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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [sciguy] [ In reply to ]
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Many thanks for the replies, I'll definitely give wiping it down a try next time then.

Next question, do any of you bother with adding PTFE and MoS2 to the paraffin? I've read that the frictional losses are only slightly lower than paraffin alone, but again I'm wondering if it might help improve the longevity of the treatment?
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [awenborn] [ In reply to ]
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awenborn wrote:
Many thanks for the replies, I'll definitely give wiping it down a try next time then.

Next question, do any of you bother with adding PTFE and MoS2 to the paraffin? I've read that the frictional losses are only slightly lower than paraffin alone, but again I'm wondering if it might help improve the longevity of the treatment?

I purchased both PTFE and MoS2 when I started this path and used the PTFE for the first batch but haven't used it since. I can't imagine it would make make the wax stick better. The Moly is so dark I'd worry it might mask the paraffin getting polluted with road grime. At this point I pop the wax puck out and scrape off the bottom layer every 3rd or forth waxing. You'll see a thin dark layer at the bottom that must have some grit in it.

Hugh

Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [ In reply to ]
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I am not sure if this is worthy of a post. Yesterday was cold and rainy in my area so before I jumped on the trainer I spent a little time with re-waxing the chain on the road bike. In January I went through the extensive cleaning with a new chain and wax treatment. That initial treatment really adhered to the metal and lasted for about 500 miles even with one or two rides in the rain before it became a bit noisy.

The second was a re-wax and I did not really do much other than just wipe off the exterior surface with a towel. Barely anything came off on the towel which was the testament to one of the bonuses of chain waxing - cleaner hands when handling. Plus, the cassette, chain rings and pulley wheels were all still very clean looking. However, this second re-wax seemed to only last about 300 miles before it became noisy. Performance wise I really couldn't tell much other than the noise and even the noise wasn't that bad.

So yesterday I wondered what would happen if I did a little more extensive cleaning again. Would it adhere to the metal as good as the first round? When I removed the chain I ran my finger over the chain and was very happy that very little came off on my hands. What I wanted to know is what would happen if I used boiling hot water in an ultrasonic tub with just a little dish detergent. Thinking since the only lube on the chain so far is wax the boiling water would soften and potentially remove the wax from the metal and allow new wax to bond to the surface. After two extensive runs in the tub I felt as if enough dirt and grit was removed. I will have to see how well it will stick for the next several hundred, winter weather, miles. To be determined.


Before cleaning the chain very little came off on my hand.



Two ultrasonic baths with boiling hot water and dish detergent. I was amazed how much filth was coming out of the links. Is it any wonder that the re-wax did not last as many miles as the first extensive cleaning with a new chain?



Water was starting to look cleaner during the wash.



I have two Premier Optimized chains (road and tri bikes) and the Premier Ultra Glide lube, but I plan to wait until I get past the winter wet months to use those in spring 2018.

Other weird things I did on a rainy Sunday was to Plasti Dip Co2 cartridges as an experiment. I thought I would give it a try and see. Just takes a few seconds to dip them into the paint can and then let them dry. I use dual cartridge bracket on the BTS bottle cage mount and they stick out like a sore thumb. Now they will have a nice black rubber coating that may also give a nice buffer if I have to use them and the metal turns frosty cold. At least they look nice. :-)
Last edited by: Felt_Rider: Nov 13, 17 4:13
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [lightheir] [ In reply to ]
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Is everyone with 11 speed components just breaking their chain and using a new pin or quick connect each time (since 11 speed quick connects are technically not reusable)? I know some people have cleaned and reapplied with the chain still on the bike, and...that just seems like a PIA but admittedly a new quick connect each time is pretty annoying.
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [JASpencer] [ In reply to ]
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JASpencer wrote:
Is everyone with 11 speed components just breaking their chain and using a new pin or quick connect each time (since 11 speed quick connects are technically not reusable)? I know some people have cleaned and reapplied with the chain still on the bike, and...that just seems like a PIA but admittedly a new quick connect each time is pretty annoying.

That's exactly what I do. Who said quick connects are not reusable? There is a whole tool just to take them off and put them back on. I've been taking mine on and off for years without issue. I toss the quick connect when I toss the chain.

I mean, I know the "official" stance is they are not reusable but that's what everyone does. Even the molten speed wax folks have that as part of their instructions
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [JASpencer] [ In reply to ]
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JASpencer wrote:
Is everyone with 11 speed components just breaking their chain and using a new pin or quick connect each time (since 11 speed quick connects are technically not reusable)? I know some people have cleaned and reapplied with the chain still on the bike, and...that just seems like a PIA but admittedly a new quick connect each time is pretty annoying.

I've reused KMC quick links and SRAM, but as you mention they are specified to be single use. The YBN links used by Molten Speed Wax are specified to allow up to something like 5 reuses. The easiest option is the Wipperman Connex link that allows removal without tools.
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Wipperman connex is reusable
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [mike s] [ In reply to ]
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so are ybn
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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KMC also makes the M/L-11R which is supposed to be reusable (designated by the R).
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [tyme] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for posting this.

They're also referred to as CL555R (again R for reusable) in line with the naming convention across their ranges, and engraved as such on them. However an internet-search for "CL555R" doesn't produce anything for me, it's only when I searched using the term "M/L-11R" that it comes up with some hits from UK retailers.

I don't know if these are new out, but I looked high-and-low earlier in the year and came up with nothing so I've just been reusing my (ostensibly non-reusable) CL555 and in fact, I did notice it was a lot looser last time I refitted it (maybe the 5th time or so now). I've just picked a couple of these up though; no obvious differences but I'll be glad to switch to something that is actually rated as reusable.


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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [Geek_fit] [ In reply to ]
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Geek_fit wrote:
Who said quick connects are not reusable?

...manufacturers of 11 speed quick connects? Sure, you can do whatever you want, but to blindly ignore a manufacturers recommendation on a part that could fail catastrophically...and costs a few dollars...is pretty silly. Anwyays, glad to see some reusable variants popping back up.
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [JASpencer] [ In reply to ]
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JASpencer wrote:
Geek_fit wrote:
Who said quick connects are not reusable?


...manufacturers of 11 speed quick connects? Sure, you can do whatever you want, but to blindly ignore a manufacturers recommendation on a part that could fail catastrophically...and costs a few dollars...is pretty silly. Anwyays, glad to see some reusable variants popping back up.

Yeah, I hear what you're saying. Though I've had the SRAM And the KMC links next to each other and they are basically identical. Been reusing SRAM ones for awhile, and even the LBS said they all do the same thing.

So a calculated risk, but I personally don't think it's much of one. I'll buy officially reusable ones once I burn though all my SRAMS though (I have a pile of them)
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [JASpencer] [ In reply to ]
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Indeed. Universal guidelines from third-parties are completely irrelevant. At the end of the day, 9- and 10-speed quick links have been widely rated as reusable for as long as I can remember and I'm sure manufacturers would have said the same about their 11-speed variants if they were confident in them being so.

You can risk it (and I have) but as I noted above my n=1 experience is that I've definitely noticed some loosening off of my "non-reusable" KMC one after a few refittings, which I never noticed in years of reusing the "certified-reusable" 10-speed ones.

I'm glad there that are some now available that the manufacturer's are confident in stating are reusable; I'm not sure what the difference is (perhaps manufactured from a more durable material?) but for me it's worth the £5 for peace-of-mind.
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [awenborn] [ In reply to ]
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awenborn wrote:
Thanks for posting this.

They're also referred to as CL555R (again R for reusable) in line with the naming convention across their ranges, and engraved as such on them. However an internet-search for "CL555R" doesn't produce anything for me, it's only when I searched using the term "M/L-11R" that it comes up with some hits from UK retailers.

I don't know if these are new out, but I looked high-and-low earlier in the year and came up with nothing so I've just been reusing my (ostensibly non-reusable) CL555 and in fact, I did notice it was a lot looser last time I refitted it (maybe the 5th time or so now). I've just picked a couple of these up though; no obvious differences but I'll be glad to switch to something that is actually rated as reusable.

Did you order these from an online shop? I can't seem to find any..
Thx
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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Yep, here:

https://www.evanscycles.com/...inks-2-pack-EV312173

Despite the stock picture showing a link with CL555 on it, these are definitely the CL555R reusable ones; the two "Ask A Question" things at the bottom, state as much if you don't want to take my word for it!

They're a UK retailer, so not sure if it's the best option for you (presumably in Canada, given your name?!) but you could try sticking "KMC M/L-11R", "KMC CL555R" or even the product barcode number on my photo into Google and see if it throws up any local options?
Last edited by: awenborn: Nov 16, 17 8:12
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [awenborn] [ In reply to ]
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Thx!
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Re: Paraffin wax bike chain converts - drawbacks? [awenborn] [ In reply to ]
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You can also get them directly from KMC (Although it is a 6 pack)

http://store.kmcchain.us/...nk-11r-reusable?pp=8
Last edited by: tyme: Nov 16, 17 9:00
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