http://www.newsinenglish.no/...dily-gaining-weight/

You never did answer if you felt threatened by Forge's "threat."

My wife, who's in the Guard, says probably by a lot. ;-)

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

I've never been the military, but I've worked with some Rangers and special warfare types, and they said physical fitness is huge in places like Afghanistan. And it's the opposite of what you might think. You'd think the Afghan fighters who grew up in the mountains would have an advantage, being skinny, well-acclimated, and not weighed down by all the shit in the modern foot-soldier's kit (which is seriously a lot of stuff). But apparently western/modern warfighters are just so much healthier and better fed that when it comes down to speed or endurance on foot, we still win almost every time. I think their rule of thumb was something like 15 minutes. E.g. if some dudes were trying to escape by running through mountain terrain, they'd be good for 15 minutes, then they'd be done.

Of course the guys I was talking to were far from average.

Running and gunning, running firefights, etc. require that you be able to "outcycle" the opposing force (i.e observe, orient, decide, act and then repeat, staying ahead of the enemy's reactions and forcing him to react to what you're doing rather than the other way around). To do that, you need to be reasonably fit, at minimum. Rangers, SEALs, Recon Marines, Air Force PJs and so forth, are far above "reasonably fit." At least, the conscientious ones are. The same holds true for British Royal Marines and SAS/SBS personnel and other nations' best military units, such as Russian Spetnaz and the like.

There's a good reason for that, and it's been shown time and again that having a good level of fitness in the field during extended hostile action can be the difference between living and dying, mainly because you can keep at it for longer than the enemy, both mentally and physically. You can shoot, move and communicate at a faster rate, for example.

Being better fed and better equipped also play a part, of course.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Frustrating as hell. The difference between active Infantry and Guard/Reserve medical types is almost unfathomable. A unit I was in years ago got to 90+% passing on the Army Physical Fitness Test while deployed, but was back to under 50% 1 year after returning home.

It's a reflection of society.

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If I don't, who will? -Me
It's like being bipolar in opinion is a requirement around here. -TripleThreat

I was a Marine as a youngster and then joined the Army after college. The Marines have a culture of "fitness is important". There'd be a lot of peer pressure on fatbodies to mend their ways. Also, rarely are they hurting for recruits, so they'll happily get rid of folks that can't get with the program.

Marines have a tradition of running. Trying to win the 3mi run in an USMC PT Test was always a battle. Seemed like every time I turned around someone would show up in the unit that could get close enough to 14 flat to scare the shit out of it.

The Army, excepting the 1% of the force that is Airborne or SOF, has no culture of fitness. Also, there's very little peer pressure directed towards fatbodies, and the process for getting rid of someone is an absolute nightmare.

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Books @ Amazon
"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart

Every Marine Corps unit I was in, whether it as a line infantry company, a Recon/STA unit, or an I&I staff at a medical battalion, the attitude was that you had to strive to be a "20/100/18 Marine" (20 pull-ups, 100 crunches, 18:00-minute-or-lower on the 3-mile run). The former DIs from the drill field were all maniacs for PT, and it rubbed off on every Marine around them. Of course, the attitude was very strong among infantry and Recon, but it was still there even in H&S, Motor-T and other units. "Every Marine is a rifleman" (and thank you, General Al Gray ;-) were the watchwords, so you stayed in shape because it was what you did for a living.

My wife says the attitude's a bit different in her Guard unit (which is a multifunctional medical battalion) and among other local units (an MP company and so forth). The former Marines in her unit (all there because of the brutal numbers-versus-boat spaces environment in the Corps) all stay in shape, but the ones who are pure Guard (BCT/AIT OSUT, etc.) are a bit different, and that while much attention is paid to "resiliency" (whatever that is) and getting ready for transgender Soldiers (I kid you not), the APFT isn't an obsession with either the troops or the leaders, and that a lot of the Soldiers are on a physical "profile" (physical restrictions), to top things off. It is what it is, I guess.

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

I was thinking this, too. When 2/3 of the population is overweight or obese, that leaves for some slim pickin' (no pun intended). Although, that does get skewed by including people of all ages. I'd like to see what the numbers look like for people who are 17-25 years old (i.e., recruitable ages, under normal circumstances).

When I was in, I remember the "fatbodies" in boot camp. If I remember right, of a platoon that started out with around 75 guys, there were maybe 4-6 fatbodies to start. A couple didn't finish boot camp (although not necessarily because of physical fitness), I think one might have been held back where they got a few extra weeks of boot camp (maybe due to injury during boot camp or maybe because of weight), and a couple slimmed down pretty well and made it out as quality recruits. No idea if they rebounded shortly after or what.

I was on the other end of the spectrum - I was a "doublerat", so I got extra food. :) I think I was 6' and 135-140 pounds when I went in. I'm pretty sure we had about the same number of doublerats as we had fatbodies.

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Travis Rassat
Vector Cycle Works
Noblesville, IN
BikeFit Instructor | FMS | F.I.S.T. | IBFI
Toughman Triathlon Series Ambassador

I went to boot (USMC) in '82. I was coming off my second year of running intercollegiate, a bad year of tendonitus problems. Altho the Marines were making me a calisthenics monster, I wasn't getting in any running to speak of. Winning the run in each platoon PT test was easy enough, but I had a ways to go to max out the situps and chinups, so I worked obsessively on those.

After 14wks, the day of the final PT test came. Instead of just being our 80(?) kid platoon, there were 4 platoons doing it together. I managed to max my situps and chinups so I was quite pleased with myself. I was finally going to "win" the PT test, and not for just my platoon, but for the entire "series" of 4 platoons. Brimming with confidence, I was there to kick ass and take names.

When the run started, some tall skinny black kid headed out pretty damned fast. I didn't know him, so he was from one of the other platoons. I immediately dismissed him as a rabbit.

He wasn't a rabbit. He positively crushed me. After not getting in a "real" run all Summer, he ran the 3miles in 14:20 to my 14:50. I only had a chance to exchange a couple words with "the rabbit", and I never saw him again. The guy had a composed maturity about him that the rest of us knucklehead largely lacked. I hope things worked out well for him.

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Books @ Amazon
"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart

LOL! good stuff. I was behind you 9 years ('91). Our DI's would not allow us to pass them during any PFT runs until the final PFT, then they said, "we're taking the chains off you today". It felt so good to run at open throttle, I don't remember my time but I got a '300', so I was under 18:00

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The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody