as a non american I have no idea what this means, I figure that it is baseball code of some sort.......

can someone please explain,

thanks in advance



regards Avago

TT - No doubt in my mind. Pujols for NL MVP.

What about a pitcher - Chris Carpenter? If he keeps up his current pace, he will obviously win the Cy Young...but what about a dual Cy Young/MVP??? Any chance?

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Good athletes train when they want to, great athletes train when they don't......

I'm torn. WHen I think of MVP I don't look at just the record of the team or the stats, I look at the impact the player has on the team.

Without Lee the Cubs would be sunk, he held them together for the first 2/3's of the season. He's tailed off (no more triple crown talk), but is still integral to the team.

Pujols is on a more talented team, but if you look at the injuries that the Cards have suffered, he's done almost the same thing as Lee, held the team together.

Ultimately though I think this will come down to whose team goes further in the playoffs, so the smart money is on Pujols.



How about Cy Young????

Carpenter is a lock for Cy Young.

And your post is spot on. Without Lee the Cubs would be sunk. But the Cubs will always find a reason to sink.

Pujols has certainly made the key hits at the key times, as well as made some brilliant base running decisions and fielding plays that don't always make the stats. (I know, Lee is pretty darn good at those things too). Living in St Louis and getting out to the stadium for about 5 games a month it is a treat to see Pujols make every at bat interesting and stretch the count out, often not hitting gold until he is sitting on a 3-2 count. That is smart hitting. It's rumored that nobody studies tape of the opposing pitcher pregame more than Albert.

But don't they vote for the MVP before the playoffs?

As for the Cy Young, Carpenter is the guy unless he suddenyl blows up which I don;t see hapenning. Just wish he would have matured like this when he played for my hometown team - the Jays. We always gave him a chance every year to showcase what we knew he had in him and he always sucked...imagine the rotation in Toronto if we had kept him...Halladay, Carpenter, Lilly, Chacin? With one of the best bullpens in baseball and a solid closer...man, we would be pretty good.

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Good athletes train when they want to, great athletes train when they don't......

Don't get me started on woulda-coulda-shouda. I was at the playoff game when Ankiel tossed 5 wild pitches. Ouch.

I hear ya. I have enough stories being Toronto of shoulda-coulda-woulda (Jeff Kent, Cesar Itzuris, etc). At least we have our back-to-back World Series wins in the early 90s. Something to be happy about.

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Good athletes train when they want to, great athletes train when they don't......

This is the age old argument .... Is it "Most Valuable Player" or "Most Outstanding Player". It seems to fluxuate depending on the media. It also depends on who they DO NOT want to win it ... how Albert Belle did not win the MVP when he had the 50HR 502B season, I'll never know. I believe it was *handed* to Mo Vaughn.

Anyway, this debate (MVP v. MOP) really heated in 1987. Dawson had a monstrous year for a horrible Cubs team, Ozzie Smith had his best offensive year for the NL Pennant winning Cardinals. Herzog said it best, "Without Dawson, the Cubs are still in the cellar. Without Ozzie, we don't even win our division."

This same interpretation allowed Barry larkin to win an MVP.

Unless Lee pulls off the triple crown, it's Pujols for me.

The Cubs are in 3rd place (and likely sliding). Without Lee, they would be in 3rd or 4th (Aramis Ramirez is also having a monster year).

The Cardinals are in first place, best record in baseball. Without Pujols, the Cradinals would likely (at least) be trailing the Astros. Just as Lee carried the Cubs when Prior and Wood went down, Pujols carried the Cardinals when Scott "Ouch" Rolen got injured.

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As for Carpenter. I have no way of proving this, but I believe that Chris is benefitting from a type of bond or mentorship with Matt Morris ... just like Morris benefitted from KIle's tutorship.

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The Ulimate year would be [1] Pujols MVP, [2] Carpenter CY, and [3] Cardinals in a 4-0 revenge sweep over the BoSox. Then I could tolerate the Bears and Blackhawks much more easily.

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I doubt any pitcher will likely win the MVP and CY again. I know Clemens did it in his 24-4 season, and I also think Guillermo "Willie" Hernandez did it as a reliever in the Tigers miraculous year of 84.

I don't see it happening again unless a pitcher nails 30 wins or something. I agree with most players, pitchers have their award, everyday players have their award.

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Nats/Cards next Friday, I'm psyched. I'm hoping the Cards take BP, but I'm guessing they won't on the first day of a series, I guess it depends on if they have a day game on Thursday, and with whom.

Either way, I'm going to see Pujols live!

I'm an MVP proponent, but that's probably obvious.



I really wish Clemens was getting better run support in Houston, I'd LOVE to see what his record would be given his ERA, etc. Plus, what he is doing at his age is amazing.

Is the Cy Young a pitching MVP or MOP? I think it is MOP, in which case, I think Clemens has a shot (especially if they win the wild card and he picks up another playoff win or two).



Will Larry Walker ever come back and be productive? I used to love him when he was with the Expos.

You are right about Clemens. His ERA is jaw droppingly good. But with an 11-4 record at the end of August I just don't see Cy Young happening.

Larry Walker has said IF the Cards win the Series in October he is for sure going to retire.

I used to love him when he was with the Expos.

You could say that about half the stars in the league. =)

Walker, Unit, Moises, Grissom, Grudz, Vidro, Vlad, Pedro, ...

The 94 strike killed the expos. That team was loaded.

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You notice that, very quietly, Ken Griffey, Jr. is now batting .295 (above his career average) with 29 home runs? I always liked him (I watched on TV the game where he and his father hit back-to-back home runs. Now that is a record that won't be broken :-).

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"Go yell at an M&M"

Ken Griffey, Jr. is now batting .295 (above his career average) with 29 home runs?

Wow! No, now wow at this numbers ... but "Wow!" ... he's not injured. =)

I always liked him

Me too ... until ... he kept getting injured ... which led me to believe that he may be one of those guys that does not work very hard during the season and/or off-season and passes by on natural ability alone. He doesn't seem to recover too well from injury either ... but damn, when he was young that kid did just about everything as well as it could be done.

It also did not look good for a disgruntled Griffey for Seattle to do better AFTER they traded him away (same with A-Rod).

I would like to see Griffey get a shot at the playoffs again (95 was AWESOME!), and get the stats to guarantee him HOF.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

Isn't 500 home runs a ticket to the HoF?

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"Go yell at an M&M"

Sorry. I haven't been paying much attention to the season (other than checking the standings in the paper). I catch some sports talk between friends (such as MVP stuff), but without ESPN, I don't really know who's doing what.

I looked up Griffey and saw he has 501 homers.

500 homers will get Griffey in ... but it likely would not get Canseco (462).

Good for Griffey. He went from "a lock to smash Aaron" (according to media) to being invisible for a few years.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --

501 going into 2005, so he's now at 530. With all his Gold Gloves, he's in.

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"Go yell at an M&M"

You're right. Man, I'm really making myself look like an ass here ... I guess old habits die hard. =)

I gotta keep up on my baseball events or stop talking about em.

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-- Every morning brings opportunity;
Each evening offers judgement. --