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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Dr. Tigerchik wrote:

I have an open mind; my quibble was that you claimed it "lowered your core temp." I was interested thinking you'd collected some data about this. I would expect data collected for 30-45 second walk bouts to have a negligible effect on core temp, but your statement suggested the contrary, so I was interested. As it happens, you don't have the data. If RWR works for you, that's great.

Nope, no data just my body. Of course it's that body that I have become hyper aware of and when I'm training, can be near dead on for my heart rate without a monitor (I always wear one anyway). And I'm not questioning that you did have any open mind. I was simply stating that you should give a shot and since I don't know you from Adam and most people go into something to disprove, to keep an open mind. Again, not saying you won't per se but a caveat to trying it.
Last edited by: DomerTriGuy: Dec 13, 17 4:37
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [Dr. Tigerchik] [ In reply to ]
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Dr. Tigerchik wrote:

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That's all fine and sounds great, but I suspect 30-45 seconds makes an infinitessimal difference in your core temp.
Placebo or real, I've had a PR with each R-W-R distance race. Try it out if even for some training runs and keep an open mind. I was anti-RWR because any time I had stopped in races before, it meant I was fading. I finally have it a shot (and took a good 4 runs before it felt mentally okay to walk) and haven't looked back.


I have an open mind; my quibble was that you claimed it "lowered your core temp." I was interested thinking you'd collected some data about this. I would expect data collected for 30-45 second walk bouts to have a negligible effect on core temp, but your statement suggested the contrary, so I was interested. As it happens, you don't have the data. If RWR works for you, that's great.

I actually do have data on this. During Ultraman I did run/walk and collected core temp data for the whole run. You are quite right there is not a significant core temp benefit to run/walk. The benefits (especially in a long race) are mostly about reducing muscular fatigue. I will share the data at some point, just need to get it presentable.

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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [Rumpled] [ In reply to ]
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Google Jeff Galloway (former Olympic marathon runner and current running coach) and note that he advocates run/walk for many reasons. It is not just a pacing strategy. Don't knock it if you haven't tried it!
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [DomerTriGuy] [ In reply to ]
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DomerTriGuy wrote:
I race with R-W-R and had a PR of 1:27 with it and plan to use it in an attempt at my 3 hour marathon (will be my 8th marathon but first R-W-R). It helps my core temp in check and a good reminder for hydration and nutrition.

So you probably have 1:17 ability if you trained right. I am guessing low volume runner?
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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synthetic wrote:
DomerTriGuy wrote:
I race with R-W-R and had a PR of 1:27 with it and plan to use it in an attempt at my 3 hour marathon (will be my 8th marathon but first R-W-R). It helps my core temp in check and a good reminder for hydration and nutrition.

So you probably have 1:17 ability if you trained right. I am guessing low volume runner?
Just depends on life. Some races I have fairly high volume. For the last couple halves, it had been low volume because it wasn't a focus. Future races will be lower volume as I've now started biking and swimming so love the cross training. I'll still be RWR but as I get closer to 3 hours, may put more focus running to hit/break it.
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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robgray wrote:

I actually do have data on this. During Ultraman I did run/walk and collected core temp data for the whole run. You are quite right there is not a significant core temp benefit to run/walk. The benefits (especially in a long race) are mostly about reducing muscular fatigue. I will share the data at some point, just need to get it presentable.

What we wouldn't know, however, is what your core temperature would have been had you not run/walked. ;-) It also wasn't that warm a day as 52.4-mile runs on the Queen K go, so there are still untested environmental factors.

Ian
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [Rumpled] [ In reply to ]
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Rumpled wrote:
So, today I ran a half marathon (no backdoor brag - I'm fat and old =2:20)
There was this couple that I must have passed back and forth 30 times. He was obviously pacing her. He would run up ahead and then stop to let her catch up. Both, obviously using some audio prompts on their headphones so they couldn't hear anything else going on at all around them.
She would be going good and then, boom! Stop to walk right in front of me.
So Freakin' annoying. I think it's a stupid crutch for people that can't pace. If you are gonna do it, at least realize you are not the only one out of about 5000 out on the course.
Flame away about my whining.

LOL. Please stick to the newly established 55+ forum if you want sympathy...
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Re: Gawd, I Freakin' Hate Run/Walk! [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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robgray wrote:
Dr. Tigerchik wrote:

Quote:


I actually do have data on this. During Ultraman I did run/walk and collected core temp data for the whole run. You are quite right there is not a significant core temp benefit to run/walk. The benefits (especially in a long race) are mostly about reducing muscular fatigue. I will share the data at some point, just need to get it presentable.


This was always my understanding as well from reading all of Bobby McGee's work. If I remember correctly, he hypothesized that unless you're faster than 2:30 (maybe it was 2:35?) in the marathon, then taking very brief walk breaks would almost always yield a faster result than running the whole thing. Rests/Resets of walking even 5 seconds are enough to reduce neural and muscular fatigue before beginning again. In my own practice, I used it in a couple of 50 mile Ultras and was pretty happy to pick people off in the back half of each race by just keeping steady. When I came back to tri a couple of years ago I've walked for 5-15 seconds every aid station and dropped a couple of sub 1:30 runs in 70.3's, which I had never done before. It's worth noting that the walking should be practiced - I'd wager that at my slowest I'm still walking 10:00 to 10:15 miles.

The argument against run/walk is there really isn't a way to PROVE whether it's faster or not. I know that my run splits are better by doing it. You know you picked off 10 plus people in the back half of UM this year to grab the win by doing it. But, people can always conveniently argue that you (or I) would have gone faster on those specific days by running the whole thing because there is no way to prove otherwise, because you'll never have the exact situation again.

EDIT: Nice win, by the way. I've followed your blog and postings for the last couple of years - impressive!
Last edited by: pvolb: Dec 14, 17 6:37
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