And as an outsider looking in, this is precisely why I see where America is slipping. America use to be about the inquisitive, the creative, the go out and lets do this and study this just for the sake of making our society greater. Now, it seems that America is just more interested in who the latest reality show family is dating and protecting itself from something that it barely even needs to worry about on the grand scheme of things. Why not spend money on that? It still comes back to why, when if you imagine how awesome America could be if you sank that money into education it would be frightening to see what you could do. As someone who has American family members and friends, it pains me to see the direction you guys are going and as a friend, I want you all to snap out of it and say we deserve better!

We can't bring in Mexican agriculture workers but we can bring in unskilled Uzbek's based on the need for diversity. Kill the program, start up an Agriculture guest worker program for Mexican nationals, stop the insanity of forcing people to cross our southern border illegally to find work.

We bring in a shit ton of Mexican immigrants. Mexico is one of the very few countries not eligible for the Diversity Visa lottery because we already bring in more than 50,000 Mexican immigrants every 5 years.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Whoa, whoa, whoa... you want more Mexicans now? They are all rapists and murderers.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Wait? what? I thought that was Canadians?

Shhhh.... don't tell anyone.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

All the stuff you say is mostly annoying (at times anyway), but this really is too much.

When it's singular, is a TAMAL for fuck sake!

Reviewing your chart...

Do walking, cycling, murder, any motor vehicle incident, car/truck accidents, and terrorist all get counted in the NYC situation? And I didn't see anything about counter-protesting a white nationalist rally.

1. It isn't my chart.
2. If that is your takeaway from that....

Sounds like you are arguing for gun control....

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Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)

I could be. However, I think if you want gun control then repeal or amend the 2nd amendment but not really relevant to this thread.

I think the responsibility lies with in this country to protect its citizens and to prevent these things from happening again. You know, what our government is supposed to be doing. Not just sit on its hands say .."oh well.. the odds are low and it costs too much so we don't need to do anything. It's not fiscally responsible to do anything."

I agree.

Everytime there is an incident like this (not that there are so many but..) the discussion veers off. It starts with the suggestion that it's too early to politicize things which of course is impossible. Then, after a day or two, there are the steady streams of things like "these occurrences are so rare we should look elsewhere" or "Islam is a religion of peace" or "you can't paint all immigrants the same. Each of these is valid but you end up with nothing being done while everyone tries to be politically correct and say the right things.

The bottom line is as you say, one incident is too many. It's easy to dismiss these acts if you don't know the victims and can carry on with your day. The infrequent incidents however do point to a bigger problem and that is that around the world, these are increasing. So, after the next few days where we will be inundated with accusations of politicizing, bigotry, racism etc., the best bet is that nothing will be done and we'll just hold our breaths until it happens again.

Unfortunately, this is just an easy thing to say, but not realistic. There’s no policy or set of policies we can enforce that will eliminate every single attack, and at some point, we have to agree that whatever policies we have are “good enough,” and that we’re willing to accept the risks because the benefits of the policies in other areas outweigh the possibility of attacks.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

A simple quote from someone much smarter than me:

"Most will give up an acre of freedom for a closet of security. ~Dr. Idel Dreimer"


Those are the people that scare me the most, and they are on both sides of the isle in congress, in our higher education system, and in White House.

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"...the street finds its own uses for things"

Is "Dr. Dreimer" this guy? (https://disqus.com/by/drideldreimer/). ;-)

Anyway, how is having a better-defined and more tightly controlled immigration system that takes into account what we as a nation need and require from immigrants -- which almost every other industrialized nation in the West does (always excepting some nations' mania for taking in boatloads of refugees) -- somehow a sacrifice of any of our essential freedoms?

I'd say nations, including the US, have a right to define the terms and conditions by which people from other countries can come here or immigrate to here. Have skills we need? Move to the head of the line. Don't even like us to begin with and going to be a burden on our social welfare system? Not so fast. This is a 21st-century outlook, which is something we sorely need.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Turns out Saipov has already admitted that he first developed the idea to use a vehicle in an attack a year ago and that he was actively planning this attack for about 2 months. Also that he specifically chose Halloween because he knew there'd be a huge number of people along his planned killing route. He also asked detectives guarding his hospital room if they'd hang an ISIS flag outside his window, and that he was "proud of his attack."

Forensic examination of his cellphones also revealed about 90 ISIS-related videos on the devices and other ISIS propaganda materials. Associates of his may also have been under surveillance by US intelligence agencies. That's great.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Designate this man an unlawful enemy combatant, squeeze him for all he's worth, using every enhanced interrogation technique we have, and then summarily try him in front of a military court and just as summarily execute him.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Not a fan of that, especially for a guy who committed a crime on US soil.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

So much for that pesky constitution.

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

Better watch out. You could be an unlawful enemy combatant too.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)

Well, you whipped it out like it meant something that was going to shake-up the conversation. Sorry.

errr. no. you're pro immigration of people you see fit. white nationalists like more white nationalist, the kkk want people that are racists, like them too. lol.

who decides "our" needs? certainly not you. the beauty of america is that it is a melting pot. it's our diverse values that makes us great. the more people that think differently in the country the better we can innovate.

it's no surprise that we are still #1 in innovation. part of that is wealth, part of that is our ability to think, unlike any nation (which is starting to change imo).

after the vietnam war, hundreds of thousands of southeast asians came to america. did they share "your" values? certainly not. most of them were not christians for sure. i'm assuming this is what you mean by values. because other than religion most values of cultures are the same. care for your parents, spouse and children, be kind to others, cook lots of food at holidays, eat lots of food at holidays. enjoy sports, have pets....

john