I've never done a 7h workout but then again I didn't win 2 of 2 IMs either...

your taint must have turned to leather after ~12 hours on and around a saddle and bike shorts...

I think we also have to remember the bike is a lot different at the pro level than for 90% of the age groupers. Also from a stimulus standpoint the bike is the safest place to do over distance work without beating yourself up too much so long as it's not done too often. With that said I have only done one 7hr ride since I started doing triathlon and it was more for the fun of doing the particular route. Did the old Greg Lemond loop up in Tahoe/Reno which was really fun just because it went over one of the highest Sierra passes, through on old western town and some other cool landmarks. If you are ever up there I highly recommend it.

https://www.strava.com/activities/181230177

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This is also Jesse Thomas we are talking about. He is not mortal.

It's OK you can still make fun... after Leadville I realized i'm a much better triathlete than cyclist. For some reason I still have a desire to do another Leadville though.

Yeah man, it's the way to go. So much more fun getting out for a big adventure when you know you're not inconveniencing the rest of your family.

I won't hit 7, but will hit 6 hours a couple of times during an IM build, usually 5.5 hrs on the bike followed by a 30 min run. I enjoy the cycling, more so because the last 3.5 hours of the ride are typically with a group of friends.

You do 140.6s, correct? Weren't you training to do IMLou last year on a 1x (apologies if I mixed you up with somebody else)? What's your longest day during an IM build?

Normally have 2-3 of this in a build to IM. I used to do them more when I was slower but as I got quicker they were less necessary. This year i think I had 2-3 which were mostly during big training weeks when overall volume was up. They'd be something like

1hr swim + 6hr 30 easy ride
Following week: 1hr swim + 5hr30 ride with IM efforts in them

or something like:

6hr30 easy ride + 35-45 minutes slightly below IM pace run

Most of the time those 7+hour workouts are mostly just a long ride on my road bike and I'll be pretty liberal about pace and stops in order to get a group of people riding with me

But what if you - instead of a 6.5hr "easy" bike ride - could have achieved the same (or arguably better) training effect from a 4.5hr ride done as, say, 15ez + 4x (30 @ 80ish % + 30 @ 70ish %) + 15ez

Probably easier to find riding buddies with a ride like that as well.

I like riding long just as much as the next athlete (well, maybe not as much as some of the athletes in THIS thread) but I would much rather ride hard than lollygag around for an extra 25+ % of riding time.

In what world is 260 watts considered lollygagging?

Also while he is 2 for 2 in Ironmans, I remember reading that the athletic accomplishment Jesse is most proud of is riding up King's Mtn no-handed.

https://www.strava.com/segments/1334338

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Well firstly: my use of the word lollygag was not meant as a reference to Jesse. A lot in this thread have used the term "easy," and that was my context.

But secondly, 260w is actually a bit of lollygagging around for someone like Jesse.

But those aren't your only two options either....I can ride that extra 25% at a higher than "lollygag" pace. For example, I rode the IMWI course last weekend at IM+ pace and had a great workout. I'll take that ride as training for an IM race over a shorter, but more intense ride since it better mimics my race day (especially as race day approaches).

Going "long" doesn't have to be a synonym for "lollygag".

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When I was training for IM, I would typically have close 7 hr days on Saturdays, but not 7 hr workouts. I'd typically do a 5.5 hr ride, a 30-40 minute run, and then a 45-60' easy swim later in the day. Sometimes the run would be off the bike or sometimes it would be later in the day as well. I probably did 5-6 of those days leading into the race. My wife worked Saturdays and that was before we had kids.

I've listened to Ken Glah talk about what he did back when he was a professional, and he would have multiple 7 hr workouts during each week during his build into Kona. Twice a week he would ride 6-7 hours and then run. He said his key test session which he would do a couple of times leading into Kona was a 140-150 mile ride followed by a 17 (!) mile run.

Funny (sort of) thing about that...I lubed up the taint/crotch big time but I didn't spread it out wide enough and after the ride the taint was gold but the outside seams of the chamois had cut into my ass big time which really took the enjoyment out of the post race shower :-( lesson learned!

I do workouts like the one you prescribe but I guess the variety may be a good stimulant. My coach writes the workouts so I can't claim one way is better than the other. I've seen good results from him this year as he mixes up my training a lot more than I would have if I was self-coaching.

I've actually found the longer easier rides are easier to find buddies. If I'm riding intervals at 80% that may be closer to a buddies 85% which over the course of 4 hours may have them blowing up. If I'm riding at 60% and they're riding at 65% then we're both going easy, and with a couple stops we're all going to finish the ride with a smile on our face.

At the weekends I'm time rich so a 6.5 hour ride versus a 4.5 hour ride doesn't impact me that much

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I think that's VERY normal within the pro ranks. My longest brick before IMMT '15 was 6:15 on the bike + 40min run off the bike. My longest ride this year before the race was about 6-1/2 hours this year. For whatever reason, Joel hasn't had me running off the bike as much this year so I had run an hour in the morning before that. And, by all accounts, both Jesse and I - we train a roughly similar amount I believe - seem to be "low volume" guys. Luke McKenzie posted something the other day about a 250km ride. Ben Hoffman posted about doing 300km+ in the mountains with Chris McDonald and Richie Cunningham earlier this year. Faris did 3 consecutive 10hr rides, and then, he admitted, he got very sick.

I don't think you need to do a LOT of these workouts. But I do think one or two really long days leading into an Ironman pays dividends. At the very least, it's a VERY good way to make sure your bike fit is correct.

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My thought process revolved more along the lines of

"you guys and gals should be the exception rather than the rule"

Or something like that.

I have no desire to emulate that type of training until I'm either sub 8:30 or over 14:00.

Kevin C is great!

I've got you beat by an hour and change, but was just training for life

In 1988 and 1989, I used to regularly ride from San Luis Obispo to a little north of Hearst Castle and back (about 120 miles) and then run eight miles. I think it took about 6.5 hours total.

At some point it comes to do it being his job. Now as you pointed out later in this thread, it could certainly be debated what is the more effective workout, but then again we aren't Jesse's coach, and frankly we don't get to see / hear everything. When I think about Pros and long workouts, I think of mental toughness, sure he may not exactly be slaying it, but he has to have the mental fortitude to get it done.

On race day, especially in an Ironman, at the pointy end, it can be very very lonely. Maybe some pros like that, maybe even thrive on it, but it can be very mentally taxing as well. It is always easier to have people around you - stimulus, or at least it is for me.

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Relative to full Ironman: the long 7hr day is not about toughness, or even gaining fitness. Both are a by product of preparing for and executing this session. Recovery needs will vary according to execution.

The session; properly prescribed (before and after), is a chance to test your swim, bike, run, nutritional strategy.

It is an opportunity to gain knowledge. You gain confidence or are startled into a change of strategy.

If you have successfully (relative to personal potential) executed several IMs with a predicted "swim, bike, run, fueling plan", I can see skipping this one, unless you (and your trusted advisors) think fitness markers have changed. Rhetorically, why waste thousands of dollars on race entry and travel to find out you were mistaken.

Never don't test.

my coach think that even 6hours workouts have only a 'logistic purpose' and they don't help triathletes to gain fitness. so he give me 2 6h workouts in my plan but the other long workout are about 5 hours , max 5:30 hours with some variations inside (such as 30' Z3 or similar).

i agree with him. in marathon, because of the high risk of injury that 'd come with a 42kms workout, we know that even elite athletes train with 35km max workouts (a lot of them at least). even if the reason is different this teaches that you don't have to train for the full race distance to achieve great perfomance.