The thread title may as well have been about gun control. It's often a hotly debated topic.

The book I'm following is for people who have to train on minimum time allowances. It doesn't recommend keto for life/time crunched folks. But it also does not write off its merits either.

Let's be clear though, low carb can simply mean getting yourself into a proper well rounded diet to begin with. As most non athletes and some athletes diets have way more carbs than necessary to begin with.

I'm an example of that. I was always pounding the beers back at night, lots of poor portioning of my meals (too many carbs vs. veggies or lean protein). Poor snack choices (chips). Poor breakfast choices, carby breads/cereals and no protein. Always was having gatorade mix in the bidons.

I went from 181 to 170 pretty easy without diet. Now to get to 158 and falling, I had to change it up. I'm pretty sure now that I pay attention, I only eat about 1/3 the carbs I used to. I feel I'm only down to a "proper" or normal carb diet now.

So when you make bread, how many loaves do you bake at a time, and how long does it take to make the loaves??? Did your bread-maker come with loaf-shaped pans??? Interesting idea as i do eat a lot of bread, about 6-8 slices/day. I just buy the Kroger bread at an avg price of 1.10/loaf, so at 24 slices*60 cal/slice = 1440/1.10 =1310 cal/1.00 but that's high compared to your 6000-8000 cal/1.00. What various ingredients do you put in your basic white bread??? Flour, yeast, water, and...???

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

I copied a quick (very old and very lame) video demonstration below. They usually make a single, 2lb loaf. Basic ingredients for plain white bread are flour, sugar, yeast, water, oil and salt. There are tons of recipe books and websites available that specifically deal with bread machines, but each bread maker also comes with a handful of recipes. And you can get as fancy as you like: parmesan and cracked black pepper, pesto, garlic/onion, cinnamon raisin, etc. My sister uses it for pizza dough because the kneading and rising is automated. My brother makes a killer sage and sausage bread. Aside from my microwave, it's probably my next most useful "maker".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNVg_I0IlPw

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https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm

Good quality bread like sourdough does not need oil

Very interesting, thanks. That video was quite OK IMO, not too lame. :) So, changing subjects, what have you found to be the cheapest source of protein??? I think my 10-lb bags of chicken at 0.69/lb, or about 1.00/lb of meat when you take out the bones, is the cheapest i've found. I burned out on it though and so don't have a bag to calculate the grams of protein per dollar. Personally, i find ground beef to be the most "satisfying" and it goes for $1.40 to 1.90 per lb at WalMart. Do you ever find hamburger at lesser prices??? Or do you know of a cheaper protein source??? Milk is a pretty cheap source also.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Canned tuna or eggs are going to be the cheapest protein on a grams per dollar basis

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Matt

Ah, thanks. I don't care much for tuna but I'll load up on eggs tomorrow when we go to the grocery store!!!

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

As cheap as I am with carbohydrates and fats, I kind of just bite the bullet with protein. I drink a lot of milk and eat a variety of chicken preparations, from boneless skinless, which is never more than 1.99/lb here, to leg/thigh combos to whole roasters, like you mentioned. Pork loins and ham occasionally go on sale for less than $2/lb, but unfortunately beef tends to be pretty expensive and rarely goes on sale. I also have a big chest freezer, and if there's a really substantial sale, I'll kind of load that thing up. Also, if you have a Gordon Food Service, or other bulk distributor, cheeses and cottage cheese can be pretty cheap. I consider anything under ~45g of protein per dollar to be a viable option, but if milk, for example, doesn't make that cut it's still going to end up in my cart.

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https://connect.garmin.com/modern/profile/domingjm

We're on the same page here as $2.50/lb is my cut-off for meats and cheeses. Speaking of milk, I too drink a fair amount of it and milk in my area generally passes the 45 g/1.00 test; at $2.69/gal and 8 g protein/8 oz milk, that's about 47.6 g/1.00.

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."

Many people unknowingly suffer metobolic syndrome since it seems being fat is accepted as the norm. Thus first repair the body... Not much exercise needed http://bigthink.com/...n-diet-with-exercise

French baguette:

Water
Salt
(Fresh) Yeast
Wheat

That's it. No oil. No sugar...

The problem is you can't seem to get a good baguette outside of France.

I've found several spots in the US with good baguette.
One DC bakery I can think of. Couple of spots in Seattle and SF too.

What bakery in DC?

Paul has pretty decent baguette. So does Boulangerie Christophe. You can find better in Paris but they are still good.

I'll be in the area in the next few days and give them a shot.

For the last 7-8 years, I have kept a pretty primal low-carb diet. I have experimented with keto, zero-carb, and intermittent fasting - and trained in all of these conditions.

I personally have found great benefits in training my body to not rely on a constant stream of carbs coming into my system. I suppose that means that I have become more "fat adapted." This is a gradual process and it takes a lot of time for your body (and metabolic machinery) to adapt, but I think it's worth it in the long haul -- in sport but also in life. It's very liberating not to have to eat carbs every few hours, and I have experienced cognitive benefits as well.

Everybody is different. I seem to have adapted pretty well to this, but I know a lot of people have trouble and it takes longer for them to get used to it.

I would definitely recommend experimenting with training in fasted or carb-depleted states. Start with shorter, easier workouts, and then go from there. Even if it doesn't workout perfectly, you'll learn that you won't die without carbs and you may gain a psychological edge in your racing.

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TRIATHLON ART FOR YOUR PAIN CAVE: https://www.matthewmillerart.com/...art?category=Ironman

I would recommend...... you do what works for you! I went Keto about a month and a half ago. Went from 188 to 167. I’m 29 years old, reasonably fit and athletic. I graduated HS at 182 and have been there for really the last 10 years (gained a few lbs in 2017). Now I feel light as a feather. I’m waiting to see what this does to my training! Time will tell. Also for what it’s worth I dislike Greenfield, his “Keto” race was aided by Coke every 15 minutes. Ehhh.

I have been doing Keto for a week because my wife wanted to try it. I was curious as to the effect it would have on my training. I lost 8 lbs this week. I was 5'8" and 147 lbs, so IMO I didn't really have 8 lbs to lose... I would say that the diet definitely works. I personally am going to have to start eating a lot more (even though I am never hungry now) to maintain weight, which is okay with me as I like to eat.

Been thinking about Keto and even bought a book a few years ago which overwhelmed me.
Is there a "Keto For Dummies" kind of resource available? Or, more generally, what are some good resources to help understand the diet requirements?
Thanks!

scroll down from here https://www.healthline.com/...t-101#foods-to-avoid

My 2c - You should absolutely, 100% try LCHF. It may not work wonders for you, it may not be compatible with your lifestyle, it won’t be the forever answer to managing your weight (unless it somehow really, really works for you & your lifestyle).

But it’s a great way to learn about carbs and your body, and a great way to force yourself to take control of your diet and find radically different ways to shop, prepare, eat & relate to food.

And if your carb metabolism is in a stressed, unhealthy, or otherwise damaged state (I.e. some level of pre-diabetic) then you’re almost certain to lose a lot of weight fast. And again, if you’re in that state, then a period of very low carb is probably the only realistic way to do so.

Then when you’re done with teally LCHF, you’ll have to learn a whole new diet that isn’t so restrictive and allows some carbs. Keto isn’t a forever diet for many people, and as it’s been said, it’s far from an optimal performance diet (except as far as it helps you regulate your weight).

That last step is a transition that most people mess up, I’m my experience. I know I have. But getting it right is the key to making all this work in the long run.

Best of luck with whatever strategy you end up trying.

This is a good idea! Keto not only promotes weight loss but also has plenty of health benefits. Above all, it can help reduce the risk of health conditions like cancer, acne, diabetes, epilepsy, Parkinson’s, and Alzheimer’s disease. You can check this article https://betterme.world/...es/keto-diet-basics/ for details. I've been on Keto for about a year and feel well. It is definitely worth trying.

Considering that ketone bodies come from fatty acids, this is a bizarre statement. Please expand on this.

Your other advice of removing junk and making gradual changes seem reasonable enough.

I did a little bit of research on Keto when I first hear about it. I knew I person who had used it successful to qualify and compete at Kona and he followed the LCHF diet very strictly and had some good insight and advise. I also found two very informative case study/test/research articles on low Carb diets that also had some good insight and advise. All the information I got lead me to the conclusion that if you have special dietary restriction like being diabetic, glucose intolerant, or have celiac disease that it is something that you should try, but that Keto would no improve your performance so carbs is the best option for most people. I do fine with carbs, so I decided to not go the Keto route. Yes, I have bonked at races, and yes there is a greater chance of blowing up in long races when you are using carbs, but the longest races I have done is a 70.3 and the last time I did one of those was before Covid. For sprint or Olympic races I don't have to refuel to make it to the finish like so Keto doesn't even come into play in those events. It might start to come into play in 70.3 events and defiantly in 140.6 races. But I am not doing them and when (if) I do carbs will still be the best for me since I don't have dietary limitations.