Fair enough. Im not really sure how to put this delicately and mean no offense, but you are free to have your beliefs and stand up for them, but I think it's also fair to say that this particular belief consists of burying one's head in the sand and ignoring reality, so I can kind of see where the protests come from.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

I hear you. My house, my rules. As I tell my kids when they complain things aren’t fair- feel free to turn 18 and move out. In the meantime, toe the line and put a Sir on it.

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If I don't, who will? -Me
It's like being bipolar in opinion is a requirement around here. -TripleThreat

So, you're not really interested in people's opinions, you just want to hear others who agree with you? And parents who disagree with you are fuckwits? I got used to better than that from you.

Completely disagree. In fact, I'll say YOU are taking the lazy way out by ignoring what kids are doing and pushing the problem elsewhere. "I know you're doing this anyway but not in my house". It's not about not saying no or caving to your kids.

I have a young daughter so maybe my tune will change as I approach the teenager years but I'm young enough to remember my teen years, and my friends who had the most ridgid parents were the ones who rebelled the hardest. The ones who go buck wild in college because they've been kept on too short a short leash.

I was allowed parties with alcohol at my parents place. I never had them, because I respected my parents and their home, but the offer was always there. My friends had parties, with alcohol, at their places with the parents upstairs. They would check in periodically. Call parents of kids who weren't doing to good. Let everyone sleep in the basement so no one drove. Is it better parenting just to say "not in my house" and have a bunch of teens drinking/fucking out in the woods somewhere and all driving home plastered?

Come on. If someone's 'kid' is in college, they can legally drink, smoke, vote and go to war. Pretty sure they can deal with sex. Treating them like a 12 year old is counterproductive to their development.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Have you had "the talk" with them? Do you consider them mature/responsible enough for sexual relations and are you ok with them otherwise having sex? (and vice versa with the parents of their partner)

If the answer is yes, then there shouldn't be a problem.


(Caveat: my kid is 4, so I haven't experienced this)

I respectfully disagree.


My question pertained to the age at which it was appropriate for kids to spend the night at the boy/girlfriend's house - particularly, when one/both are under 18 and still in HS.


I know what kids are doing and what's going on when we're not home - the same thing most of us did at that age. I'm not burying my head in the sand or ignoring reality whatsoever - it's my opinion that they needn't be sleeping over at that age. Period.


What is the reality I'm ignoring?

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king of the road says you move too slow
KING OF THE ROAD SAYS YOU MOVE TOO SLOW

I am not so sure if it is all about whether or not there will be an early pregnancy. I guess that is a consideration less sex equal less likelihood of pregnancy on the other hand if a lot of sex going on and no birth control more likely pregnancy.

I think kids and adults do well in relationships to delay sex because it creates an emotional bond that makes it more difficult to clearly decide if the person is the right one to be married to. Not only that who really needs experiences with previous sexual partners banging around their heads when they are involved with the person they are getting married to or are married to. Somewhat same issue with pornography. Do you really want those images banging around in your head and comparing it to your sexual life?

I think those who co-habitate prior to marriage are somewhat more likely to divorce it they do marry so I don't think there is any benefit to co-habituating. We don't let kids in my jurisdiction drink, smoke or vote until they are 19 so I am not sure why something just a consequential (sex) we would allow at less than 19.

I went to school with a group of kids who were on pretty short leashes and I really didn't see them going wild once they went to college. Maybe short leashes isn't the right term. They had a lot of independence but in our community it was very frowned upon to have sex before marriage. For almost all that did I think they did with the thought it was with the person they were going to marry.

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They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

Quote:

So, you're not really interested in people's opinions, you just want to hear others who agree with you? And parents who disagree with you are fuckwits? I got used to better than that from you.

That's not what I said at all.


Absolutely I'm interested in other people's opinions. That's why I asked the original question.


If the responses were all, "You need to get with the times," then my response this morning would have been different. I asked the question because I'm trying to keep an open mind & am looking for an outside point of reference.


It's my belief that some parents defer making tough decisions (saying 'no') because they don't want their kids to be sad, or they don't want to deal with the post-decision attitude fallout. Or maybe because they're lazy in general. Or maybe because the rest of their life isn't in such good shape & they're retreated into an isolation cocoon. So instead, they say 'ok', and what lesson does the kid learn?


That was the point of my rant. I wasn't being judgemental at all.


Except of the parents who allow under-age parties at their house, or at hotel rooms they've paid for. Those are the fuck-wits. That's my opinion & I own it.


I've had a rough few weeks (not specifically related to this topic). I'm releasing some steam.

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king of the road says you move too slow
KING OF THE ROAD SAYS YOU MOVE TOO SLOW

It's not really a matter of saying yes or no. Saying no to everything is just as lazy as saying yes to everything.
These decisions depend on your kids' general behavior as well and parental decisions will vary across children.
If you say no to everything or say no without explaining why you're saying no, and without discussing with your
child, and just saying 'my house, my rules' then your child isn't learning anything either.

I think you're missing my point. See my earlier reply.


IMO, there's a difference between knowing your (HS) kids are drinking/screwing and condoning/encouraging it by making your home available.

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king of the road says you move too slow
KING OF THE ROAD SAYS YOU MOVE TOO SLOW

And there's a difference between allowing it in a controlled environment and teaching them about things like consequence and responsibility and having a complete free for all.

Im just on my way out but will reply to your posts more completely a bit later on.

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Long Chile was a silly place.

Of course.

The OP wasn't about kids hooking up or drinking, or as a parent trying to prevent those activities. My question was specifically whether or not HS-age kids should be spending the night at each other's parents' house.

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king of the road says you move too slow
KING OF THE ROAD SAYS YOU MOVE TOO SLOW

Yes, indeed. It's a matter of saying yes or no - selectively and smartly. Explain why. Choose your battles.


I grew up in a house that was 'my house, my rules' and was very strict, up until I was almost 20 & moved out to join the Navy.


The older my kids got, the more often I needed an attitude check to make sure I wasn't turning into that kind of parent.

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king of the road says you move too slow
KING OF THE ROAD SAYS YOU MOVE TOO SLOW

I was gonna say, that seemed to hit a nerve...

My point is that if the couple is mature enough and you're comfortable with them otherwise having sex, then them doing so at your place is merely a decision about time and place. So then, the answer is yes.

Late to the party but here is the real answer.

If they are local - under 18 - only if there is something that keeps them from going home - weather, drunk, natural disaster, etc.

over 18 and same room - whenever you are ok with them having sex in your house with you knowing - that is your call - I personally think parents should stay out of their kid's sex lives starting somewhere around 16 depending on the kid, but you are free to think differently when they are in your house

Non-local - whenever they are ok to travel on their own. So if a 16 year old travels to see your kid, let them stay

Same room - see above

IMNSHO - There is something inherently squicky about parents involving themselves in a sexually mature child's life. I think it is their responsibility for them to help an immature child navigate it. But somewhere between 15 - 18 it is the kid's call. I think a lot of family drama revolves around parents' inability to tolerate the thought of their daughter giving oral sex.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

If the parents are uncomfortable with it (I would be) then the children should sleep in separate rooms.

I've a friend from HS who was seeing a girl when he went to uni.

Anyway, she is staying at his parents house. Gets up in middle of night to go to bathroom which is right and then right out of bedroom. She comes out of bathroom. Goes right then right and gets in to bed with his dad who's stark bollock naked.........

House was dark apparently.......

More recently was at a brunch in the middle east. An Australian physicians three kids were there. All giving each other shit about who could hook up or not after brunch. His wife told me later that week at work that she woke up the next morning to two strange girls having breakfast in her house with two of her son's.........

 
No kids so don't have to worry about this right now, but I can relay my own experience.

Very religious household growing up and home schooled my entire life, so according to most, absolutely ripe for going ape shit in college. Didn't have my first beer till Spring semester of my Freshman year. Got drunk a few times that year, but was generally more concerned with making sure classmates made it home safe. Virgin till middle of Junior year, I was living in the dorms and my gf at the time was renting a house nearby. Hosted some wicked parties at the house I rented with two other guys my Senior year, plenty of booze had that year, but still didn't go crazy and was reasonably responsible about it.

Parents disapproved the whole way through and so most of it was kept from them. The one time my mom thought she was catching on she went nuts. Hid most of that through college then stopped caring once I was done with school and had my own apartment.

My parents were just as dumb as all parents of teenagers are, of course they don't know anything. Somewhere in my mid 20's I started to appreciate some of the things they tried to teach me. Of course I did things they didn't approve of, but I am glad they attempted to set boundaries and rules back in high school and attempted to enforce them. Kids who are given a free for all are less advantaged in the learning responsibility and consequences for actions.

My wife grew up the exact opposite, no murder, but anything else goes as her alcoholic parents were partying all night every night. She was the oldest of three so had to grow up fast. She took care of her toddler brothers while her parents were passed out, got everybody to school then made her way to elementary school. She learned responsibility the hard way. Her brothers are now in their mid 20's and have still never learned any responsibility nor that there are consequences for their actions. It has always been a free for all, and unfortunately they have the felonies and jail time to go along with that mentality.

So yeah, kids are gonna do what they are gonna do, but rules and expectations are still important IMO. Hard to set a firm rule age as kids are different, but I doubt I would be all about sleep overs until the kid was out of high school. There will be plenty of time to experiment after they are 18.