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who was it that said the quality of posts on this forum are suffering as of late?
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I agree! As a lurker on anything more techical than what my favorite chamois cream is, I just want to say thanks. I've learned more about bike fit from reading this thread than I have in the last 6 months. Tom- I'm extremely impressed with your knowledge of fit, relative to all the bike shops in my area. I'm seriously considering a field trip to Dearborn when I've finally got the $$ scraped up for a new bike- and I live in California.

[reply]He's two guys that went to the same class at the same time and they can not agree on fit,if i were Dan i would feel a little sad.Randall[/reply]

I think the issue was much more straightforward than that, so don't be sad. My first post was that any bike can fit you, but most won't handle well. Tom only picked up on the first half and replied that he disagrees because the bike likely won't handle well. And we've been trying to fix the confusion ever since.

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Gerard Vroomen
3T.bike
OPEN cycle

Gerard, how's the Wildflower training going?

At the EXTREME risk of being labeled a pandering ass-kisser: I do agree with the essence of what Gerard has said. Furthermore, NO ONE is building bikes like him right now. And I mean NO ONE. I really like them. I will reiterate that I can buy pretty much any bikes I want for my store, and I buy (among other good brands) Cervelo. I do this because I like them, they have substantial fit latitude AND good handling (when fitted appropriately). I order three of the bikes for my own personal use. When ever Gerard and I tangle tails (in person or on this forum) I pretty much never fail to learn something from him. SO... we don't really disagree. We are having a constructive dialog the goal of which is to learn more about the sales and marketing of well-fitted triathlon bikes. I think that's a good thing.

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Tom Demerly
The Tri Shop.com

[reply]Gerard, how's the Wildflower training going?[/reply]

Haven't done any. You may have noticed I haven't been on the forum either, they are the two things that have suffered due to too heavy a workload. The only thing I've done is one game of hockey per week (we're in the play-offs so I can't refuse, though I missed this week's semi-final due to travel).

But I may still do the race, it also depends a bit on if I really got the spot since I haven't heard from the donor lately.

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Gerard Vroomen
3T.bike
OPEN cycle

I like being a well trained monkey. But my personal beliefs do not allow for any form of that nonsense. Maybe it was the fisting or the caning but I now understand points in space. Is that how Cervelo's are blueprinted? I like being positioned for maximum efficiency on a properly sized frame- thats what I call "fit".

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Prankster

[reply]I like being a well trained monkey. But my personal beliefs do not allow for any form of that nonsense. Maybe it was the fisting or the caning but I now understand points in space. Is that how Cervelo's are blueprinted?[/reply]

Yes and no. The points in space relate to the rider's position, not to the frame. For the frame, it converts to a logical range of reach, which is basically the same as what we have been listing for years as hor. dim. in our geometry charts. Or you may call it cockpit room, or whatever you like, the bottom line is that the horizontal distance between the bb and the headtube should slowly and consistently increase from one size to the next one up.

If you don't, if you slacken the seattube angle and lengthen the toptube at the same time, this hor. dimension remains the same and you really haven't changed the frame, other than in irrelevant ways. It's why a 43cm Trek WSD is really the same size as a 48cm WSD, and don't get me started about the theory of WSD itself!

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Gerard Vroomen
3T.bike
OPEN cycle