how he got the stuff ... maybe it was gifts, maybe he's got the money to spend, I don't know, and I don't want to get into a situation where I am passing judgement on another person (too late?). I saw the amount and my initial thought was "why?". I'm sure my opinion on the matter isn't going to influence whether he buys more/less stuff or wears (or doesn't wear) what he already has. The only thing good that can come from my earlier comments is if we come up with less expensive alternatives for staying warm in cold weather.

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 no corn to break the wind ? I lived in the Midwest for the first 30 years of my life (Iowa and IL), now in the mountains of western Maine. Believe me when I tell you that 80.00 in clothing does not get you far in the winter months out here. Heck, sometimes not far in the spring either. However, I do choose to wear clothes that allow a cetain amount of comfort while keeping me warm and dry. I use to run all winter in the Midwest in various levels of sweat clothes while trying to drop weight for wrestling due to the large amounts of sweat produced. Maybe I do actually sweat more now since I work out more, but those sweat clothes sure made it feel like I sweated a ton since they just absorbed it and held it right on your skin. I don't like the wet, cold and clamy feeling anymore. Maybe my age is softening me up?

Also consider the original poster added the cost of a helment and shoes, a large quantity of the cost. You have to have neoprene booties and GOOD gloves when it is cold. Those are a decent chunk of change. The more I look at the list, it is not that unreasonable for the temperature . . . stuff adds up fast but at least most tecnical wear lasts for a very long time. I have clothes from 10 years ago still fine.

Yeah, I realize I made a lot of assumptions on limited information. I should know better. So I tried to back off my original comments.

I don't know [1] what his experience level is, [2] the length of his rides, [3] the total time in the cold, [4] how often he uses the equipment, [5] what level he competes at, etc.

My initial post was knee-jerk "beginner bunk" about something I likely don't know enough about to comment on (my first winter triathlon training) ... but did anyway. Bad me.

Consider this an apology to jtenniswood. Open mouth, insert foot ... and hope that they're not $175 winter cycling boots *wink*.

Lesson learned.

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Let's all just agree that cycling gear is ridiculously expensive. Even on sale, a Gore shell with the consistency of a Hefty Cinch Sak is $60 and the Performance brand insulated tights are $60 as well. Whatever.

There are several great reasons to buy a Computrainer and ride it even in good weather.

1. I can do a virtual ride of a race course.
2. The CT software doesn't have cars trying to run me off the road...yet.
3. I don't have to deal with the heat/cold/humidity/dryness/poor air quality that may be outside.
4. I don't have to deal with ice, snow covered shoulders, etc.
5. I don't have to travel to the place I'm riding.

Plus all the excellent reasons already listed.

On the downside, if you do get a CT, you have to have a fan(unless you really like puddles on your floor), and unless your family is very understanding, or you consider the CT to be art, you need a computer available to hook up to the CT wherever the CT is. Might I recommend a laptop for portability? Ka-Ching!

Nothing about this sport is cheap, but if you are thinking about buying a $2,000-$4,000 Time Trial bike, you might as well spend the money to learn how to ride it well. I own a spinning bike, and let me say that the hours I spent on that have not made me a faster cyclist, just a slow cyclist who can ride a long time.

Julian, please stop rubbing my nose in it. We're getting another foot of snow tonight. If it weren't for the messed up political system and potential for earthquakes/fires/mudslides/el Nino, we'd all move to CA next week. BTW, you're in for a big change this week. It's only going to be 66. ;p

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Guys, what is this? Taking responsibility, being self-aware, apologizing, humor, balancing family and training, no flames or rudeness, generally trying to be helpful, thoughtful, and analytical. What's this world coming too : )!

And don't forget the cost of that coffee at Starbucks!

And to clarify what type of ride this was, I'd registered 46 miles when I got home. There are somewhat less expensive clothing options, but JT's quoting retail on quality wear. (He looked all pro.) And, as another person stated, these clothes last a long time. If you amortize their cost over five years or so, they're not too pricey. I've also found that jackets without linings and some tights do not need to be washed after every ride. They last longer as well.

For me, the clothing costs are merely the price of not cowering from the elements. The cornerstone of endurance athletics is accepting discomfort.

Thanks Todd for the clarification. I have not been able to be at my computer since the post. I have accumulated these items over a period of 7 to 8 years. The higher quality items will last for years such as the Boots and heavy jacket, unless of course you are Todd Scott who rides relentlessly all year and competes in extreme events such as Leadville 100s, and Ididasports.

My original intent for this post may have been lost by my retail pricing of the items mentioned, I was astonished by the amount of laundry that now had to be done, Compared to a pair of shorts ($70), Light weight Socks ($7), old race t-shirt ($45 - $60 depending on race), Head band and Towel that would have been the accumulation for an indoor trainer workout.

By the way I went out and ran for 1 hr later in yesterday afternoon, and generated a bunch more clothing for the laundry, not quite as much as the ride, but a significant amount. This may add to an arguement that a treadmill could now be justified. If we could only hook up our treadmils, and Computrainers to our internet service and compete in virtual races, there would be no need for travelling to races, excessive laundry, and excessive race fees. Not to mention we could spend much more time with our families and less time doing large amounts of laundry. ;)

When I first got interested in this triathlon stuff I read or heard somewhere that the average income of a triathle was something like 90,000.

Believe me, triathlon equipment manufacturers know this. It's like golf in that regard.

Someone mentioned in another thread that they found it hard to believe that they can't make a cheaper bike out of the same materials. It would be interesting to see how the price of a bike breaks down in percentages (materials, design, advertising, sponsorships, etc).

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There's a good idea.

It boggles my mind that as archaic as it is(and it is!) the CT allows you to load and ride realistic courses form all over the world, all for under $1500.

You can spend $5,000 on a treadmill, but you can't hook it up to a computer and run real courses with a video overlay. You'd think that is a no-brainer.

You could always do a postal CT race(think postal swim competitions) where everybody races a set course during a certain period of time, then sends their best results in (email the performance file for validation) and have the judge calculate the winner.

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what is with this "laundry" business? i mean dude, stuff them in the bag and wash 'em every 2 weeks whether they need it not! :)

as for c-trainers - are they ever gonna get away from the early 80's style graphics? man, i have buddy who just got one and he has to face down his kids laughing at that lame screen image every day as they taunt him with their little gameboys. to say nothing of comaparison to "tony hawks underground" on ps2 or something. his wife is like " you paid HOW much for this again?" embarrassing!!!!

treadmill! god, please no!

oh i hate treadmills. i accept indoor riding, but the day i bend over to the weather and run on a treadmill.......

i don't really get cold running, down to 10° a pair of tights(well, some extra on the cold end...) and a ls polypro shirt(i hunt and get em wicked cheap on sale) will do....oh, gloves and a hat as well....but skiing! oh, hooray for snow. skiing is my run replacement in the winter.

but yeah, riding in the cold sucks so much! i haven't been riding much the last month or so - went out at 30° or so - my feet literally froze with smartwool socks on - i think i'll try duct taping the shoes as the cheap alternative if i get off my skis...
treadmill work is worse than erging, worse than swimming - anything.

and the snow comes down....yeah maine!
darrell