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Switch from run focused training to bike focused?
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For background, I'm a M30-34 triathlete focused on Sprint and Olympic distance. I was a collegiate swimmer who picked up Tri after college. Generally I am strongest on the bike, almost as good on the swim, and hanging on for dear life in the run (though admittedly not bad at running, just nowhere near as good as the other two).

In training I generally heavily focus on running because it's my weakness and the easiest to do logistically. My normal week will have 5-6 runs, and 1-2 swims and bike rides. I have done pretty well in the past with this type of training, but recent results have me considering a change-up. I had been averaging 1 ride a week this year and, although I hadn't really tested, I estimated my FTP to be around 10-15 watts lower than during the race season last year (when I was riding twice a week). About 10 days ago I saw that Zwift was having a National Championship and thought it sounded fun, so I decided to put in a big bike block and try to boost my FTP a bit to have a good showing. I rode 7 times over 10 days, including two preparatory Zwift races. The race was this morning, and while I didn't place terribly high due to a lack of fitness for 1:30 long race efforts (I rarely have workouts loger than an hour), my first 1:05ish was fantastic. I set a new FTP number that was almost 10 watts higher than I was at my peak last year, and until the catastrophic bonk after the 2nd of 3 climbs it felt easy.

So the question is this: what are your thoughts on someone in my position flipping the script and doing 5-6 rides a week, and 1-2 swims/runs instead? Would I see a huge dropoff on my running, or would the fact that I've basically plateaued on the run mean that I wouldn't see much dropoff? Who knows, I might feel fresher after the bike and run better. This is kinda backwards for me as I've never tried that much riding, but cycling is by far my favorite sport so I think it would be a fun experiment. However, I don't know that I could even do it logistically; most of my workouts are done at the office and there isn't anywhere to set up my trainer (and I can't ride outside at the speeds I ride in NYC, that would be a nightmare). Regardless, I can try to work out the logistics if I really want to. What does the collective wisdom of slowtwitch think?

(Oh, and I'm self coached so advising me to ask my coach is not a productive response.)

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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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I wouldn't do it if you are significantly less strong on the run resultwise than the bike. Aside from the benefit of working on your weakness, your run ability will likely not be compensated for by cycling, as the impact of running will limit you legwise before you can tap into that deep bike cardio reserve.

I actually did this myself a few years back after a few HIMs where I was finishing the bike in the top 20%, but the run in the top 5% (an expected result for me, I was a pure runner prior to triathlon), so I decided to do a bike-focused training block for the following HIM where I ran only once per week but biked 5-7 days per week, planning to start running 3-4x/wk in the final 6 wks to race day, and relying on my running experience to carry me through.

I was horrified when I started up in multiple runs per week, and excitedly did a run interval workout that didn't even feel super hard because my cardio was so good from the hard bike training. Unfortunately, my muscles and tendons just couldn't keep up - the next day I had strained nearly every major muscle in my legs - I could barely even walk. I literally had to take 3 entire weeks completely off any sort of running it was so bad - luckily, I still had 4 weeks to race day and managed to cobble together enough run fitness to finish the HIM run 17 minutes slower (yuk) than my typical trained HIM time. Needless to say, it was not a good race result compared to my PR, so I've learned the hard way to not let running slack too hard.

In contrast, I can actually slack completely on the bike, and as long as I'm running a decent amount, come back quick and with no injuries. I suspect most people will be similar.
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you for sharing, that's a really good data point. Though my running seems to have plateaued, the extra attention there is probably what keeps me competitive. The reason I asked before trying it is because I had a sneaking suspicion along the lines of what you said about the impact of running. Even though I top out at 10k distance (with an occasional half marathon when I feel like suffering), I don't don't that I could be affected as you said.

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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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lightheir wrote:
I wouldn't do it if you are significantly less strong on the run resultwise than the bike. Aside from the benefit of working on your weakness, your run ability will likely not be compensated for by cycling, as the impact of running will limit you legwise before you can tap into that deep bike cardio reserve.

I actually did this myself a few years back after a few HIMs where I was finishing the bike in the top 20%, but the run in the top 5% (an expected result for me, I was a pure runner prior to triathlon), so I decided to do a bike-focused training block for the following HIM where I ran only once per week but biked 5-7 days per week, planning to start running 3-4x/wk in the final 6 wks to race day, and relying on my running experience to carry me through.

I was horrified when I started up in multiple runs per week, and excitedly did a run interval workout that didn't even feel super hard because my cardio was so good from the hard bike training. Unfortunately, my muscles and tendons just couldn't keep up - the next day I had strained nearly every major muscle in my legs - I could barely even walk. I literally had to take 3 entire weeks completely off any sort of running it was so bad - luckily, I still had 4 weeks to race day and managed to cobble together enough run fitness to finish the HIM run 17 minutes slower (yuk) than my typical trained HIM time. Needless to say, it was not a good race result compared to my PR, so I've learned the hard way to not let running slack too hard.

In contrast, I can actually slack completely on the bike, and as long as I'm running a decent amount, come back quick and with no injuries. I suspect most people will be similar.

while my story and details are different, overall, I agree completely. For me, I get decent crossover from running to biking, but NOT vice versa.

Swimming? don't get me started! :-|

I saw this on a white board in a window box at my daughters middle school...
List of what life owes you:
1. __________
2. __________
3. __________
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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I come from a running background myself, and had to take a month off running early last year and to compensate, spent 6 days a week on the bike. When I was able to start running again, I expected to be very out of shape but I was very surprised with the amount of fitness I had that transfered over from all the biking I was doing.

You say your running is plateauing, so why not change things up? For me I've found that biking a ton has really provided me with basic leg strength that has really helped my running
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Add more all around. Bike 4-5 times a week, run 5 times a week (doesn’t have to be all long 30-90 min), and swim 3-4 times a week.
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [JT_Dennen] [ In reply to ]
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JT_Dennen wrote:
Add more all around. Bike 4-5 times a week, run 5 times a week (doesn’t have to be all long 30-90 min), and swim 3-4 times a week.

This
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [JT_Dennen] [ In reply to ]
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I wish! Sadly with my workload, commute, and family obligations more training isn't an option. I could do what I used to do and sacrifice sleep for more training, but as I get older that becomes harder to manage, and I feel it's bad for overall health.

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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Well it’s hard to see improvements with your lay out. 3/3/3 might be better for you, but if you do 5-6 bikes in a week but 1 run your run is going to drop off and say for the other way. You’ll be constantly trying to make up for lost ground for the run you’re doing 1-2 times a week.

Being that I only bike now I do it 6 times a week for about 12 hours a week. I could add one or two runs a week but I wouldn’t think it would make me a better runner for any type of race. Basically it’s a balancing act. Check out a training plan and try to use that to help get some helpful structure.
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [JT_Dennen] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you for replying. With swimming since it is mostly about technique I can get away with 1-2 times a week and still be one of the first out of the water in most of my races, but running is a totally different sport and I don't have the background like I do in swimming. I suspect you are correct and I may have a significant drop off if I decreased my running. I have been pretty successful with my current structure, but I know I'm giving up a lot on the bike due to very low mileage so I often get tempted to put in a big block of work. I just don't have the time to be the parent I want to be AND the triathlete I want to be :)

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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Keep it balanced, or mildly imbalanced. 5/6 vs 1/2 vs 1/2 is not the generally accepted "best practice".

Also, dont fret not being competitive with a young family. It is par for the course. It gets better as the kids age and become more indepedent.

Hope this helps
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [ejd_mil] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the response! I am certainly enjoying the young kids, nothing better than watching them learn and grow. But I still like to get out and go fast when I can, so finding the right mix is a good challenge until I have time to train like a 20-something again.

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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Everyone is different...

...but I was bottom decile / quartile in my AG in my early thirties (young kids, demanding job). Fast forward ten years, I am now in the top 2 to 10% in the AG in normal races / top quartile at WC.

Balance (or slightly imbalanced), consistency, and patience trump's all. Good luck
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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How long are your 1-2 bike rides?
How long are your 5-6 runs?

Difficult to prescribe an approach (different mix) without knowing how much time you typically have at your disposal.

Also, if you decide to focus more on the bike, you could ensure that you still run often (if not long) by finishing all your rides with an easy short run.
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Re: Switch from run focused training to bike focused? [Tulkas] [ In reply to ]
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Get yourself Jack Daniels book and start working/training to your VDot targets, alternatively use MacMillans running calculator. Once got to crunch out those Interval and Repeat speeds to increase that race pace. Alternately train that running at one or two races faster than your main event.
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