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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
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MJuric wrote:
Sadly, however, I think many in the LR are going to misinterpret to mean that the fault of all racism lies solely with blacks and liberals, which is not at all what he is saying.

I can't remember a single person here ever saying the fault of ALL racism lies SOLELY with blacks and liberals. Every conversation I can ever remember has always been argued from the standpoint that yes, true racism exists and for the most part to some degree will always exist but that for the last couple decades more and more "Racism" exists as nothing more then made up indoctrination from the black community and liberal leaders attempting to use racism as a tool.

I agree with the poster, zero question that racism, police brutality and similar exist. I find it a stupid argument to claim it doesn't and I think most here save a few would agree. However racism, police brutality et al seem to be a mere fraction of what is being touted as such and certainly even less then what many believe to exist in reality.

Furthermore I know of almost no one that is actively seeking to "Keep the black man down" and to the contrary I know many that actively go out of their way to "Help the black man out". This is the case to such a large degree that it is essentially law in several areas to attempt to "Balance historical wrong doing" and certainly culture to do so in far more areas.

We live in a society where the outcome of ones life is dominated by the choices and actions of the individual. This is true, without question, of all Americans regardless of race, gender, sexual orientation or any other protected group. To live ones life blaming most of ones ills on the actions of others is to ignore reality.

~Matt

Excellent post Matt

************************
#WeAreTheForge #BlackGunsMatter

"Look, will you guys at leats accept that you are a bunch of dumb asses and just trust me on this one? Please?" BarryP 7/30/2012
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [Brownie28] [ In reply to ]
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Can't say I'm not surprised, given thread discussions of the past. Haven't you argued for affirmative action on numerous occasions? Seems to fly in the face of what this gentleman is arguing.


So the fact that I have argued for affirmative action leads you to believe that I must be completely out of touch with reality such that I can't see the rampant racism that exists within the black community? You do realize that the two concepts are completely unrelated, right?

Maybe I missed it, but I'm pretty sure he didn't that the reason why [some] blacks hate whites is because the government has protected them against discriminatory hiring practices.

-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
-----------------------------RunTraining articles here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...runtraining;#1612485
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [BarryP] [ In reply to ]
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BarryP wrote:

So the fact that I have argued for affirmative action leads you to believe that I must be completely out of touch with reality such that I can't see the rampant racism that exists within the black community? You do realize that the two concepts are completely unrelated, right?

Maybe I missed it, but I'm pretty sure he didn't that the reason why [some] blacks hate whites is because the government has protected them against discriminatory hiring practices.

Well you did admit that you only watched half the video :)

"Black lives matter, progressive media, leftist politicians, college professors, all of them in my opinion have been proactive in fueling this anti-white social wave, and it does exist. It does nothing to help black people in their pursuit of justice and prosperity, it does nothing to help educate black youth in particular on how to better themselves. It only serves to keep them in a state of depressed victimhood."

"Stop thinking the way they want you to. Stop continuing this superstition of the white man being out to get you. Fight for your own freedom before the freedom of the collective. Then and only then do we have a chance to improve on average, en mass. Not through social democracy, but through individual successes. So shout-out to the people who really believe blacks can achieve more. Shout-out to the individualists, the (???), the capitalists, the people who believe that blacks have the potential to rise up, rather than those who pity us, and think that the most we're capable of is begging government to subsidize our stagnation. The ones that vote to give us handouts, the ones who make excuses for our shortcomings and reward us for our failures, these are the ones instilling this defeatist mentality into our culture. The ones who are telling you that you've already lost the game before you've even picked up the controller, ignore these people."

His point: hand-outs, social engineering, excuse-making, the victim mentality is what is killing black America. If you don't believe that black people can achieve on their own, with no handouts, with no discriminatory step-ups, then you're part of the problem. It's not just about violence and inner-city issues, it's about the media and politicians making excuses for black people and allowing them to feel victimized.

That's my take anyway, after listening to the entire video three times.
Last edited by: Brownie28: Jan 11, 17 6:28
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [Brownie28] [ In reply to ]
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His point: hand-outs, social engineering, excuse-making, the victim mentality is what is killing black America. If you don't believe that black people can achieve on their own, with no handouts, with no discriminatory step-ups, then you're part of the problem. It's not just about violence and inner-city issues, it's about the media and politicians making excuses for black people and allowing them to feel victimized.


Its not a one extreme answer vs the other. I agree with a lot of his sentiment, but you referenced AA laws earlier. That's not a handout. A law that requires companies who historically seem to not be able to hire qualified black applicants to start doing so is not a handout. Its forcing them to stop prejudicial hiring practices. Having said that, you can point to pieces of the law, or the way its been implemented and argue that they are handouts, and I would agree, and we'd both agree that they are bad ideas.

The basic sentiment from this video is that he is taking an approach to stop blaming white people, or to think that whites in general are out to get him, and on an individual level that is certainly the best way to succeed regardless of color. ie It is an incredibly healthy attitude, and more good would come from that if all blacks (or any other disenfranchised group) would get on board with it.

Having said that, he's either wrong on one point, or at least overstating his position, and that's the idea that the advantages that whites have over blacks is just bullshit superstition. Note, he didn't actually site any research to back up his position, or even note any personal experiences. He just simply believes it. Now where he is probably right is that the degree that the white hating blacks think that whites have an advantage is likely way over exaggerated.

As I said, its not a white or black situation.
The left causes problems.
The right causes problems.
There are plenty of black and white racists.
Success is largely self determined.
Money, racism, home/neighborhood environments, schools, etc. impact your chance for success.
Whites do have an advantage in America.
That advantage is not overwhelming and has been dwindling over time.
Activism fuels hatred against the very class that one is acting against.
Activism has also proven, historically, that its the only method to incite real change.


Or to put it simply, "crutches" are good things, and they are bad things.

-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
-----------------------------RunTraining articles here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...runtraining;#1612485
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [BarryP] [ In reply to ]
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BarryP wrote:


Its not a one extreme answer vs the other. I agree with a lot of his sentiment, but you referenced AA laws earlier. That's not a handout. A law that requires companies who historically seem to not be able to hire qualified black applicants to start doing so is not a handout. Its forcing them to stop prejudicial hiring practices. Having said that, you can point to pieces of the law, or the way its been implemented and argue that they are handouts, and I would agree, and we'd both agree that they are bad ideas.

We've discussed this ad naseum before but I'll just say: when less qualified candidates for college entrance and professional jobs are getting preference because of skin color that is a handout. It's a discriminatory practice. You can absolutely argue that it's correcting racist, discriminatory practices of the past and that may well be the case. But it's still a handout to people underqualified for the university or position. And to bring it back to what I said earlier: the person in the video would disagree with your stance on affirmative action, which is why I was surprised you said it was a good video. But then, you only watched half of it anyway.

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As I said, its not a white or black situation.
The left causes problems.
The right causes problems.
There are plenty of black and white racists.
Success is largely self determined.
Money, racism, home/neighborhood environments, schools, etc. impact your chance for success.
Whites do have an advantage in America.

You had me up until here. If you control for education and income, what advantage do whites have in this country? Last I checked it was black people who had literal advantages through affirmative action. No, what whites have is a socioeconomic advantage. But so do Asians. Actually, Asians are more successful than white people, maybe they're holding everyone back!

EDIT: I'm being a bit hyperbolic here, and yes I do realize that the demographics and underlying racist views that everyone holds to some degree means that white people, in fact, do have a leg up in this country. That doesn't mean everyone can't be successful, it doesn't mean white people are holding other people down. It means it's likely a little easier for a white person to live here and be successful here. Just like it's likely a little easier to a Japanese person to be successful in Japan. But that doesn't not preclude others from being successful.

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Activism fuels hatred against the very class that one is acting against.
Activism has also proven, historically, that its the only method to incite real change.

I think hard work and proving oneself is what has incited real change in all other historical instances of race warfare. It's how the Irish and Italians did it, it's how the Asians and Jewish did it, it's how Hispanics are doing it. They've all been discriminated against in this country. Black people have a very different history than these other demographics, obviously, but that doesn't mean they can't be successful--our outgoing President proves that. The biggest issue for black people in this country isn't racist white people and bad cops, it's their own socioeconomic situations, single-mothers homes and drugs and gangs.
Last edited by: Brownie28: Jan 11, 17 7:23
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [Brownie28] [ In reply to ]
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We've discussed this ad naseum before but I'll just say: when less qualified candidates for college entrance and professional jobs are getting preference because of skin color that is a handout. It's a discriminatory practice. You can absolutely argue that it's correcting racist, discriminatory practices of the past and that may well be the case. But it's still a handout to people underqualified for the university or position. And to bring it back to what I said earlier: the person in the video would disagree with your stance on affirmative action, which is why I was surprised you said it was a good video. But then, you only watched half of it anyway.


In other words, you agree with this part that I wrote: "Having said that, you can point to pieces of the law, or the way its been implemented and argue that they are handouts, and I would agree, and we'd both agree that they are bad ideas."

Now is this going to be the last time that you ignore that part of my position, or are we going to have to repeat this again?


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You had me up until here. If you control for education and income, what advantage do whites have in this country?

Higher incarceration rates for the same crimes
50% the rate of gaining interviews with identical resumes
The vast majority of racism from a position of power is directed against minorities, not whites (can you point to a single incidence of a black police department that has been unfairly harassing whites in its precinct).

That's controlling for education an income.

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EDIT: I'm being a bit hyperbolic here, and yes I do realize that the demographics and underlying racist views that everyone holds to some degree means that white people, in fact, do have a leg up in this country. That doesn't mean everyone can't be successful, it doesn't mean white people are holding other people down. It means it's likely a little easier for a white person to live here and be successful here. Just like it's likely a little easier to a Japanese person to be successful in Japan. But that doesn't not preclude others from being successful.

I agree, and its likely the attitude that this kid is taking, or the attitude that Neil Degrasse Tyson took. But to reference him, he more or less said, "I had so many obstacles to overcome, and was able to succeed, but its unreasonable to expect most people to do the same with those same obstacles." Being white is like wearing cleats in football. If you work hard and have talent, you can go pretty far without those cleats, but cleats sure do help.

What's unfortunate is that the concept of "white privilege," was supposed to help people understand what benefits they've had when they look down their nose at blacks. Instead it has made them angrier and more resentful. I don't get it........but then again, I'm not a very insecure person.

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I think hard work and proving oneself is what has incited real change in all other historical instances of race warfare. It's how the Irish and Italians did it, it's how the Asians and Jewish did it, it's how Hispanics are doing it. They've all been discriminated against in this country. Black people have a very different history than these other demographics, obviously, but that doesn't mean they can't be successful--our outgoing President proves that. The biggest issue for black people in this country isn't racist white people and bad cops, it's their own socioeconomic situations, single-mothers homes and drugs and gangs.

I don't disagree. Having said that, you should look up the history of how those gangs got started. It wasn't exactly a bunch of suburban middle class kids who just wanted to throw it all away and start gangs. It was largely a backlash against segregation. Again, that's water under the bridge, but I think its important to understand, blacks didn't create their own circumstances. And that's all I'm saying......its important to understand.

-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
-----------------------------RunTraining articles here:
http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...runtraining;#1612485
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [getcereal] [ In reply to ]
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getcereal wrote:
Educational- Very articulate far surpassing a recent Golden Globe winner recipient.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iNumDWB3rk

And who is teaching Black folks Whitey wants them to fail?

Sorry I still have no idea how to embed a video.

Just watched the video. Well said by that young man. Great mindset. He will go far.
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [BarryP] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:

What's unfortunate is that the concept of "white privilege," was supposed to help people understand what benefits they've had when they look down their nose at blacks. Instead it has made them angrier and more resentful. I don't get it........but then again, I'm not a very insecure person.
.

This has also been discussed ad nauseum. This may have been the intention but it has become "look you racist pricks, you better check your privilege". Usually presented in a very condecesding manner.

Maybe you haven't noticed but people don't like it when someone is condescending to them. They especially don't like it if that person is right and being all smarmy about it.

Maybe you don't see it as coming across that way but many, many people do. So the answer is "fuck you".

Why did so many people vote Trump? (by the way is mentioning Trump in a thread going to be like the new mention Hitler?) a lot of it was a big fuck you to the condescending left. Real or imagined, it's there.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [BLeP] [ In reply to ]
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Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [TimeIsUp] [ In reply to ]
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First I am Canadian and didn't get a vote.

Second I would never have voted for Trump.

Third If a white man said what this black man said you would be screaming that he's racist and out of touch.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [TimeIsUp] [ In reply to ]
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TimeIsUp wrote:
Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.

Wow! You're projecting a bit aren't you? What are you basing this on? The people that I've spoken to about their votes never said anything about voting for him because they thought it would be cool to have a celebrity. Some voted for him because they were vehemently opposed to Hillary - my parents and a number of their acquaintances are in that group . Others said they were voting for him because they believed that he was the anti-establishment candidate and would truly make America great again.

FWIW - I did not vote for Trump, and have never liked him. But your comment disparages many millions of people who are a bit deeper than you give them credit for. Your statement is a prime example of the attitudes of voters and politicians that drove people to elect Trump.
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [BLeP] [ In reply to ]
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BLeP wrote:
First I am Canadian and didn't get a vote.

Second I would never have voted for Trump.

Third If a white man said what this black man said you would be screaming that he's racist and out of touch.

First, go give a moose a reach around.

Second, try not to get kicked in the nuts while doing so.

Third, if I agreed with him, why the hell would I think any different no matter who said it? I didn't even notice he was black until you pointed it out. Why can't you just listen to what someone has to say and not have what they say defined by what race they are? That's racist.
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [rick_pcfl] [ In reply to ]
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rick_pcfl wrote:
TimeIsUp wrote:
Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.

Wow! You're projecting a bit aren't you? What are you basing this on? The people that I've spoken to about their votes never said anything about voting for him because they thought it would be cool to have a celebrity. Some voted for him because they were vehemently opposed to Hillary - my parents and a number of their acquaintances are in that group . Others said they were voting for him because they believed that he was the anti-establishment candidate and would truly make America great again.

FWIW - I did not vote for Trump, and have never liked him. But your comment disparages many millions of people who are a bit deeper than you give them credit for. Your statement is a prime example of the attitudes of voters and politicians that drove people to elect Trump.

Oh, I'm sorry. You talked to some people, but I'm the one projecting. Take a look around at what catches the population's attention. America is fucking stupid. Oh, except for your parents and a number of their acquaintances.
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [TimeIsUp] [ In reply to ]
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TimeIsUp wrote:
rick_pcfl wrote:
TimeIsUp wrote:
Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.


Wow! You're projecting a bit aren't you? What are you basing this on? The people that I've spoken to about their votes never said anything about voting for him because they thought it would be cool to have a celebrity. Some voted for him because they were vehemently opposed to Hillary - my parents and a number of their acquaintances are in that group . Others said they were voting for him because they believed that he was the anti-establishment candidate and would truly make America great again.

FWIW - I did not vote for Trump, and have never liked him. But your comment disparages many millions of people who are a bit deeper than you give them credit for. Your statement is a prime example of the attitudes of voters and politicians that drove people to elect Trump.


Oh, I'm sorry. You talked to some people, but I'm the one projecting. Take a look around at what catches the population's attention. America is fucking stupid. Oh, except for your parents and a number of their acquaintances.

So what did you base your statement on? How many people did you talk to who admitted to voting for Trump because they thought it would be cool to have a celebrity as president?
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [rick_pcfl] [ In reply to ]
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rick_pcfl wrote:
TimeIsUp wrote:
Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.


Wow! You're projecting a bit aren't you? What are you basing this on? The people that I've spoken to about their votes never said anything about voting for him because they thought it would be cool to have a celebrity. Some voted for him because they were vehemently opposed to Hillary - my parents and a number of their acquaintances are in that group . Others said they were voting for him because they believed that he was the anti-establishment candidate and would truly make America great again.

FWIW - I did not vote for Trump, and have never liked him. But your comment disparages many millions of people who are a bit deeper than you give them credit for. Your statement is a prime example of the attitudes of voters and politicians that drove people to elect Trump.

I think Duffy said it best, I'll paraphrase, Trump, making leftists crazy, one tweet at a time.

************************
#WeAreTheForge #BlackGunsMatter

"Look, will you guys at leats accept that you are a bunch of dumb asses and just trust me on this one? Please?" BarryP 7/30/2012
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [rick_pcfl] [ In reply to ]
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No, they just wanted a celebrity. You're an idiot.

How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?
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Re: Why do Blacks hate White people? [TimeIsUp] [ In reply to ]
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TimeIsUp wrote:
Why did so many people vote Trump? Because they thought it would cool to have a celebrity as president. Because they think it will allow them to say whatever the fuck they want whenever they want to say it. Yes, that is what our society has come to. That may not have been why you voted for him, but that's why many people did. Yes, I realize you will most likely never see that simple truth.

I agree with the guy in the video nearly 100%, but please don't fool yourself into thinking the genpop voted for Trump because he is some kind of anti-left hero. That's you imagining what you want him to stand for.
What are you basing this on? Rick cited some people he knows as at least some evidence that runs counter to your belief, and I'll add my n=1, the people who I know who voted for Trump certainly didn't do so because of his 'celebrity'. I know a number of people who were in the #neverHillary camp. I know a few who were pulling the lever for the R no matter what. And I know a couple who are anti-establishment, small government types who want to see Washington burn (figuratively). They're getting a kick out of the hysteria and the mainstream media puking all over themselves. I am too, actually, but I didn't vote for Trump and think he's an embarrassment. Regardless, there are some studies on the election results from sites like fivethirtyeight.com that also run counter to your assertion.

Frankly, you're doing what liberals and the mainstream media did leading up to the election and also in the aftermath: insulting and denigrating the middle class voters that carried Trump to the White House.
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