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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [beston] [ In reply to ]
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beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.

I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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As someone who lost over 70 lbs back in my early 20s and has managed to keep off most of that for 25ish years I'd say that the people who I have come across who get the most worked up about the calories in vs calories out discussion are those who have never had a serious weight issue in their lives. Having to skip your cookies at lunch does not qualify as a weight issue and does not make you an expert on the subject. I appreciate that it works for you but don't think for a second that it qualifies you to provide weight loss advice to anyone else.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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I think that's the point. I tried to stop eating so much in all of December that the change was negligible. Biggest problems that I saw were:
  • eating 6 small(er) meals a day. Sometimes with snacks here or there. (Like Fage yogurt mind you!)
  • never exercising in a fasted state. (I always had breakfast, or some dates/oatmeal before my 1-2hr trainings)

As opposed to what Ed O'malley thinks, each week I eat the same or more calories now and maintain 184lbs easily. Understanding how insulin works in the body was huge for me.

If I don't get my dessert immediately after my meal, I don't eat a dessert. I'm going for 3 (or less) insulin spikes a day.

Fasted cardio was huge for me too.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [ACE] [ In reply to ]
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Too much sugar can screw up your liver and metabolism and make it harder to lose wait.
.
.
.
Additionally, studies suggest do long term, long distance cardio can play havoc on your metabolism too.
---

Body functions and metabolism are on the 'calorie out' side of the equation.

---
If your body is used to training for an Ironman, ( 30 hours of more of cardio a week), its not going to lose weight doing 5 hours of cardio a week.
---
Which supports calories in/ out more than it refutes it.






Take a short break from ST and read my blog:
http://tri-banter.blogspot.com/
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.

You are just plain wrong and, worse yet, your narcissism has a net-negative effect on discussions like this (and the world, in general). Anyone who ascribes the term "excuses" to others and can't understand why everyone can't replicate what has "made me successful" ought to be ignored. I realized this will likely fall on your deaf ears, but for god's sake please do some actual study on the topic before posting about "how easy" this is. We all get that you love yourself - no need to also erroneously criticize others.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.

So you say there are a ton of other factors... Sure, the basics are 'in/out'. Defining how much 'in' is more complex. It just depends on the level you want to look.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [HVP] [ In reply to ]
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HVP wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.


You are just plain wrong and, worse yet, your narcissism has a net-negative effect on discussions like this (and the world, in general). Anyone who ascribes the term "excuses" to others and can't understand why everyone can't replicate what has "made me successful" ought to be ignored. I realized this will likely fall on your deaf ears, but for god's sake please do some actual study on the topic before posting about "how easy" this is. We all get that you love yourself - no need to also erroneously criticize others.

Lets see, if I want to get skinny I ask a Fat person what they do?

If I want to get rich I ask a poor person who to do?

If I want to get faster in the swim I ask BOP swimmer what to do?

Etc,. Etc.

For the folks who think I have always been skinny, well, before I understood that as we get older you cannot eat anything one wants, I was at 190 and climbing.
So, I do know something about what it takes to get off and keep off weight. AND IT IS NOT EASY!!!

Of well, I will continue to say, it is so easy to just say one cannot get it off. Did one put on the weight in a short amount of time? Does it come off in a short
amount of time?

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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Dave,

Perhaps you're one of the many Prozac users who find that losing weight and keeping it off becomes easy. Have you ever considered that?

Hugh

Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
HVP wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.


You are just plain wrong and, worse yet, your narcissism has a net-negative effect on discussions like this (and the world, in general). Anyone who ascribes the term "excuses" to others and can't understand why everyone can't replicate what has "made me successful" ought to be ignored. I realized this will likely fall on your deaf ears, but for god's sake please do some actual study on the topic before posting about "how easy" this is. We all get that you love yourself - no need to also erroneously criticize others.


Lets see, if I want to get skinny I ask a Fat person what they do?

If I want to get rich I ask a poor person who to do?

If I want to get faster in the swim I ask BOP swimmer what to do?

Etc,. Etc.

For the folks who think I have always been skinny, well, before I understood that as we get older you cannot eat anything one wants, I was at 190 and climbing.
So, I do know something about what it takes to get off and keep off weight. AND IT IS NOT EASY!!!

Of well, I will continue to say, it is so easy to just say one cannot get it off. Did one put on the weight in a short amount of time? Does it come off in a short
amount of time?


What a surprise: "me, me, me...". As I said before, maybe do some actual study on the topic. That is a far more useful approach than, as you say, "asking a fat person what they do. Or asking a BOP swimmer what they do." You simply prefer the n=1 method. Or in your case, n=me!
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
HVP wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.


You are just plain wrong and, worse yet, your narcissism has a net-negative effect on discussions like this (and the world, in general). Anyone who ascribes the term "excuses" to others and can't understand why everyone can't replicate what has "made me successful" ought to be ignored. I realized this will likely fall on your deaf ears, but for god's sake please do some actual study on the topic before posting about "how easy" this is. We all get that you love yourself - no need to also erroneously criticize others.


Lets see, if I want to get skinny I ask a Fat person what they do?

If I want to get rich I ask a poor person who to do?

If I want to get faster in the swim I ask BOP swimmer what to do?

Etc,. Etc.

For the folks who think I have always been skinny, well, before I understood that as we get older you cannot eat anything one wants, I was at 190 and climbing.
So, I do know something about what it takes to get off and keep off weight. AND IT IS NOT EASY!!!

Of well, I will continue to say, it is so easy to just say one cannot get it off. Did one put on the weight in a short amount of time? Does it come off in a short
amount of time?

Wow, 190, what a heffer. I race at 185 and was at 275. Come talk then

And stop using the effing return button so often and randomly. Your posts are nearly unreadable for that reason alons
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [sciguy] [ In reply to ]
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sciguy wrote:
Dave,

Perhaps you're one of the many Prozac users who find that losing weight and keeping it off becomes easy. Have you ever considered that?

Hugh

I do not use excuses for things I really want to accomplish. I just work hard and keep my eye on the goal.

But taking off 30 lbs and keeping it off was and is not easy work. But again, if you want to get skinny, talk to the guy or gal who is 300 lbs.
I bet they have all the solutions that work and excuses.

Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

Boom Nutrition code 19F4Y3 $5 off 24 pack box | Bionic Runner | PowerCranks | Velotron | Spruzzamist

Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
sciguy wrote:
Dave,

Perhaps you're one of the many Prozac users who find that losing weight and keeping it off becomes easy. Have you ever considered that?

Hugh


I do not use excuses for things I really want to accomplish. I just work hard and keep my eye on the goal.

But taking off 30 lbs and keeping it off was and is not easy work. But again, if you want to get skinny, talk to the guy or gal who is 300 lbs.
I bet they have all the solutions that work and excuses.


My point was the answer to why its hard to lose weight and keep it off or maintain decent health is maybe its more complicated than just calories v calories out. If that works for you, great, but research is starting to shed more light on it. The metabolism, insulin resistance, training effect, thyroid all make it harder or easier based upon ones own makeup.

Plus, some calories are better for you than others, there can't be any dispute out that anymore. Sugar is toxic to the body and eating too much will make it hard to lose weight, maintiain and be healthy. Its not just weight, it metabolic syndrome.

IF you really want to lose weight and just starve yourself, I am sure that would probably work, but not going to be healthy in the long run. Eating 500 cal a day and running 10 miles a day would probably do the trick but it may kill you too.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [ACE] [ In reply to ]
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There is always this:

Quote:
By Desert Dude strict rules for eating while at the LHPTC. They are as follows:

1. No eating after 7:30 unless coming back from a late evening workout over 30min. If under 30min you may have 1 gel and a piece of fruit or 1 energy bar.

2. Dinner is all you can eat, as long as it fits on the coffee saucer the first time. There are no refills in this all you can eat establishment.

3. Hungry at night? Tough - you should have eaten more throughout the day. Have a glass of water instead of whining. Whiners pay rent irregardless if they trained that day or not.

4. eat something within 20 min of completing all workouts.

5. Insure you are taking in adequate calories during your day

6. Eat a bigger breakfast or lunch if you feel you need more food

7. Make sure you are fueling properly when in your training sessions.

8. Still hungry? Pay rent for whining


Suffer Well.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [abrown] [ In reply to ]
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abrown wrote:
When I need to lean out, my best strategy is always cutting back dinner, which I when I think most people tend to overeat. Eat a big breakfast, a significant lunch, fuel your workouts properly, and eat a smaller dinner than you usually would. Don't eat to discomfort, stop the second you stop feeling hungry, and try to stop eating after 8pm. Rely on protein at dinner.

You may also be "overcompensating" for the higher level of exercise you're doing now. Even at 15-20mpw, you're burning what, an extra 1500-2000kcal/week? You may be overestimating your nutrition needs.

Voila, race weight, or at least closer than you were!

My N=1 I've been relatively successful eating most of my calories at dinner.

Workout in the morning after coffee and no food. Who knows whether I'm burning fat or glycogen stored in my muscles overnight. Who cares. I'm not aiming to "train fasted", I'm just not hungry in the AM and I'm good for 1h45m until I need a gel or some other performance nutrition. 300-500 calories immediately post-workout gets me to lunch, which is a salad with protein. Late afternoon snack 200-300 calories (sometimes skip) and then reward myself at dinner with massive amounts of veggies, protein, fat and if I am ravenous after a workout in which I know I burned a lot of calories, I'll eat extra cereal, high cocoa-content dark chocolate, whatever.

What I do takes some minor restraint (zero sugar except from fruit/dairy, limited alcohol, sometimes hungry late morning), but I have solved for my main psychological barrier, that is being mildly hungry when going to sleep.

2017 races: St. George 70.3 May 6 | Madison 70.3 June 11 | IM Zurich July 30 | Chicago Marathon October 8
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
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h2ofun wrote:
sciguy wrote:
Dave,

Perhaps you're one of the many Prozac users who find that losing weight and keeping it off becomes easy. Have you ever considered that?

Hugh

I do not use excuses for things I really want to accomplish. I just work hard and keep my eye on the goal.

But taking off 30 lbs and keeping it off was and is not easy work. But again, if you want to get skinny, talk to the guy or gal who is 300 lbs.
I bet they have all the solutions that work and excuses.

I suspect you are probably one of the less healthy people posting here. You rail on about 'fat' people and really have no clue. At 6'5" and 190lbs you were still on the low end of the weight scale. You're constantly talking about cutting out the cookies and ice cream and eating anything you want, sounds like a terrible way to stay at 'race weight' especially when you do this for health and don't care about your performance...
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [jmh] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
jmh wrote:
There is always this:

Quote:
By Desert Dude strict rules for eating while at the LHPTC. They are as follows:

1. No eating after 7:30 unless coming back from a late evening workout over 30min. If under 30min you may have 1 gel and a piece of fruit or 1 energy bar.

2. Dinner is all you can eat, as long as it fits on the coffee saucer the first time. There are no refills in this all you can eat establishment.

3. Hungry at night? Tough - you should have eaten more throughout the day. Have a glass of water instead of whining. Whiners pay rent irregardless if they trained that day or not.

4. eat something within 20 min of completing all workouts.

5. Insure you are taking in adequate calories during your day

6. Eat a bigger breakfast or lunch if you feel you need more food

7. Make sure you are fueling properly when in your training sessions.

8. Still hungry? Pay rent for whining

Ensure

2017 races: St. George 70.3 May 6 | Madison 70.3 June 11 | IM Zurich July 30 | Chicago Marathon October 8
Quote Reply
Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [h2ofun] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
h2ofun wrote:
HVP wrote:
h2ofun wrote:
beston wrote:
Thanks for the link! I really appreciate the perspective put forward here.

While I appreciate the 'calories in/out' way of thinking, it really ignores any concept of the adaptability of our metabolism. Dr. Fung really starts to addresses this concept around 16min into that presentation.


I continued to be amazed at the excuses. Just stop eating so much such that the scale stops going up at night. I just will never understand
why this is so hard. Basically all the articles I read from folks who have done weight lose, and kept it off, talk about changing to portion control.
So simple. Why do so many just find a ton of excuses to just eat less. And yes, there may be a ton of other factors that change around which is why
one needs to check their weight and adjust their food intake all year long. Sure has made me successful staying at race weight all year long.
If one is serious about being competitive, well, this is at the top of the list. I just do not see the top level racers being heavy.


You are just plain wrong and, worse yet, your narcissism has a net-negative effect on discussions like this (and the world, in general). Anyone who ascribes the term "excuses" to others and can't understand why everyone can't replicate what has "made me successful" ought to be ignored. I realized this will likely fall on your deaf ears, but for god's sake please do some actual study on the topic before posting about "how easy" this is. We all get that you love yourself - no need to also erroneously criticize others.


Lets see, if I want to get skinny I ask a Fat person what they do?

If I want to get rich I ask a poor person who to do?

If I want to get faster in the swim I ask BOP swimmer what to do?

Etc,. Etc.

For the folks who think I have always been skinny, well, before I understood that as we get older you cannot eat anything one wants, I was at 190 and climbing.
So, I do know something about what it takes to get off and keep off weight. AND IT IS NOT EASY!!!

Of well, I will continue to say, it is so easy to just say one cannot get it off. Did one put on the weight in a short amount of time? Does it come off in a short
amount of time?
If as Jctriguy says you are indeed 6'5" then your suggestion that you have experience with excess weight having once been 190lbs is absurd. And the fact that you don't realise that makes your lack of perspective even more obvious.

"If I want to get rich I ask a poor person who to do?"


No-one said that. But asking someone who's always been been wealthy is an equally poor approach to asking someone who's always carried significant excess weight. Do you think Trump would be "rich" if he started poor?

To a great extent I agree with your suggestion to weigh yourself regularly and adjust intake accordingly. What I don't agree with is your attitude towards those who are struggling to achieve their targets. It's not helpful and it's not pleasant.
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Re: Can't shed post ironman weight gain [surfNJmatt] [ In reply to ]
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A few weeks isn't long, give it time. I find that if I ramp up training significantly from a low base my weight stays the same or actually goes up initially. Assume this is because the ramp up causes muscle inflammation which causes the body to retain more fluid while it's healing itself. Once the body adjusts to the new workload this settles down and the weight loss starts coming. I normally give it a month or so, if the weight loss hasn't kicked in by then then that's when I would up the exercise or tighten up the diet more.
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