Login required to started new threads

Login required to post replies

Prev Next
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Its the media's job to tell the story. A picture of a starving kid beamed across the world opens hearts and wallets. The picture can do more good than a thousand sandwiches.

But hey, if we're blaming Bill Clinton and the French we might as well lump the media in too.

----------------------------------------------------------
"A society is defined not only by what it creates, but by what it refuses to destroy."
John Sawhill
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
The media is flying around in helicopters that could easily be used in the relief effort!! They are wasting valuable fuel when fuel is in short supply. Think of the amount of help they could provide in addition to the hindrance they're being.
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [Brian286] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeah take away their helicopters....don't want people finding out just how big of a clusterfuck this relief effort is.

----------------------------------------------------------
"A society is defined not only by what it creates, but by what it refuses to destroy."
John Sawhill
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ok wait a minute so you're admiting that letting a few die now to save hundreds later is better than rescuing the one?

Hmmm could it be that the efforts going on to rescue hundreds of thousands is being done in a way that a few may die now but many more will be saved in the long run? No can't be.

However I completely disagree about the media. They are doing this to make money. They can deliver food and get a story if they wanted to. They can pick up teh seriously ill and transport them AND get a story. But they won't because they might miss "The story" and lose money.

"But hey, if we're blaming Bill Clinton and the French we might as well lump the media in too."

I have no idea were this came from and I certainly haven't mentioned BC, the media yes, BC is completely off my radar.

As far as...

""My vote, for my tax dollars – let them die.""

I've already stated several times that is not my stance.

~Matt
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Quote:
Its the media's job to tell the story. A picture of a starving kid beamed across the world opens hearts and wallets. The picture can do more good than a thousand sandwiches.


Not for that kid it doesn't.

BTW, the relief for the people at the Convention Center will come by water, not air, IMO. The Convention Center is next to the cruise ship dock, so as soon as they can get the river channel navigable there will be barges to take supplies in and people out. I don't know anything about the river channel's condition right now, but I assume if it were navigable this would have already been done. I get hacked off imagining how easy it would be but I really don't know enough about the situation to criticize.
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
In Reply To:
Yeah take away their helicopters....don't want people finding out just how big of a clusterfuck this relief effort is.
So, we are trying to fix a disaster...all we see on TV is bad news....you know what is going to happen. In a couple weeks when things are turning back to normal and the streets are dry...people will then be talking about how well things were run...happens that way every time

----------------------------------------------------------

What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I'm saying the media's job is to report the story not organize the relief effort.

When Michael Buerk of the BBC recorded the first pictures of the famine in Ethiopia in the early 80s, his news report shocked the world into action and hundreds of thousands of lives were saved. If he's put the camera down and started feeding people he might have save 1 or 2 people.

Remember if it wasn't for the media reporting the story FEMA would still be looking for the 30,000 missing people who are in the Convention Center.

----------------------------------------------------------
"A society is defined not only by what it creates, but by what it refuses to destroy."
John Sawhill
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [Brian286] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Let's look at it this way: Babies are dying of dehydration on American soil. Everyone knows about it and can see what is happening on TV.

Who among us thought that could happen?


__________________________________________________
What a drag it is getting old. -- Stones
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [dire wolf] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I did think that it "could happen". There is so much potential for disasters of this size and worse, all out of anyones control. Does not make it right...but, it is not impossible. Good thing there is no Nuke power plants there....

----------------------------------------------------------

What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
First thanks for ingnoring the part about the actual relief effort....

"I'm saying the media's job is to report the story not organize the relief effort"

Not asking them to organize it, just asking them to help.

"shocked the world into action and hundreds of thousands of lives were saved."

If teh world doesn't know what the situation is by now they never will. The story has been broken, everyone knows. Time to put the cameras down and help out.

~Matt
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MJuric] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Matt, it is important to have 24 hour live coverage so that people all over the country can think that they have an idea what is going on their - though they only see the "money shot" images and then pass judgement of a situation that they can not even begin to understand the logistics of...and blame George Bush for all of it.

----------------------------------------------------------

What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [klehner] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Ken ... I should have been more specific ... they seem well-prepared for a Cat 3 (or lesser) hurricane.

I'm guessing once they found out it was a 4/5 and it would be a direct hit ... they ordered the mandatory evacuation.

So, in my previous comment I suggested they were ready for a hurricane, they just weren't ready for a HURRICANE.

I don't know what kind of preparation you can have when your roads and bridges, power, and communication are out of commission. Paul Revere on a hydroplane?

=======================
-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [MattinSF] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
I read an article this morning that quoted some people who lived there as being very thankful for the coverage because it is the only info they have about what is happening. If you are in some other state then you need those people to give you some (any) information about your home town. The people in the article just wanted more specific info about their street or neighborhood but who wouldn't. I see how you could say they should be using them for relief but they are providing a positive service to those who are displaced. It may also deter people from going back to soon
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [TripleThreat] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
In Reply To:
Ken ... I should have been more specific ... they seem well-prepared for a Cat 3 (or lesser) hurricane.

I'm guessing once they found out it was a 4/5 and it would be a direct hit ... they ordered the mandatory evacuation.

So, in my previous comment I suggested they were ready for a hurricane, they just weren't ready for a HURRICANE.

I don't know what kind of preparation you can have when your roads and bridges, power, and communication are out of commission. Paul Revere on a hydroplane?


I'm willing to bet "cash dollars" (to use GWB's words) that the Netherlands has a plan to rescue trapped citizens even if the entire country is under water. If the powers-that-be in this country didn't have a plan for breached levees, then there's a bunch of incompetence in the chain of command (like, newsflash).

I'm also wondering how the Dept. of Homeland Security would've handled a terrorist attack that blew up these self-same levees. Any differently? Or do you think that they, too, wouldn't have been able to handle such a worst case scenario? I mean, isn't disaster planning on this scale a critical part of their job description?

----------------------------------
"Go yell at an M&M"
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [kittycat] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
And Nero fiddles while Rome burns...
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [klehner] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
In Reply To:
In Reply To:
I'm willing to bet "cash dollars" (to use GWB's words) that the Netherlands has a plan to rescue trapped citizens even if the entire country is under water. If the powers-that-be in this country didn't have a plan for breached levees, then there's a bunch of incompetence in the chain of command (like, newsflash).
Yeh i thought the same thing so I looked up the leadership of the State and City and this is what I found http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...;;page=unread#unread

----------------------------------------------------------
I'm just a 10 cent rider on a $2,500.00 Bike

Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [kittycat] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Where are the choppers? In the last four/five days, the Coast Guard (yes, a military organization) has rescued over 4,000 stranded people and brought them to safety, by helicopter. Few of you, I wager, understand the magnitude of that. Go ahead, sit back and complain.

Disclaimer: I am an active member of the U.S. Coast Guard.

Todd
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [CGTRIGUY] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Heh, heh. You guys are in DHS now, I think. But don't you still fall under the DOT? (my innocent poke at my seafaring brethren ;-) Regardless, you're right. I've SPIE-rigged and fast-roped into areas under fire and gotten out of areas under fire, and I don't blame any rotorhead if they naturally hesitate a little at the thought of taking a 30.06 bullet in the ass from some yay-hoo on a rooftop who's got a beef with the government in general.

Bring in the rescue helos with some gunships and watch how fast those idiot shooters'll scatter. I heard there's now a shoot-to-kill authorization in situations such as the above. Glad to see it.

Tony

disclaimer: Retired Navy guy
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [big kahuna] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yes, we're now in DHS, and no longer DOT. Doesn't matter, though, we'll always rescue people no matter who our boss is and where our money comes from. And we don't stand back and wait for orders. The local CG evacuated last week and reorganized in pre-positioning safe areas, and thus were able to respond immediately and effectively. Semper Paratus.

Use of Force? That's classified.
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [CGTRIGUY] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Where are the choppers? In the last four/five days, the Coast Guard (yes, a military organization) has rescued over 4,000 stranded people and brought them to safety, by helicopter. Few of you, I wager, understand the magnitude of that. Go ahead, sit back and complain.

Disclaimer: I am an active member of the U.S. Coast Guard.

Todd


Update: 5,500 by helo, 1,600 by boat.
Quote Reply
Re: absolute incompetency--where are the choppers? [CGTRIGUY] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Thanks, we can always count on the Coast Guard. I've never heard anyone complain about what you guys do or how you do it. Be safe
Quote Reply
Re: Peoples incompetency-- choppers are there ? [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
 
We have some of our guys there from southern Ca. There are thousands of jobs going on at once. 4000 roof top rescues by coast guard aircraft. One of our guys said they grounded all the civilian machines, due some being shot at.

Money makes it fly, water – power – phone - photos, damage surveys, with that some machine get commandeered and flew people on a don’t ask flight. Where cash can get you in and out of any street in New Orleans in a chopper right now.

Most of the larger machines burn 1 – 3 gals a minute, at hover power. Depending on the fuel load they may have only a 200-mile, one-way range. An 8 -10-hour day is about all you can stand. You can see how fuel and crew problems could stop you cold.

I know they had tons of oil company machines in Layette L.a. , but they where out in the storm as well .

Most of the problems are caused by peoples slow decision making.
Quote Reply

Prev Next