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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [P90Puma] [ In reply to ]
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My LBS is having a release party on October 4, which I think means they will actually have one on hand...late to the party but people were talking about availability earlier
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [kevpog] [ In reply to ]
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https://www.instagram.com/p/BKswDA0hPTg/?taken-by=cervelocycles&hl=en


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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [SBRcoffee] [ In reply to ]
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they are gonna be banking on selling a shit ton of them, not just a handful to early adopters, etc.. .02.....


Maybe, maybe not.

The talk at Interbike about the triathlon business, and specifically the bike sales in the triathlon business ranged from - "sales are flat", to "they have gone off a cliff"

That's not the best market to be operating in for anyone.

There will be a lot of talk again about the Kona Bike Count as there always is. In speaking with an industry insider yesterday at Interbike, the most interesting and telling metric from the Kona Bike Count is, within each bike brand - how many of those bikes/models are new and how many are multiple years old?


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
Last edited by: Fleck: Sep 23, 16 11:49
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Fleck wrote:
they are gonna be banking on selling a shit ton of them, not just a handful to early adopters, etc.. .02.....


Maybe, maybe not.

The talk at Interbike about the triathlon business, and specifically the bike sales in the triathlon business ranged from - "sales are flat", to "they have gone off a cliff"

That's not the best market to be operating in for anyone.

There will be a lot of talk again about the Kona Bike Count as there always is. In speaking with an industry insider yesterday at Interbike, the most interesting and telling metric from the Kona Bike Count is, within each bike brand - how many of those bikes/models new and how many are multiple years old?

But the Kona bike count may not represent the fattest part of the revenue bell curve. Perhaps the KQ guys and girls influence their 100's of less fast peers, maybe they don't. Maybe look at overall revenue divided by Kona bike count by brand (would be hard to generate the numerator). Someone like Dimond would have a disproportionate number of bikes on the pier relative to their revenue, but that does not mean that their Kona bike count has less impact on their revenue, on the other hand, it might have a big impact on their revenue. Someone like Trek who sells a lot of bikes to general consumers may have a lot of sales not influenced by Kona bike count.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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But the Kona bike count may not represent the fattest part of the revenue bell curve. Perhaps the KQ guys and girls influence their 100's of less fast peers, maybe they don't.


Dev,

Indeed. The Kona Bike count does get a lot of interest/hype - but it's hard to really quantify as, to what it really represents. For the "winners", The #1 spot (Cervelo) and the faster year-over-year gainers, obviously there is a story to tell and some marketing value in that. As you know, in business, momentum is a powerful and potent force - consumers want to be part of that momentum - that's the real value in the Kona Bike Count in my estimation.


Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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By the way, general reply to this thread, but if this new Cervelo Beam bike is disc brake model only, that pretty well eliminates it for me and I am on Cervelo now.

The entire disc brakes on tri bikes is a solution looking for a problem to solve. A rim brake is the "largest" possible disk to start off!!!! The only benefit I see of disc brakes on a tri bike is marginal aero gains, but it's like all the stupid resources that Microsoft word uses up on a computer. MSword is not better than back in 1996, yet we have to upgrade constantly for the latest windows crap and then everything bogs down so you have to give Intel more money for a faster CPU and Samsung more money for more memory. The disc brake gig on road bikes is like a forced upgrade cycle for a stagnating industry with almost no real gain for consumers other than having to put everything they on on eBAY. It's worse than going from 10 speed to 11 speed which was the first time since 1990 8 speed that the axle width had to change.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I have heard a few people suggest that the push could fuelled by the fact that it removes some of the issues of running carbon clinchers. I wouldn't think this is much of an issue for most Tri's more the sportive market. Also for of an issue for the wheel companies.

It does make the zipp disc - disc make more sense.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [boing] [ In reply to ]
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boing wrote:
I have heard a few people suggest that the push could fuelled by the fact that it removes some of the issues of running carbon clinchers. I wouldn't think this is much of an issue for most Tri's more the sportive market. Also for of an issue for the wheel companies.

It does make the zipp disc - disc make more sense.

Also will be interesting to see how many disc equipped wheels neutral support at major races carries. Not the most important criteria and it's rare you need a full wheel change. I probably won't go near disk equipped TT bikes for 3-5 years just like I waited for the early adopter market to shake out on electronic shifting. As a consumer, I don't like to be in the early adopter group, but as a technology/innovator guy I have to convince early adopters to move to our latest and greatest, so I'm probably the hardest customer to win over in the vein. I'll go with the the fatter part of the market. By then the overall ecosystem around the new technology has shaken out.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [boing] [ In reply to ]
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boing wrote:
I have heard a few people suggest that the push could fuelled by the fact that it removes some of the issues of running carbon clinchers. I wouldn't think this is much of an issue for most Tri's more the sportive market. Also for of an issue for the wheel companies.

It does make the zipp disc - disc make more sense.

What issues do you speak of?

blog
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [Fleck] [ In reply to ]
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Fleck wrote:
they are gonna be banking on selling a shit ton of them, not just a handful to early adopters, etc.. .02.....


Maybe, maybe not.

The talk at Interbike about the triathlon business, and specifically the bike sales in the triathlon business ranged from - "sales are flat", to "they have gone off a cliff"

That's not the best market to be operating in for anyone.

There will be a lot of talk again about the Kona Bike Count as there always is. In speaking with an industry insider yesterday at Interbike, the most interesting and telling metric from the Kona Bike Count is, within each bike brand - how many of those bikes/models are new and how many are multiple years old?

That is probably why there are so many completely new designs that look very different from anything currently on the market (I am called the Cervelo "new" because of the funky front wheel fairing). These bikes, coupled with discs and 1x11 are a major change from all the classic designs that still dominate the market (i.e., P3 (any generation), Shiv and Trinity to name what I consider classics that defined the industry). I am guessing these companies are betting on the departure from the norm being the best way to invigorate sales. I can't wait to find out if they are actually any faster.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
boing wrote:
I have heard a few people suggest that the push could fuelled by the fact that it removes some of the issues of running carbon clinchers. I wouldn't think this is much of an issue for most Tri's more the sportive market. Also for of an issue for the wheel companies.

It does make the zipp disc - disc make more sense.


What issues do you speak of?

It's generally accepted that carbon clinchers are a market driven creation. There is a good reason that Shimano and Hed do not make a full carbon clincher and there is only one carbon clincher that I'm aware of that is approved for use with latex tubes.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [TheFisher] [ In reply to ]
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TheFisher wrote:
It's generally accepted that carbon clinchers are a market driven creation. There is a good reason that Shimano and Hed do not make a full carbon clincher and there is only one carbon clincher that I'm aware of that is approved for use with latex tubes.

Approved by whom?
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
TheFisher wrote:
It's generally accepted that carbon clinchers are a market driven creation. There is a good reason that Shimano and Hed do not make a full carbon clincher and there is only one carbon clincher that I'm aware of that is approved for use with latex tubes.


Approved by whom?


By the manufacturer. If you read the literature that comes with wheels most will state somewhere that they don't recommend using latex tubes with their carbon clinchers. As far as I know Profile Designs are the only ones who have said that it's fine to use latex tube with their wheels.

Edit: The main issue with full carbon clinchers isn't that the resins can't handle the heat it's that the rim can generate more heat than the tyres and tubes can take. That's the main reason behind why Shimano and Hed do not make full carbon clinchers.
Last edited by: TheFisher: Sep 24, 16 21:45
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [TheFisher] [ In reply to ]
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TheFisher wrote:
By the manufacturer. I

A manufacturer approving it's own product?

I hereby approve Trail's johnson for use by va-jay-jay.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Deliberately obtuse.

1/10
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [TheFisher] [ In reply to ]
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I use latex tubes in my Zipp 808 and Super 9 with no issues.

Make Inside Out Sports your next online tri shop! http://www.insideoutsports.com/
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [TheFisher] [ In reply to ]
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I know Enve does not approve using latex tubes. I remember reading it on their website.

Does zipp officially say the same thing? I've never seen any such statement from zipp. Can you point me to where zipp says this?

blog
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [BryanD] [ In reply to ]
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BryanD wrote:
I use latex tubes in my Zipp 808 and Super 9 with no issues.

Same here. I'm not sure if it's in Zipps or any company's interest to say they approve it from a liability standpoint.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [TheFisher] [ In reply to ]
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TheFisher wrote:
trail wrote:
TheFisher wrote:
It's generally accepted that carbon clinchers are a market driven creation. There is a good reason that Shimano and Hed do not make a full carbon clincher and there is only one carbon clincher that I'm aware of that is approved for use with latex tubes.


Approved by whom?


By the manufacturer. If you read the literature that comes with wheels most will state somewhere that they don't recommend using latex tubes with their carbon clinchers. As far as I know Profile Designs are the only ones who have said that it's fine to use latex tube with their wheels.

Edit: The main issue with full carbon clinchers isn't that the resins can't handle the heat it's that the rim can generate more heat than the tyres and tubes can take. That's the main reason behind why Shimano and Hed do not make full carbon clinchers.

My 2 cents....carbon is a great material used in cases for the wrong job....clincher rims, and drop bars/base bars are places on my bike I prefer not to have carbon. Having said that, it's pretty hard to generate enough heat on straight line triathlon riding with a few minor turns here and there. I've used my Bonetrager Aeolus carbon rims descending the Gavia pass in Italy that has plenty of technical stuff coming down from almost 9000 ft down to 4000 ft and no problems, but I only weigh 138 lbs and try to be light on the braking and use air resistance (sit up and catch a lot of air) as much as possible to slow myself down and give rims a chance to cool.

On that note does anyone know if Zipp still makes the 1080 with the Al rim?
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
I know Enve does not approve using latex tubes. I remember reading it on their website.

Does zipp officially say the same thing? I've never seen any such statement from zipp. Can you point me to where zipp says this?

Enve approves the use of latex tubes with their new textured brake track. I called them 2 weeks ago asking about it.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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Mainly heat warping, heat related tyre blowouts etc. As I said not really an issue for most tri's. More of a mountain sportive issue.

This is less of an issue with tubs as the breaking surface does have the same onward pressure among other factors.
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Re: Cervelo P6......140.6 days was Feb 27th. [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
On that note does anyone know if Zipp still makes the 1080 with the Al rim?


Sadly, nope.

But if you need one, I have a near new 808/1080 zipp wheelset (with the alloy rims) with a new 11speed ultegra cassette for sale ...
;^)

Advanced Aero TopTube Storage for Road, Gravel, & Tri...ZeroSlip & Direct-mount, made in the USA.
DarkSpeedWorks.com.....Reviews.....Insta.....Facebook

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Last edited by: DarkSpeedWorks: Sep 26, 16 7:29
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