"what if a slight "unnatural" increase can throw the system out of balance?"

Jeez, you guys want global warming to be happening so desperately that you'll clutch at any straw. I would think that you'd welcome the knowledge that our planet (which was been strong enough to shrug of more crap than mankind has ever dreamed of creating) is actually strong enough to support us. It's like saying, "gee, do you think the extra weight of my cat in my car will cause the Golden Gate Bridge to collapse?

NO!!! It won't.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

"obviously Elwood is not using enough underarm deodorant to warm up that place enough so the guy could enjoy that nice sunny day without having to put a hat on."

Absolutely not, I use the extra-strength stuff, but it's a stick...

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

 
Be honest, Cousin Elwood, unless you google-search right now, you've never heard of the "artificial" daily rain situation in Tokyo! In case you have, how can you deny that the local climate there is manmade?

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If you ever want to know what an "eggman" is, then simply click here....http://www.emu5.de

[reply]
"Let's make this real simple. Fact 1, certain molecules reflect long wave radiation more effectively than short. Fact 2, solar radiation arrives as short wave and is absorbed by the earth and radiated back as long wave. Fact 3, increasing the concentration of these molecules increases the effect. This is how the greenhouse effect works, not theory just facts. Whether the effect of this increased energy will be is a realm of theory, although the increases in Atlantic hurricane activity are one of the commonly predicted outcomes"

Now let's make it even simpler. Increased "greenhouse" gases cause an increase in plant growth, as does the concommitant increase in wator vapor. A momentary peak in the so-called gh gases and/or an icrease in temperature creates an increase in plant growth which diminishes gh gases and reduces temperature. A decrease in the thickness of the ozone layer permints increased UV radiation which creates additional ozone.

How the f--- do you think this planet has lasted for billions of years. Volcanoes have dumped more gh gases in individual events (e.g., Pinatubo) and with no lasting consequences. Back in the '60s the pet theory was that all the pollution was going to reduce the transmission of solar radiation and cause global cooling. Good thing we didn't go crazy trying to prevent that, because now everyone would be blaming the greenies for causing global warming. It's actually funny, if you could just step back and see reality. [/reply]

1)Increased CO2, which is not he only greenhouse gas has been shown to increase plant growth only when all other limiting factors have been removed. Outside of controlled study conditions this situation does not occur.
2)You say that volcanic activity releases more gases than people as if it were a fact, it is not.
3)Life has not been on this planet for billions of years.
4)If you bothered to read any of the primary source material about global climate change, you would see that the changes predicted by the best computer models show areas of warming and areas of cooling. To claim that "scientists say the world is getting hotter" is ignorance in the true sense of the word (not being in possesion of the facts).
5) Reducing the emmision of greeenhouses gases will do no harm.

"Be honest, Cousin Elwood, unless you google-search right now, you've never heard of the 'artificial' daily rain situation in Tokyo!"
- - You are correct

"In case you have, how can you deny that the local climate there is manmade?"
- - Keyword: LOCAL

Yes, we can seed clouds and make it (sometimes) rain in Kansas. Meanwhile, the seeded clouds don't carry their moisture to Detroit, where it WAS going to rain. Paving large portions of NYC can cause a slight local temperature increase. Local anomalies don't equate to global warming. Not sure what's happening in Japan, or whether some local phenomenon is causing it. My guess is that it's like the thunderstorms we never used to have in the SF Bay Area. Weather changes... It does.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

it's not a matter of "wanting" it to be happening. it's a matter of taking the view that if it is happening, i'd rather do something now rather than wait until it's too late...

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f/k/a mclamb6

Now that is word twisting, isn't it?
Before I used the word local I just said in Tokyo...

I don't see the difference....wasn't that local enough? Do you need a street name?
The question was, whether humans influence climate or not. I said YES , you said NO (just like I say YES to the question if global warming exists, while you say NO) ....this was a general question and didn't exclude local climate (or the climate in Tokyo).

But now you agree, that on a local basis humans do influence climate! Is that correct?

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If you ever want to know what an "eggman" is, then simply click here....http://www.emu5.de

"Now that is word twisting, isn't it? "

No, I don't think it is. We started with GLOBAL warming which mankind CANNOT cause. I don't know what's happening in Tokyo, but that's local, not GLOBAL. I dont' believe we can substantively affect the climate or temperature, even locally, although building enough really tall buildings might conceivably cause air currents to deviate, which could have a nominal effect.

On a local basis, we might possibly be able to cause some miniscule SHORT-TERM changes.

Meanwhile weather is changing all over the globe, as it has done for millennia.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

"it's not a matter of "wanting" it to be happening. it's a matter of taking the view that if it is happening, i'd rather do something now rather than wait until it's too late... "

OK, so if you THINK you're tires are losing air, should you add 20psi every morning? Try, PLEASE TRY, for just a moment to understand that the possibility that mankind could cause the planet to get measurably warmer is preposterous. NOW, once you've accepted that thought, for however short an instant, does it still make any sense at all to expend time, money and effort to prevent something that can't happen.

NOW, stop wanting it to happen, breathe deeply and go find a real problem to solve...

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...

Just a question, Cousin Elwood, as you seem to know much more about all this than I do (though you haven't convinced me yet... as you haven't given me proof to your theory) :

While we had the Ice Age (is that the right word?) over here in Europe, you know, the grand glacier covering all of this area where I now sit, which kept moving further south, and which has given shape to most of our European continental surface, was your area covered by ice as well? Did Mexico have a tropical climate at the same time as Northern Africa? I am really and honestly wondering because I don't know....hope you have an answer to this question.

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If you ever want to know what an "eggman" is, then simply click here....http://www.emu5.de

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If you ever want to know what an "eggman" is, then simply click here....http://www.emu5.de

"While we had the Ice Age (is that the right word?) over here in Europe... was your area covered by ice as well?"
- - I don't know how far south the ice went, but my understanding is that many parts of what is now Canada and the northern US were ice bound. One story has it that there were flowers found trapped in ice, indicating that currently arctic tundra was once more moderate. I'm no expert on the ice age, and most of those who claim to be are just speculating, since there's no written record. Many of the assumptions are simply most likely scenarios.

At that time, the earth was apparently a cooler place to live, no pun intended. So then it warmed up. Since then, there is evidence that the mean and average temperatures, both locally and globally have vacillated. The current warming trend, if it pans out - and that's a big if - is not particularly remarkable, unusual, nor any legitimate cause for concern.

From the other post: "Why meanwhile?"
- - Because the weather changes in micro and macro cycles - 5, 15, 50, 100, 500, 1000 years and longer. Just the fact that weather is different doesn't mean the earth has fallen off its axis or that something horrendous is going to follow.

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Cousin Elwood - Team Over-the-hill Racing
Brought to you by the good folks at Metamucil and Geritol...