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Please tell me what this means!
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When asked by Holt to defend his proposal to cut taxes on the rich.

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They are going to expand their companies and do a tremendous job. I'm getting rid of the great thing for the wealthy, it's a great thing for the middle class and for companies to expand and when these people are going to put billions and billions of dollars into companies and when they are going to bring $2.5 trillion back from overseas where they can't bring the money back because politicians like Secretary Clinton won't allow them to bring the money back because the taxes are so onerous and the bureaucratic red tape, it's so bad.
So what they are doing is leaving our country and, believe it or not, they are leaving because taxes are too high and because some of them have lots of money outside of our country and instead of bringing it back and putting the money to work because they can't work out a deal and everybody agrees it should be brought back, instead of that, they are leaving our country to get their money because they can't bring their money back into our country because of bureaucratic red tape, because they can't get together. Because we have a president that can't sit them around a table and get them to approve something, and here's the thing, Republicans and Democrats agree that this should be done. $2.5 trillion.
I happen to think it's double that. It's probably $5 trillion that we can't bring into our country, Lester, and with a little leadership, you'd get it in here very quickly and it could be put to use on the inner cities and lots of other things, and it would be beautiful. But we have no leadership. And honestly, that starts with Secretary Clinton.

Did Mr Trump actually say anything in that diatribe?

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." Jimi Hendrix
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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Did Mr Trump actually say anything in that diatribe?

Sure he did, about as much as 90% of politicians do when they open their pie holes. He said what his constituents want to here. Blah blah blah TAXES Blah Blah Blah CLINTON SUCKS blah blah blah MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN Blah Blah blah...

This is what politics has been rendered to these days. Largely incoherent plans, discussion of policy and nothing more then key words and media snippets that have no meaning.

This is largely the reason I've not watched a debate in decades. It's nothing more then infomercials for the ill informed.

~Matt

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Re: Please tell me what this means! [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
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MJuric wrote:
Did Mr Trump actually say anything in that diatribe?

Sure he did, about as much as 90% of politicians do when they open their pie holes. He said what his constituents want to here. Blah blah blah TAXES Blah Blah Blah CLINTON SUCKS blah blah blah MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN Blah Blah blah...

This is what politics has been rendered to these days. Largely incoherent plans, discussion of policy and nothing more then key words and media snippets that have no meaning.

This is largely the reason I've not watched a debate in decades. It's nothing more then infomercials for the ill informed.

~Matt

Your bolded part makes more sense than what he said. Most of the night I tried to watch with an open mind, to really try and see what people see in him, but the ramblings of nothingness made me wanna throw things at the TV.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." Jimi Hendrix
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.








"People think it must be fun to be a super genius, but they don't realize how hard it is to put up with all the idiots in the world."
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.

Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace." Jimi Hendrix
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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Nova wrote:
vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.


Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.

Because he bloviates or as people would say where I come from, he talks out of his ass.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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He wanted to say this, but, well, he's Trump and he's incapable of saying it let alone understanding the complexities. It's pretty much Paul Ryan's tax proposal. Interestingly, something like 99.5% of those tax cuts would benefit the top 1% of wage earners. In short, he wanted to say that he'll cut taxes for the wealthy and the average American will remain status quo except for continued growth in the wage gap. If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....



Nova wrote:
vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.


Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [MidwestRoadie] [ In reply to ]
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I agree with you that cuts for the 1% will likely just increase the wage gap further. But I ask, under Obama (and Clinton has stated she would continue his policies) the 1% have gotten richer and the wage gap is at record levels. So "what difference does it make". Under Trump the middle class will likely get hammered, under Clinton the middle class will get hammered. Anyone who votes for either of these two buffoons are voting for the destruction of the middle class. The problem? There is no one else to vote for. Bravo, American politics at its finest.

MidwestRoadie wrote:
He wanted to say this, but, well, he's Trump and he's incapable of saying it let alone understanding the complexities. It's pretty much Paul Ryan's tax proposal. Interestingly, something like 99.5% of those tax cuts would benefit the top 1% of wage earners. In short, he wanted to say that he'll cut taxes for the wealthy and the average American will remain status quo except for continued growth in the wage gap. If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....



Nova wrote:
vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.


Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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Most of the night I tried to watch with an open mind, to really try and see what people see in him, but the ramblings of nothingness made me wanna throw things at the TV.

It works like this. If the words between the Blah, Blah, Blah is something you agree with then suddenly you're hearing something that makes sense. IF not it doesn't. For some people Blah, Blah, Blah 15$ MINIMUM WAGE Blah, Blah, Blah, HIGHER TAXES ON RICH PEOPLE, Blah, Blah, Blah HEALTH CARE FOR THE POOR...ends up coming across as an eloquent speech because it's filled with words that make their neuro pathways tingle. In a good portion of all of these debates and tirades there is nothing of substance actually said other then snippets, sound bites and "Feel good" words.

Again, this is why I don't watch the debates because both sides do this. Again, it's like watching an informercial...again, generally 30-60's seconds of stuff that really doesn't mean anything.

~Matt

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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Nova] [ In reply to ]
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Nova wrote:
vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.


Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.

it's understandable but incoherent because lowering tax rates in the future won't bring prior earned money back.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [MidwestRoadie] [ In reply to ]
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If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....

this kid is 27 and raised $75MM to start his own hedge fund. http://www.businessinsider.com/...al-hedge-fund-2016-9
i don't think bill gates started with any money.
or jobs. steve that is.
or buffet.

ΜΟΛΩΝ-ΛΑΒΕ
we're doomed
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [jwbeuk] [ In reply to ]
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I don't disagree that the middle class gets screwed either way. Clinton is absolutely in bed with Wall St interests and will, at best, keep things status quo with the deeply divided economic situation we're in. Trump would certainly pursue policy that would divide it even further. This election feels akin to standing at the deli counter and being asked which color of shit you'd like to have mandatorily spread on your sandwich.

We really need to become a nation courageous enough to look past the fringe arguments of policy that are not going to change anytime soon anyway (I'm looking at you, abortion argument) and come together on the things that impact the vast majority of us in the same way. That means being courageous enough as a nation to forego the two party system and be a people who vote on conscience. That's utopian and how we get there seems to be beyond anyone's grasp.



jwbeuk wrote:
I agree with you that cuts for the 1% will likely just increase the wage gap further. But I ask, under Obama (and Clinton has stated she would continue his policies) the 1% have gotten richer and the wage gap is at record levels. So "what difference does it make". Under Trump the middle class will likely get hammered, under Clinton the middle class will get hammered. Anyone who votes for either of these two buffoons are voting for the destruction of the middle class. The problem? There is no one else to vote for. Bravo, American politics at its finest.

MidwestRoadie wrote:
He wanted to say this, but, well, he's Trump and he's incapable of saying it let alone understanding the complexities. It's pretty much Paul Ryan's tax proposal. Interestingly, something like 99.5% of those tax cuts would benefit the top 1% of wage earners. In short, he wanted to say that he'll cut taxes for the wealthy and the average American will remain status quo except for continued growth in the wage gap. If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....



Nova wrote:
vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.


Why didn't he just say it like you did? That I understand.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Madduck] [ In reply to ]
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You're correct. There are some who have been truly self made. Add Zuckerberg to the list. Add Jack Dorsey. Add many of the Silicon Valley moguls. Add Mark Cuban.

These are the people to be held up and celebrated. These are the people who wouldn't just succeed in the American system. They'd succeed damn near anywhere because they're visionary leaders.

It's interesting that of those Zuckerberg, Cuban, and Buffet have all been outspoken advocates for a more balanced tax policy and wage policies. They recognize that the system works incredibly well for some with big ideas some of the time but is amazingly unbalanced for normal, everyday Americans who aren't entrepreneurs, and that's the vast majority of the country.



Madduck wrote:
Quote:
If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....


this kid is 27 and raised $75MM to start his own hedge fund. http://www.businessinsider.com/...al-hedge-fund-2016-9
i don't think bill gates started with any money.
or jobs. steve that is.
or buffet.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Madduck] [ In reply to ]
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Madduck wrote:
Quote:
If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....


this kid is 27 and raised $75MM to start his own hedge fund. http://www.businessinsider.com/...al-hedge-fund-2016-9
i don't think bill gates started with any money.
or jobs. steve that is.
or buffet.


I think your point is valid but only 2 of your 3 are completely accurate. IIRC, Gates father is a wealthy attorney and he grew up in private schools and with affluence and his father's connections to start Microsoft. Not to the same level as Trump, but also no where near the lower level of Jobs or Buffet.

Having a windfall to start is not the same as having no net. I recall Martin Short, the actor, state when asked about his early years and how hard it must have been. He stated that it wasn't hard at all because his father had left him a substantial amount in trust so he never worried about rent and food and taking care of his family, in the event acting didn't work out.
Last edited by: Harbinger: Sep 27, 16 8:41
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [Harbinger] [ In reply to ]
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Harbinger wrote:
Madduck wrote:
Quote:
If you want to be one of those 1% you can also be a self made man like Trump; that is if self made means receiving a $1MM loan to start out and a $100MM+ inheritance. America would be great again if only we could all be so self made....


this kid is 27 and raised $75MM to start his own hedge fund. http://www.businessinsider.com/...al-hedge-fund-2016-9
i don't think bill gates started with any money.
or jobs. steve that is.
or buffet.


I think your point is valid but only 2 of your 3 are completely accurate. IIRC, Gates father is a wealthy attorney and he grew up in private schools and with affluence and his father's connections to start Microsoft. Not to the same level as Trump, but also no where near the lower level of Jobs or Buffet.

At least according to Gladwell's book Outliers, he went to one of the best private schools in Seattle, had access to a computer for programming when very people in the country let alone high school kids did, rich parents who paid for programming time, etc. Not saying he's not "self-made" whatever that means, but born into almost any other family in the US no one would likely have ever heard of Bill Gates.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [vitus979] [ In reply to ]
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vitus979 wrote:
He's saying he's going to cut taxes, which will lcause the rich and businesses to bring back money they currently have overseas to avoid taxes, and that will lead to increased investment and job creation here.

you left out. and that money could be used for inner cities. lol
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [schroeder] [ In reply to ]
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you left out. and that money could be used for inner cities.

Yeah, money in the country can't be used for inner cities, but repatriated money that returns after the taxes are lowered will. Not a bad way to try and increase popularity in the poor inner cities.

The real issue is how you stop a Corporation from leaving. They typically do it using a corporate inversion. An American company buys a company in Ireland for example, and the merged company can then choose their domicile. With the significantly lower corporate tax rates in Ireland, it's a no brainer. The question is how to revamp the Tax Code to such an extent that it will discourage that from happening.

Just saying you will meet around the table and negotiate isn't the answer, you have to change the tax code and I haven't heard many specifics about that. It's actually an important issue and I wish they would spend more time on it.

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Re: Please tell me what this means! [ThisIsIt] [ In reply to ]
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Not saying he's not "self-made" whatever that means, but born into almost any other family in the US no one would likely have ever heard of Bill Gates.

This could be said of anyone. There's no such thing as being pre-ordained to some level of greatness. You can look at nearly any person that has had any level of success and more so to anyone with a great level of success and find a few "Bits of luck" that without those bits they would never had reached such levels.

That being said it is also true that if you took all the money in the world, put it in a big pot and divided it up evenly to everyone that within a relatively short time frame the group that had most of the money would be filled with many of the people that currently have it. Maybe Gates is not at the top of the list, but he's probably making a decent buck and certainly not on public assistance.

~Matt
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
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MJuric wrote:
Maybe Gates is not at the top of the list, but he's probably making a decent buck and certainly not on public assistance.

~Matt

Well that's not a very high bar :) I would think that that describes the vast majority of people who were born into decent homes.
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Re: Please tell me what this means! [ThisIsIt] [ In reply to ]
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Well that's not a very high bar :) I would think that that describes the vast majority of people who were born into decent homes.

No,not exactly what I'm saying. I'm saying he's a top 5% definitely and probably top 1% anyway. That only describes 1% or 5% of the people born...I suppose you could make the argument that 99 to 95% of the population wasn't born in "Decent homes" though.

There are few people that have the drive, ability and personality to make it to those levels. Most people don't. Put gates in a less upper class home he still has the physical characteristics of being driven etc.

It's always been my opinion that drive, ability, intelligence etc will get you into the top 25% in most cases. It takes all that in spades and or a bit of luck...or inheritance, to get into the top 1%.

~Matt





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