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First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan
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I completed my last IM in 2014 and have had the 'meh' attitude towards racing since. In the last week or two I've started to have the desire to put my mind to a big goal again. The marathon is 19 weeks away and the course is fast and downhill (5,300 ft in drop). I had knee surgery in January and have worked hard to build my strength up by lifting weights consistently 3-4 x week and I'm currently running minimally at 3-9 miles per week.

First, is this a good idea? Is 19 weeks away enough time to build a good base and get in the mileage realistically in a safe manner?

Second, I know that hiring a coach is the best way to get the most out of my race. This time around I'd like to just follow an online plan and adjust it how I need to. There seems to be a lot of running plans online that vary a lot in their methods. If any of you have used a good marathon plan that you like, please let me know. Thank you!
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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The Hanson Just Finish Plan looks like it would fit ya.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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It might be too much too soon, considering where your mileage is at. Also if you were meh for racing, a goal with that race duration and commensurate training time might become a pita.

You could set some other goal like take 30 secs off your 5/10km pb in x months, something that still requires mileage but without the need for very long runs. If that works out, hit the marathon?
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [JackL] [ In reply to ]
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Excellent idea.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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Hal Higdon's Novice 1 plan has runs of 3/3/3/6 the first week. It's 18 weeks.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [wcb] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think any open marathon RACED at 100% would be a good idea on such a crazy downhill course. Never mind a first timer with a suspect knee. The forces associated with defending are many times that on the flat. If you are just going to jog round and hi5 the crowd you could be OK. Or you lose form 22m in and wreck your knee. I personally find an open marathon tougher to recover from musculoskeletally than an IM due to the higher pace and that's on a sensible course.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [hutchy_belfast] [ In reply to ]
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I have heard from multiple athletes that have said that the recover is tougher for a stand alone marathon versus an IM. I definitely don't want to risk injuring my knee. I don't think I'd be able to hold back and take it easy if I ran it. Thanks for your input. I might shoot for the half marathon instead.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [Tibbsy] [ In reply to ]
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Tibbsy wrote:
The Hanson Just Finish Plan looks like it would fit ya.

I know a bunch of older runners around here who have have done well with this plan. It's nice during the winter as you don't need to run 20 milers in the cold
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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19 weeks to do a marathon, from your mileage, seems like (as others said) if you just want to finish, sure - but probably not to race it. OTOH, if this is your first stand-alone marathon, just finishing one and running it well is a good thing to do, so you can learn if you want to race one later.
but does it have to be *that* marathon? all that drop sounds rough. marathons can beat up your legs, quads especially, and the downhills can make that worse.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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utahtrigirl wrote:
I have heard from multiple athletes that have said that the recover is tougher for a stand alone marathon versus an IM. I definitely don't want to risk injuring my knee. I don't think I'd be able to hold back and take it easy if I ran it. Thanks for your input. I might shoot for the half marathon instead.
I can agree with this. I raced a downhill half marathon in January, then Boston last month, and both had me more sore than after any of my 3 IMs. Those downhills really tore up my quads. I'm also the type that can't really hold back. Take your time, and good luck!
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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If you were meh about Ironman and just had knee surgery, why not do something different?

I know you want a goal but why not set one that doesn't involve running. You could do some big hike or bicycle tour or something similar that will give you fitness and allow your knee to heal.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [Bob Loblaw] [ In reply to ]
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Some good points, thanks. I've done a couple of half marathons with around 3,500 ft of drop without issue. I love a screaming downhill course. I definitely could choose a flatter marathon but it doesn't appeal to me as much if that makes sense. I might just do the half and maybe the full the following year when I have more time to properly prepare for it.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [Sanuk] [ In reply to ]
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Just to clarify, I wasn't meh about my Ironman. Finishing my IM was one of the most rewarding things I've ever done. I suffered some burnout afterwards but I would've registered for another one but my spouse isn't on board with it which led to my meh attitude about racing long distance. Does that make sense? When I asked him about training for a marathon he was on board because the longest time I'd be away was a few hours versus the super long training days that training for an IM takes.

I do like your idea of maybe changing my goal to something to allow my knee to fully heal. Good idea.
Last edited by: utahtrigirl: May 4, 17 8:57
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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utahtrigirl wrote:
I do like your idea of maybe changing my goal to something to allow my knee to fully heal. Good idea.

Tore my glute medius a few months ago, hoping to run again for the first time this weekend.

Injury sucks, really really sucks, my motto for this year is now 'don't get injured' so whenever I make training decisions (intensity/goals) I evaluate them against injury risk.

I'm sure you could do the marathon, but you've gotta ask is it really worth the risk with a dodgy knee?
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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utahtrigirl wrote:
I have heard from multiple athletes that have said that the recover is tougher for a stand alone marathon versus an IM. I definitely don't want to risk injuring my knee. I don't think I'd be able to hold back and take it easy if I ran it. Thanks for your input. I might shoot for the half marathon instead.

Then you should consider a course that doesn't have 5,000+ft in drop. Do a course that has no drop, or is more or less flat, and you will be fine. 19 weeks is plenty of time--all that really matters is what your expectations should be, and you won't really even be able to make a goal until you start doing some training runs and/or smaller races along the way.

That much downhill has a good chance of wiping you out for several weeks.. it's a very hard toll on the body. Aim for something flat or moderately hilly and do it.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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I'm trying to count just how many red flags this marathon plan has:


Let's review:
Major knee surgery (recent)
Minimal mileage ( <10 mpw)
Marathon planned is only 19 weeks out


Brilliant plan

Personally I'd switch to the half or just eat the reg fee

//Noob triathlete//bike commuter//ex-swimmer//slower than you

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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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I see u are in Utah and I have done the Bryce Half when living in Cedar City and it was crazy hard on the legs. I had done lots of mountain runs with a lot more drop but not on pavement really trying to let it flow. Def cut it back or wait it out.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [utahtrigirl] [ In reply to ]
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I just picked up "Hansons Marathon Method" 2nd edition, and the template plans in there look pretty good. There's "Just Finish", "Beginner", and "Advanced" plans, all 16 weeks long. The marathon I want to run is in 27 weeks, so I'm doing the first 10 or so weeks of "Beginner" and then will move into the "Advanced" plan once I'm more fit than fat.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [Freddo] [ In reply to ]
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Haha. I'm glad so many have commented. Good news is that I haven't registered for anything. I'm going to shoot for the half. More good news is that the race has a very good refund/transfer/defer policy if my knee does start acting up while training for the half.
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Re: First marathon outside of an IM, looking for a plan [SteveM] [ In reply to ]
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I agree, dealing with an injury is the worrrrrst. I don't want to risk doing the full after I've been so careful to rehab it back after surgery. I'll train for the half and if I sense that training for the half is even too much, the race has a great refund/deferral/transfer policy.
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