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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"Secondly, W's time away from the WH is egregious. He took more vacation in the first 3 years (before the campaign even began) than any president had taken in 4 years. "

FOR THE LOVE OF FUCK THINK!!! Just because he is not at the White House does not mean he is not working. Technology and the nature of the job allow him to be anywhere and be just as on top of things than if he was at the White House. This is just a knee jerk illogical attack that is pointless and stupid at the same time.

customerjon @gmail.com is where information happens.
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Re: are you serious??? [Mr. Tibbs] [ In reply to ]
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I can & do think. Just because he can be working, it doesn't mean that he is, either. I am not saying that he can't work at "The Ranch." But If the W campaign wants to make time "at the office" an issue, they have to aknowledge that he is "out of the office" a lot, regardless of whether or not he can get things done.

"The Ranch" is not the "White House." Being president is as much about symbolism as anything else. I just don't think it is a good example to take that much vacation time. He called it vacation. Not me. I am not saying he didn't work. But I don't think people elected him to run the country from Crawford,TX.

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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I'm sure he can do just as well a job from Crawford, TX as Kerry will be doing from Paris. If he is elected.




==================================
but I can deal with the angels, cause it ain’t me they’re here to claim. it’s a good night for blowing ‘em off til some other day
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Re: are you serious??? [minny expat] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe. But if Kerry runs the country from Paris, he won't have my vote in 4 years either, if that should ever be a deciding factor. Bush taking vacation is not the main reason I am not voting for him. It isn't even in the top 10. It is just something to consider when people bash Kerry for being away from the Senate, which I also don't think is right.

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"How can you claim that Kerry got caught lying? Didn't we show that nothing about the FOP's statement proves he isn't the choice of a majority of policemen?"
- - Interesting. The president of the largest policeman's organization in America DEMANDS that Kerry stop promoting himself as the choice of cops, and you don't see a problem with Kerry trying to pose as such... I don't know what else to say.

"Bush & Kerry both lie, but I don't see that you prove it by posting a quote from the FOP."
- - See above.

"Secondly, W's time away from the WH is egregious. He took more vacation in the first 3 years (before the campaign even began) than any president had taken in 4 years."
- - Presidents don't take vacation (other than Clinton). Bush often prefers to work for Crawford as other presidents have worked from someplace away from DC.

"I am not supporting Kerry's decisions to be away from the Senate, but in reality, to run for office, you have to be. His record prior to that may be bad, but it isn't as bad as Bush's."
- - Actually, Kerry's record couldn't be any worse. He is on the intelligence comittee and he hasn't been to a single meeting or briefing in three years. You get fired for that in civilian life.

Feel free to post any Bush lies that you care to discuss or that you think most people may have missed. I'm not much on defending Bush (unless it's from such scurilous and unfounded charges as "Bush lied to get us into war...") I just happen to think Kerry isn't qualified to be dog catcher.


Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
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Re: are you serious??? [Cousin Elwood] [ In reply to ]
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Cousin Elwood,

1. Mathematically, it doesn't PROVE that Kerry is not the choice of a majority of cops. Until we see a ballot that shows "50.000001%" of cops are against Kerry, then we haven't proved anything. That is all I am saying. It does make the claim a little questionable, and I would like to know why he does claim to be the choice of cops, but I don't see that the FOP slamming him PROVES that isn't the cops choice. I am not saying he is, I am just not willing to accept the FOP statement as proving he isn't, since it doesn't according to mathematical fact. Let's not forget, most presidents are not elected by a majority, the are elected by a majority of electoral college votes, which often equates to a majority of voters (although in Bush's case not), but the voting populace is still much less than the eligible populace. So Bush couldn't even claim to be the choice of "most Americans." And even though Gore won the popular vote in 2000, even he couldn't claim to be the choice of "most Americans."

2. See above.

3. I'd like to know how you can claim he wasn't on vacation? None of us really knows how much time he spent "working," whether in the Oval Office or not. All I know is that he was in the White House less than any other president, and to me, during everything that has been going on during his presidency, that is a bad thing. Just my opinion. But for you to say that Bush was not on vacation, unless you are really Dick Cheney or someone else truly in the know, is impossible.

4. Technically, it is impossible to compare the schedules, so I apoligize for that. As president, Bush makes his own schedule more than Kerry does. If Bush wants to meet on the ranch, people come to him. The intelligence comittee wouldn't come to Nantucket, even if Kerry wanted them to. Most politicians would get fired in civilian life; I think that is why the become politicians.


There too many lies on both sides to cover. I would encourage EVERYONE to visit [b]FactCheck.Org[b] to straighten out the truth. It is a non-partisan website that shows the lies on both sides. Make your decisions based on the truth, not on party rhetoric.



My opinion: Kerry sucks, Bush sucks more. I yearn for Abe Lincoln, who is, IMO, the best president we have ever had, and probably will ever have.

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"Technically, it is impossible to compare the schedules, so I apoligize for that. As president, Bush makes his own schedule more than Kerry does. If Bush wants to meet on the ranch, people come to him. The intelligence comittee wouldn't come to Nantucket, even if Kerry wanted them to. Most politicians would get fired in civilian life; I think that is why the become politicians. "

Regardless if Pres Bush can or can't get work done in Texas, he's supposed to be at the White House. Getting stuff done away from DC is somewhat more difficult, if only because everyone else is not in Texas. If he needs to meet someone, they have to fly to TX. If he needs to sign legislation or paperwork, it has to be either sent from DC and then back, or printed up in TX and sent to DC. The fact that he can communicate with DC does not mean he is as effective or as efficient in TX. For Chrissakes, it's in a different time zone. This is one that bothers me. Whenever Pres Bush is in TX, the flag is not flying from the White House. There is such a thing as leadership by presence, and when you're out of town on a regular basis, people know it, and it doesn't send a good signal.

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)
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Re: are you serious??? [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
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WELL SAID!

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"it doesn't PROVE that Kerry is not the choice of a majority of cops."
- - No but it shows that the president of the FOP actually despises Kerry. "You suck" is a little stronger than "we support your opponent

"It does make the claim a little questionable"
- - Uh huh!

"I am just not willing to accept the FOP statement as proving he isn't, since it doesn't according to mathematical fact."
- - Perhaps not, but they make a strong case against Kerry and they are the largest.

"Let's not forget, most presidents are not elected by a majority, the are elected by a majority of electoral college votes"
- - Actually, most presidents ARE elected by a majority of the popular vote AS WELL as winning the electoral college.

"So Bush couldn't even claim to be the choice of 'most Americans.' "
- - Why not? Kerry claims to be the choice of cops, even though there is evidence against this. Bush could claim that a majority of those who love him just didn't bother to vote.

"And even though Gore won the popular vote in 2000, even he couldn't claim to be the choice of 'most Americans.' "
- - I thought he did claim that. He also claims to have won the election.

"I'd like to know how you can claim he wasn't on vacation? None of us really knows how much time he spent 'working,' whether in the Oval Office or not. All I know is that he was in the White House less than any other president, and to me, during everything that has been going on during his presidency, that is a bad thing."
- - You're entitled to your opinion, but US Presidents don't get vacations.

"But for you to say that Bush was not on vacation, unless you are really Dick Cheney or someone else truly in the know, is impossible."
- - Presidents don't get vacations.

"Most politicians would get fired in civilian life; I think that is why the become politicians."
- - No doubt. Most of them (Bush, Kerry, Gore and Clinton are good examples) couldn't get hired in civilian life.

"My opinion: Kerry sucks, Bush sucks more."
- - Face it, if we brought in good HR people to hire a president, neither of these to ass holes would even rate an interview.


Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
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Re: are you serious??? [Cousin Elwood] [ In reply to ]
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Presidents go on vacation. All Presidents have gone on vacation. Not to do so to some extent would be criminally stupid as any person needs some downtime to remain sane and sharp on the job. Reagan retreated to his ranch. Truman went to Key west or out on his yacht in the chesapeake. Ike played days and days of golf. GWB and LBJ both do/did the ranch thing. They may not get many days with absolutely nothing to do, but they take significant amounts of time "off." They do drastically less on vacation than they would do in the office. Are they reachable? Of course. But are they doing the dozens of things they have to do everyday in the White House? Nope. Too much time away from the office necessarily leads to inefficiency and hassle, or to work not getting done. The right amount allows for recovery, just like we take recovery days from training. To think there's no such thing as a Presidential vacation is to just ignore historical fact.

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)
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Re: are you serious??? [Cousin Elwood] [ In reply to ]
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Cousin Elwood,

1) Agreed. You suck is a strong statement. But it doesn't prove anything.

2) Most presidents are elected by a majority of the popular vote, which is not a majority of eligible voters in th is nation.

3) Bush could claim that, but it wouldn't have any proof. Just as I haven't seen any proof (either way) saying how a majority of cops really feels.

4) Gore could claim it. I was just saying it would be baseless. I was, foolishly, trying to say politicians should only make accurate claims...

5) I totally agree. Basically everyone who even wants to be president pretty much stinks...

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"I was, foolishly, trying to say politicians should only make accurate claims..."
- - Agreed. Excuse me, I just projected Pepsi® onto my keyboard via my nose...

"I totally agree. Basically everyone who even wants to be president pretty much stinks..."
- - Yep, and how have we managed to come to this sorry state of affairs where we have guys running for president that you wouldn't hire to mow your lawn?


Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
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Re: are you serious??? [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
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"Presidents go on vacation."
- - They may go somewhere, but they're still on the job and still getting briefings and info 24/7

"But are they doing the dozens of things they have to do everyday in the White House? Nope."
- - Personally, I think that's a good thing!

"To think there's no such thing as a Presidential vacation is to just ignore historical fact."
- - I'll repeat it for you, US Presidents don't get vacations. A vacation is I go fishing in the Sierras and no one bothers me. If I take my cell phone and conference with world leaders and get security briefings so that I end up with 45 minutes of fishing surrounded by two-dozen SS agents, that's NOT a vacation.

W will get a vacation either starting in late January or in 4+ years.



Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
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Re: are you serious??? [Cousin Elwood] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
"I totally agree. Basically everyone who even wants to be president pretty much stinks..."
- - Yep, and how have we managed to come to this sorry state of affairs where we have guys running for president that you wouldn't hire to mow your lawn?


Dare we bring up the cost of campaigning and campaign finance reform??

"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp
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Re: are you serious??? [Rappstar] [ In reply to ]
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"Dare we bring up the cost of campaigning and campaign finance reform??"

I don't think that's it. I think the business just attracts crooks. Look at Clinton. The man has never had a real job, and somehow he has taken his salaries as State AG, Gubernor and Pres and after deducting over $10 mil in legal expenses he's got a $10 million house that we're paying for.

Follow the money...


Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...
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