So BBS was 4 mins out so not bad

I went 5--08 on 229 watts at placid

I was ahead at halfway but then the wind picked up

Cheers

Deflecting this thread a bit, but question related to BBS courses - is there any way to see the overall elevation gain for a course that has been uploaded? For instance, I am trying to model my IM Coeur d'Alene ride in 3 weeks, but there are no verified courses, so I have to pick the one that best represents the true course. However, if I can't see the elevation gain, it's impossible to know which one is the most accurate just by looking at the elevation chart.

I have picked a few of the courses that are on there, and my time varies widely (up to 20 minutes between courses), so it's not clear which one I should be using.

If not available this would be a nice feature to implement.

Thanks

---

Strava

Yes for sure we just added a new smoothing feature (behind the scenes) that should help a lot with courses with more elevation change. The corrected elevation often does not pick up river crossings well so now it should help reduce any odd gradient segments. We also added grade to the segment list on the race plan. So if you see some grades out of whack in the list that course probably has some issues.

That being said we will add that to the list to get out soon with elevation gain and loss on the course. Sometimes we see listed in the IM site is a bit understated as well though so best to check versus a previous year file. Elevation data unless it's a really clear data with a Baro based sensor can be tricky:

Should be able to add that relatively quickly but in the mean time I'll see about getting a verified course up.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

Thanks! That would be very helpful (both the verified course and the elevation data)

I have tried downloading a few routes from Map my GPS and Strava and uploading them to BBS.. most files say around 5,700 ft which is less than the IM website has (~7,000 ft) and confirmed by a few threads on here. BBS has me going about 15 minutes faster than I would expect to be on a course with a gain like that (and compared to results for the past few years)

---

Strava

Yeah that sounds like a ton of elevation change for that course but I'll look into it for sure.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

For me best bike split was quite high for IMMT. I went 6:01 (Oh One!!!!!) on 147 watts at ~ 175 lbs. Average position, previous generation P2, Hed Jet 6/ Wheel cover, Aero Top/Shorts, GP4000S/ Latex.

BBS predicted either 6:13 at 152 watts or 6:01 at 162 Watts. I wouldn't blame them though, I always feel like I am bizarrely aero efficient despite a not very aggressive position. On any kind of casual group ride when we come to a slight downgrade I have to sit up and hit the brakes while everyone else is still aero and pedaling.

Wow that is quite fast for sure. I would definitely tweak your drag numbers and test with other races to see how it compares. We have a few things in the work that should help refine inputs a bit better across the board.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

With IM 70.3 WC in Mooloolaba looming I was looking at the BBS course and it's showing elevation change of 3,515 ft while the Ironman Course map that is online references 2205 ft. Any ideas which is more accurate?

Ryan, another question about the Mooloolaba race. I can't get BBS to output weather for the course. Have you run across this with anyone else? Thanks.

The effective elevation that you will actually notice will probably be somewhere between. The way I'm calculating it there tends to overstate a bit(especially if the sat data fluctuates back and forth over flat sections a bit when in reality this change on the course it wouldn't be noticeable).

Toying with just calculating effective elevation change or elevation difference that would cause a rider to actually change strategy. We didn't have any good barometer data for the course so we had to use Satelite data. IM used to use mapmyride elevation which is overly smoothed. I'll run the other elevation calc and see what it gives me and post.

On the weather question for some reason in some places in Australia we can only get a week or two of forecasted data. Looking into that with our weather service.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

I find BBS very useful on flat or rolling/non-technical bike course especially because I am really crap on technical downhills.

You really have to consider that if you go on a non-flat ironman course you lose a lot of time on downhills if you don't push the expected wattage. it can be a straight downhill (deviation from the model would be small) or technical winding downhills where you push 0 watts and, moreover, you keep braking too much probably.

but then, if the bike course is flat, probably you don't need BBS much, don't you? prediction is quite simple to make, knowing your average wattage and your wattage vs speed from training rides.

i think they should add some sort of variable to consider the technical skills of the raider. i know it would be very difficult to make

Just a quick thanks for how quickly you added a course for me to Best Bike Split. I asked for the Moriarty TT course a couple of evenings ago, and you had it posted the next day for me. Just wanted to acknowledge the great service.

We just added a max descent speed that might be worth checking out. I am in the middle of refining our technical course breakdown which should help with this quite a bit as well. Also flat courses with big wind will have some decisions to make.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

Whoops max descent speed is under advanced settings.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian

yes I know that but how can you make use of it?
I mean, imagine you have Ironman Nice -France- to predict. There you can have fast straight descent where you can hit high speed and then super technical descents.
Now, if I have to look at max descent speed, I should use the max speed I touch on the technical curves, losing A LOT on the straight fast descents. If I use the max speed in the fast straight descent, I will gain A LOT on the tech curves.

In my head I have the idea of breaking down the course in multiple sections, up to the user. then combine the parameters on each section. you would nail down the prediction

Right the max descent was more for beginners who might get a bit nervous on most downhills but it can start to help a bit. We are working on better automated segmentation of descents to roll out over the next couple of weeks. We have toyed with user based course breakdown but then would want that to only be privately on a user account as 10 different people might break a course up 10 different ways. Similarly we have some cornering speeds from various gradients and degree of turns built into the model (based on rider type) but do not yet expose these settings. I think the new enhanced auto course segmentation will take care of a majority of issues on technical courses in terms of time difference. For strategy it really won't be too much different as you typically be off the gas in these situations, but it will probably have an impact with higher NP due to breaking and accelerating back up to speed. Really trying to get this out soon and initial tests are looking promising.

---

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Founder: BestBikeSplit
Amazonian