I would ask the people selling the Trek why if Carbon feels "dead" does Lance ride Trek carbon frames? I would think if that was a bad frame, then Trek would have him on something else. For the money you're looking at spending, try a few bikes. Also, try a titanium frame too.

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- Giving money and power to government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys.
P. J. O'Rourke

I have rode Alum. , Ti, Carbon, and Steel. They are all different and i like things about all of them . To be honest a well made bike rides well.
All of that said if I was going to buy a bike to train , race, commute it would be carbon. I like it the best for all around riding.
I can't believe the Trek people said that about carbon.

"Also, try a titanium frame too."

When I eventually purchase my rest of my life dream road bike it will most likely be titanium. Does amaze though, how carbon and titanium frame manufacturers often proclaim that their products ride "just like steel."

Steel is still real, and the ride standard by which others are judged.

These people selling Trek sound like lying scum that are more interested in selling you a Trek than your ownership experience. I wouldn't deal with them for any purchase. A good builder who knows what he's doing can make a fantastic bike out of either material. Ask Tyler if his R2.5 feels dead. Or Lance about his carbon Trek. (Or since neither of them frequent this forum, ask some of the carbon owners here) Alu doesn't have to be harsh, but it depends on the geometry and skill of the builder. It's possible to make a crappy, harsh riding yet noodly bike out of carbon, a plush Alu bike, and an uber-light steel bike. It's all about the builder.

I don't know much about Eclipse, but DO know that there's no way I'd deal with the guys who are trying to sell you a Trek. If it's a Trek you want, get it somewhere else. As for your decision, I'd probably go with the carbon Eclipse.

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All the frame materials have their benefits and their drawbacks. Since this is your first frame I would probably go with what fits and what is the best deal. In that vein, check out the Schwinn currently on sale at Supergo for $699. I know it's 105 instead of Ultegra, but the difference in quality is very small and it is a smokin' deal. Carbon fork, Mavic rims, etc. If I didn't already have 12 bikes in the garage I would be all over it.

Plus, 105 in black looks cooler than Ultegra in silver.

I'd say due to the fact that you're going to use this as a multi-purpose bike (i.e. you're going to live on it), I'd get something that was softer (i.e. not Alluminum). I have nothing against Al., my three bikes are all Al. - but I'd not be crazy about riding them over city streets and pot-holes all the time. If you are in a city/town that isn't NYC, or has similar Beirut-type roads, then scratch that point. Al. is the cheapest of the material, so if that is a factor, then consider it.

I've seen Carbon frames as stiff (or close to) as Alluminum. One thing you have to worry about Carbon Fiber is that as soon as you get a crack in them, you can't effectively repair them. They are pretty much toast. So that is something to consider.

If you're really looking to spend some good coin, I'd check out Titanium. Everybody druels over Ti. And rightfully so.

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Animal!!!

First go for fit, then test ride. I love my Klein. Bought though becouse it was almost exact for what I needed for Seat tube and top tube length. With that in mind I found it more comfortable than the Trek 5200(which is carbon)I have a 2003 Q-Pro Carbon(Frame alum seat stays carb). I beleive it all depends more on the builder than material.

" One thing you have to worry about Carbon Fiber is that as soon as you get a crack in them, you can't effectively repair them. "

Not so. I have fabricated carbon fibre, as well as even had stuff that needed to be repaired, and it can be repaired. Most carbon fibre frame manufacturers warranty their frames for a very long time, and most repair them, as well.

Carbon fibre is one weird material. It is scary in many ways, a bit dangerous to mess with while fabricating, cutting, drilling, and machining, but it is highly serviceable and quite a remarkable material. But unrepairable? Nah.

The people selling the Trek obviously don't know what they are talking about. How could they say what they had said when they sell Trek's own carbon bikes that Lance rides? Don't go back to them.

Bike material is irrelevant, but the builder's expertise in fabricating and material knowlege is key. Is carbon a different ride? Yes, but only after about 100 miles. Is aluminium harsh? You might feel beat up over a long distance, maybe.

The way I finally could tell the difference in material feel is after 100 miles in the saddle with it. Carbon is remarkable with the shapes that can be made with the relative light weight. Carbon can be engineered stiff as a cigar store indian, or noodly. The choice is up the the engineer.

Aluminium can be done right. Comfort is in the top tube and a bit in the chainstays (though not as much as you may think). I have not tried many Frankenbikes (as I affectionately call them), but one I did ride was very nice (a steel Fondriest with a frankenbike rear). But I hear that many people like the ride of Ves Mandaric's Scandium and carbon bike.

Get fit, then shop for the bike. Look into features, benefits, and warranties. Ask for others' testimonials, then get your bike.