I've been using paraffin chains on 4 bikes for the past couple of years. As you've thought, one of the nicest aspects has been how clean the chains are for general handling, storage and transport. I just recoated the chain on my trainer bike after ~1200 miles and it was still running smooth when I did. I use a $10 hot plate and cheap stainless steel pot for coating rather than a crockpot. The up side of this is how quickly it gets up to temp and you can get the process done while the down side is there is significant fire hazard if you leave it unattended. Pulling the chain from the pot is messy and I would never do it in the house. Your significant other would hate you for dripping paraffin all over the house.

I see next to no down side and plan to continue using the process in the future.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

I have been using Paraffin on 5 bikes for the last 5+ years. Love it. The chains are always clean which is good because I put my bikes in the back seat of my car quite often. I don't mind having to wax a chain every couple of weeks. No downsides for me.

The only downside is the extra time it takes, and the relatively short lifespan of wax.

Recently I've found Squirt wax to be so convenient (if a little expensive) that I mostly use it for general-purpose waxing, and just do the full crockpot thing for races. Squirt seems to perform just as well as melted-on wax with respect to residue and lifespan.

+1

Squirt is dead-easy to use, no wiping, and you can't over-apply (it's biodegradable anyway).

The downside is that it only lasts 150-300 miles, but it's so easy to use (just dribble on the chain before a ride and pedal off) it's not an issue.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

I've actually found my fastest chain to be a waxed chain, 4 hours on the turbo or road approx, then a light application of squirt.
Tested this with pedal and hub based power readings

I have 3 bikes with the extensive cleaning and wax treatment (Molten Speed Wax directions) and 2 of the bikes have several hundred miles on the first treatment. These are new KMC chains. I threw the chain while shifting yesterday and the beauty of putting it back on with absolutely no filth. None!

As far as performance they seem to be running as good as what I have experienced in my years of using traditional wet lube. The chain noise even with the miles is not that bad.

At the link I have a couple pictures following a rain storm and messy roads. The paper towel shows some filth, but that was after pressing hard and spinning the chain for a few minutes. The picture of the bike, chain and cassette was taken before I wiped it off with the paper towel.


http://thecyclingaddiction.blogspot.com/...sosebee-solo_18.html

I am sold on waxing and I don't mind the extensive cleaning and waxing. The directions sound extensive, but It really doesn't take much time. I will put a few more miles on these chains and then drop them in hot wax again. Supposedly the hot wax tends to clean previously waxed chains. That part I have not experienced yet.

I've been using this method for 3 years across two bikes. I think it's fantastic. I run a couple of chains on both bikes which minimises the intervals between re-waxing. The only downside I can think of: Make sure you get the excess wax off prior to installing on your bike. I find any excess wax tends to accumulate around the 11-12T cogs on the cassette which results in the chain skipping on these cogs.

Awesome - great pics!

Have you found that the hot wax does NOT clean previously waxed chains? Just curious

I love it. The key is to have several, or at least 2, chains that you cycle through. Then you're not having to wax a chain very often. Just wax them all at the same time a few times a year.

Thanks

What I meant to say is that I am still on my initial wax treatment and haven't tried the second treatment yet, but I hear the following hot wax treatments are easier than the first one that requires all the mineral and alcohol baths to clean off the manufacture's grease on a new chain.

+2

On a new chain, I will clean with mineral spirits and alcohol. It is amazing all the metal that will come out. Then put Squirt on the chain in a pan on the stove and low heat. Seems to get the Squirt into the chain. Then simply reapply as needed.

Yes. I am a big fan of paraffin waxing. I also use a crockpot (8$). If you get accustomed to the procedure it will take less time to re-wax a chain.

And here's the most important verdict.
: it is super clean. You can touch a waxed chain without gloves at anytime.

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Stay home, stay healthy.

Your chain will still get dirty but not greasy. It will still pick up the black crap from the road.

I used wax on my fat bike this winter. Obviously no road grime gets kicked up on groomed snow. My chain at the end of the winter was 100% spotless. Unreal how clean it stays on snow.

All that said I still use std lube for training on the road. It's easier.

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24 Hour World TT Champs-American record holder
Fat Bike Worlds - Race Director
Insta: chris.s.apex

I bought a mini crockpot for cheap off Amazon when I ordered the Molten Speed Wax. What I like is that after the initial treatment was just leaving the wax in the pot so the next time I just heat it up and throw the chains in like they are and go do something else around the house. On the MSW directions it gives an estimated number of times that same wax can be used for race chain or for training chains before the wax needs to changed. Which I am sure would be about the same for simple paraffin wax as well.

Super prelim first-timer experience so far:

Got my small crockpot in and paraffin beads. I opted to not throw in the oil at this point.

I know I'm supposed to start with a new, clean chain, but I did want to see how well it would clean a well used, dirty chain, so I threw my old chain into the crockpot after melting the paraffin on the high setting (took about 15 mins to melt completely). I did use an orange degreaser on full strength yesterday on it, but even after wiping, the chain still left tons of chain tattoos even on a millisecond of touch.

The melted wax/dirty chain turned the wax black in the pot. I stirred it, then pulled the chain after 15 mins or so. I then wiped the chain free of the external wax while still warm and melted. This pulled off a LOT of black wax.

At first I was pretty disappointed with how black the chain still looked on the outside (actually looked pretty clean, but still with plenty of dark spots), but after running it through my hands and on a white paper towel a few times, it was night and day how little black debris marked my hands or towel. Pretty amazing, actually. I think a lot of those dark spots on the chain might even be areas of chain wear - they don't seem to come off.

For sure, zero chain tattoo if the chain brushes my leg. This is going to make wrenching my bike SO much more enjoyable - seriously, that chain grease was the single biggest thing I hated about bike maintenance. Looking forward to more experimentation tonight - I am trying to recycle the dirty wax, but will also keep a 'clean' block of wax ready to go on new chains.

Sorry to say this but you should have cleaned the old chain to an absolute spotless condition if you want to do this properly. It normally takes me ~ 5 separate "washes" and rinses with mineral spirits to get a used chain spick and span.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Yes, I know!

I have a separate new chain ready to go after I upgrade my bike, and for that one I'm going to use brand-new paraffin. (I have lots of it - it's cheap)

This was more of an experimentation to see how well I could clean a fugly chain. I've been really disappointed with chain cleaners and every citrus degreaser I've used - in every case, I still get a huge chain tattoo the moment anything touches that 'clean' chain, even after I've wiped it down post degreasing. I admittedly haven't tried kerosene or those other flammable agents, but looking online, most think that paraffin does as good if not better job cleaning a dirty chain, and it seems to be the real deal here.

I'm following a youtube video that recommends a 1:1 paraffin wax to paraffin oil mixture - I omitted the oil as of this point and things still seem to be moving fine (I want to see if I can recycle the wax but cutting off the dirty settled part) but if anyone's tried the oil, chime in on how useful or not it is.

Yes, paraffin wax is clean, nice & dandy on a straight chain line. Have you ever wondered what would happen to the wax inside each roller when your chain line is not straight, i.e. chain on large chainring and smallest cog or chain on small chainring and middle of the cassette?

I like to minimize use of mineral spirits, etc. So for training chains I just use my wife's laundry soap. That, with near-boiling heat in an ultrasonic cleaner, gets chains pretty darned clean.

Granted, this is just for factory lube or periodic removal and re-application of wax. Not trying to convert a used oil-lubed chain.

For race chains I stick to the The Program.

Do you have some reason to believe it would behave any differently than any other type of lube?

Not worried about it.

It's been around long enough now (the wax) and used successfully by so many folks who post online that all this stuff about "wax isn't a lube, wont' work" and "won't work on a non-straight chainline" or "washes away instantly with rain" have been pretty much debunked by practical experience.

The main issues folks had with it was the need to reapply the wax more frequently (easier with a slow cooker), and breaking the chain to rewax (which is super easy with a masterlink.)

Definitely. Uneven pressure on the pin inside each roller will force the wax out on one side and flake off -> metal to metal contact. This is one reason why wax doesn't last very long. This issue doesn't occur with a wet lube since the lube can just flow back.

Friction Facts did all test on perfectly straight chain line. I like to see tests done on angled chain line.

Hmm...I'm a bit skeptical of your concerns. We're talking about a very thin film that does the actual lubrication, not caked on solids that typically get pushed around.

But, sure, actual tests would be good.

I think there's enough testing done by magazines out there (google it) showing that paraffin wax performs admirably well, even if there are these theoretical concerns. Some of the testing was really good - one of them I saw used a special contraption that could reliably measure 0.1watts of difference in a chain under a fixed load, and paraffin was yet again one of the top performers in their test.

So I think all the chainline concerns, wax extrusion concerns, etc., aren't real-world limiters of paraffin performance on a bike chain.

I haven't seen any angled chain line testing as mentioned above, but honestly, not worried about it.

I've seen the tests done with respect to drivetrain friction, but the other concern with wax is durability/longevity. Are you decreasing chain life substantially by waxing instead of lubing, and/or does it require rewaxing at excessively short intervals to avoid squeaking. Have there been tests on that? If so I have not seen them.

The wax longevity issue is a real one, but there are more than enough people online posting that it lasts enough for functionable purposes, with the caveat that you WILL have to wax your chain more frequently than you would with lubes. I've seen wax estimates as low as 100 mi to 500 mi, probably depends on conditions.

On the bike forums, people aren't complaining that their waxed chains are wearing out faster, but no, haven't seen any studies on it. I've seen mainly the opposite (longer lasting), but there may be bias in reporting there.

I don't see a wet lube flowing back and forth as you describe. There is just a thin film.

I seem to remember friction facts doing a cross-chain test and I was surprised how little chain line impacted friction. If my memory is correct, only about a 1-2 watt loss for a big ring front and back cross

My concern is at the moment when the rear derailleur is shifted: the upper derailleur pulley has already moved to the next cog while the chain is still on the current cog (pretty big chain angle). This puts a lot of lateral force on the chain and thus on one side of each pin/roller, squeezing the wax out.

Not flowing back and forth per se but being massaged back by the pin/roller once the chain straightens out and pressure is evenly distributed. Being a thin low viscosity film, it's easier for the molecules to slide back. The same thing can't be said when wax molecules have been squeezed out of each roller and fallen off.

I would think the wax film that starts on the very inside of the chain just slowly works its way out over the roughly 200 miles of use you get between waxings. So the wax between the rollers one pins is slowly works its way out across the roller/plate interface.

I am a little too lazy to always relax, so after the first cleaning and waxing, I use the Squirt Wax. For the first 5 or 6 applications of the Squirt wax I get some grey/black residue from the Molybdimum in the Molton Speed wax, so there is some wax that is still working its way around the inside of the chain for the first month or so

Take it for what it's worth but this is my experience on a campy chorus 11 speed setup that has used squirt lube from new.

I checked the chain @ 1000 miles (four checks) using the campy method of measurement and found it to be 132.20mm to 132.30mm.

Campy recommend that it is replaced at 132.60mm maximum.

The chain came off at 1500 miles due to its link count and a change to a bigger cassette.

I haven't measured it since (using the campy method) but I did use the traditional chain checker on it and the 0.75 end wouldn't go anywhere near it.

I could check it with the vernier again if you think it would help the discussion ?

WD :-)

Very good

I was sort of a skeptic about this at first as well. I've been stuck in that "that's the way we've always done it" box of using oil since the start, but now that I have gone through the initial process on three chains and I have almost 1000 miles on one chain (all dry rides) with the initial treatment I am absolutely sold on it. Even with going just a bit further with the mileage the chain is still running extremely smooth and if wax is working its way out as some have suggested I am not noticing a loss of power, any sign of corrosion or even much noise though it is dry.

I can just simply say that I am sold on home processed and waxed chains. I like tinkering around with stuff in my shop so I even volunteered to wax some of my friend's new chains for this season, but they were skeptics and stuck with oil.

Just as an update - my waxed but 'old & dirty" chain came out great from the wax bath, and after a thorough wipedown after it cooled with a cotton old rag, it's pretty clean. It's clean enough that I can mess with the chain ad libitum with my bare hands with no chain tattoo, although since I started with a really blackened chain, it still gives off small amounts of debris so my hands aren't totally pristine after rough handling it, but that is 1000x better than the traditional clean-lube chain situation I had where even a millisecond brush on my clothes left an instant nearly-impossible to remove mark. And actually, I think even more of an offender now than my chain is the small black gunk left on my crank & cassette that I couldn't get off completey even with the degreaser. I suspect my chain will actually hit most of those dirty parts and actually 'clean' them the rest of the way, and it'll be an even better situation.

The old wax from my pretty-dirty chain turned brown. I melted it again, and let it sit as a liquid for an hour, but it stayed brown. I'll probably just throw out this block since I only used about 0.5 lbs of a 3lbs bag, but I'm sure I could still reuse this wax with really good results (despite the brown color) - if I take a knife to it, the shards are white, and you rub off nearly all of it on the outer chain anyway, so it doesn't have any blackening effect in terms of cleanliness. It did do a good job of cleaning my chain as a solvent, but I wouldn't say it took a really dirty chain to immaculately clean (I think with some vigorous scrubbing would do the trick, but I didn't have the time or interest to do that.)

Later this week I'm going to do a proper batch with a brand new chain with new wax - that one will obviously turn out really clean. But I have to say, I'm REALLY happy so far with its effect on a dirty chain - took it from a still really messy contact situation even after a concentrated citrus degrease, to clean enough to really manhandle without problem. Really looking forward to losing all the horrid greasemarks, black rags, and bike greasemarks!

Actually one drawback I do have to mention that I found out about after the fact - you do have to be cautious with proper ventilation when melting paraffin. Paraffin is a petroleum product, and the vapors have benzene and other known carcinogens, similar to those in gasoline and kerosene.

It's true that many candles are made of paraffin and thus suffer the same problem when they are melting, but since the slow cooker liquifies a lot more at once, you do have to take care in doing it in a properly vented place. I'll probably try to do mine outside as much as possible and keep the liquid phase state to a minimum so I can minimize the vapor production.

I might do 2 chains at the same time from now on as well to get the batch effect, so I can avoid unnecessary liquification and vapor production of the paraffin.

I was also wondering about the toxicity of paraffin to touch since if the vapors aren't good, the touch may be problematic? but it seem that there are actually paraffin baths and creams with paraffins in them. They probably have less paraffin than what I'm using (not sure about those paraffin baths though - they sell cosmetic paraffin bath machines on Amazon!) but I suspect they're not as bad given that they're added to some skin creams as well as being handled without warning lables as paraffin candles.

It is amazing how hard it is to clean all of the drivetrain. I figured that when I started with the waxed chain that I needed also clean the cassette and chain rings. The chain rings I just did the best I could with a rag and mineral spirits, but the cassette I put through 4 ultrasonic baths with a detergent and a couple stubborn spots I had to use a brush. That little cheap ultrasonic tub has proven to be a good buy as well.

On the SRAM etap rebuild the shop put a new SRAM chain on as it came out of the package. I cleaned and waxed that chain, but that manufacturer grease is like fly paper. When I touched the brand new cassette it was also very sticky from that new chain grease. So I removed it and cleaned it as well.

CORRECTION TO ABOVE POST - chain was removed at 1200 miles.

Well my curiosity got the better of me ... lol

New v old (104 links) levelled with a spoke through the other end, lay flat and gently pulled :



The difference :



So, please check out my maths ... lol

0.5" x 25.4 = 12.7 mm
104 x 12.7 = 1320.8 mm
1.47 / 1320.8 = 0.001112961841308
0.001112961841308 x 100 = 0.11

So, 0.11 % worn ?

Perhaps I need to put more wattage through it ... lol

WD :-)

Paraffin is a petroleum product, and the vapors have benzene and other known carcinogens, similar to those in gasoline and kerosene.


There are no appreciable amounts of benzene in paraffin wax. You should avoid breathing the vapors, but not over concern about benzene.

That "from the factory" stuff is the worst. KMC was/is the worst. Those chains just suck any dirt or grit partical out of the air and adhere it to your nice clean chain and drivetrain. One ride and my drivetrain was a gritty mess. Wax is such an improvement.

Short term update here - I've converted both my bikes to wax-chains. One of them has a brand-new chain that was directly waxed in the slow cooker paraffin, and the other one has a used (but not stretched) chain that was one of those 'blacken anything it touches instantly' chains that was swished in the wax.

I'm still wrenching both of them (waiting for parts) so haven't done more than ride 'em around the block as I've only gotten the brakes working on them so far but wrenching a waxed chain bike is night and day better than a blackening lubed chain.

Before I waxed the chain, I had more than several really blackened t-shirts and towels that I'd use after almost any touch on the bike - it got so bad that I was thankful when I just left the chain off completely as things got a lot better.

After waxing though - that's totally gone! The wax doesn't blacken anything, and even the older chain which still has black marks on it despite the waxing, doesn't leave any chain tattoos even when gripping the chain directly. Things are soooo much cleaner and nicer - I don't have to worry about chaing into dark ratty clothes in case the chain brushes it, and I can jump in and out of the house without having to degrease my hands every time.

The waxing is a piece of cake too - seriously, the hardest part of the whole affair is remounting the master link on the chain, as sometimes they come a little stiff, but I've figured that out now so even that is fast.

I'd seriously recommend waxing the chain if you're sick of those chain tattoos - it's trivially more effort to deal with up front, but saves a lot of time in the mess and cleanup back end. Exactly what I was hoping for.

Besides the whole clean chain deal, is wax a better lube friction wise? Has anyone tried waxing bb bearings? I assume due to the consistency of the wax , it should work without breaking down. I know it doesnt last as long but maybe worth it for the A race? Just curious.

Tl dr but I paraffin wax my chain before races, it takes some time but it's the most efficient lube

Yes. Wax is quite a bit faster than even the best liquid/oil lube. And even faster if you then use a PTFE powder on top of it. A properly waxed and powdered chain can be like 6w faster than a stock chain, and 10-15w faster than something dirty lubed with a crappy (heavy) oil/grease.

Wax for bearings is impractical though; the tolerances are too tight. For bearings, you can shave down the friction by using a super lightweight oil. And, of course, bearing manufacturers can take steps to do the equivalent of "powdering" their bearings by applying special surface treatments to the balls and races themselves.

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Jordan to you use waxed chains on the turbo?
Do you find they need to warm up each time, particularly if turboing in a cold room?

On another note, for those using squirt do you find when there is build up of wax the chain gets really sticky and slow?

Which ultrasonic cleaner did you get and where did you get it from?

I do not get wax build up with Squirt. The excess, if any, flakes off.

Is 'squirt' a roll-on (typical) type wax, or is it a melt-in-slow-cooker and dunk chain kind of wax? Sounds like a lot of folks who wax use Squirt - I shied away from it because I didn't think it was a dunk-chain type wax.

I got a cheap isonic from Amazon back in 2012. Blog report here
It is still on Amazon for $88

It will hold a 11-28 cassette and lay flat in the tub to give an idea of the tub size.

That's odd, mine builds up with this sticky black gunk.
It's on the chain, jockeys etc.
Am I applying too much?

Timely as I re-waxed two chains today (rainy Sunday here). One on the dedicated trainer bike and the tri bike. I don't compete so both are considered training chains. After hundreds of miles on my first ever waxed chains I did hear a little more noise than usual toward the end of the ride yesterday so I figured I was past due waxing. It is easy because I left the MSW wax in the slow cooker from the first time and once it was heated enough to liquefy. I put each chain in for about 15 to 20 minutes each while I was doing other stuff. Drive train on both bike are clean. No build up on the jockey wheels and the cassettes look shiny new.

According to the MSW directions I should be able to reuse this wax a few more times on training chains.

Ok two questions....

How much faster is the Molten Wax vs. paraffin from the hardware store?

and

When you get some black stuff at the bottom of your wax in the crock pot is there a way to skim off the clean wax and then get rid of the dirty wax? Or do you just spend the $.50 and put in all fresh wax now and then?

Oh snap, I'll just try decanting....

Depending on the shape of the bottom of your slow cooker you may well be able to turn the heat on long enough to pop the paraffin cake out whole. You can then turn it upside down and scrape off the polluted stuff with the appropriate sharp edged tool. It's easy to see when you get to clean paraffin.

I'll add some pictures to this post later.

Paraffin cake just popped out with crud on bottom


Part of the crud scraped off



Reasonably clean cake ready for more use



The top cake had been used to lube on the order of 20 times with a good bit of paraffin added over time. This was the first time I decrudded it.

YMMV


Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Yes, I do a very basic wax job for my training chains. typically just dip them and give them a quick wipe down with a paper towel while hot. Do that basically once every 3-4 weeks (500mi, and I basically split time most weeks 50/50 between road bike and tri bike). After I've ridden them one time, they don't seem to be particularly sticky.

I have a bottle of squirt, but I rarely use it because I find that waxing every 500mi is plenty (where I live) for training.

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Thanks!

Has anyone tried wax with a dash of another lube on top?

I ask because I seem to find that drivechain feels much more slippery when I put a tiny dash of triflow on the top of a waxed chain, this is on the neo though.

Adding a wet lube on top in large part defeats one of paraffin's chief advantages, the cleanliness aspect. This winter I ran one paraffined chain ~ 1200 miles between coating on my trainer bike with my Neo and had nary a squeak, squawk or other problem. I do run high velocity fans so there is no sweat that ever hits the chain.

YMMV,

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

I'm not bothered about the cleanliness side of things on the turbo.

The wax doesn't necessarily play well with other lubes. I used the Rolled. Gold on a chain along with a wax-based lube and it was just a gooey mess. I do use the squirt wax on waxed chains though. You are basically adding a liquid wax on top of old wax, so it works quite well.

I know you weren't asking me, but Harbor Freight has them at a very modest price.

Don't take my word for it, I may be applying too little ;-)
I apply it pretty generously to the inside bottom, and just spin it for a while. Then I lightly wipe off the excess - leaving it still pretty saturated but just not dripping.
I also use a paper towel to get the excess off of the jockeys and chain ring. It's still there when I'm done, just not as much.
Then I let it dry before riding.

For subsequent coatings, I just use a clean lint free rag to wipe off as much as I can from the chain, then re-apply, perhaps lighter than the first time.

I did get the black gunk you mention once.
Possible factors: 1) bike that lives on the trainer 90% of its use, 2) brand new KMC chain, 3) chain has "skeleton" side plates where the holes could retain excess wax from the first application, 4) brand new cassette, maybe giving off tiny particles of metal wear?
For whatever reason my commuter and mountain bikes never got like that, only my Tri bike.

Squirt has pretty detailed application instructions on their website - which I am not following exactly.

I've tried a combination of wax lubricants
Squirt with LPS1 Works OK
LPS1 with T9 Boeshield is the best.

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res, non verba

Here's my method... your mileage may vary. I had a chain (lubed with oil) that I took on a gravel ride and it seems like it brought back about half the road. I unhooked the chain and dropped the whole thing into about a cup of clean engine oil. Swished things around until a lot of gunk came off, then wiped and transferred to a second oil bath. Again, 10w30 (I'm not using that in any cars at the moment so it's just sitting anyway). I then got out the Park chain brush and scrubbed out the remaining dirt from the inside of the chain and flexed each link back and forth to ensure the oil got in there and that old lube had a chance to get flexed out. The objective was to get the grunge out of the chain, but to make sure the inside of the chain wasn't loaded with degreaser, which is what happens when you use any of the degreaser solvents.

Then I used an old one-liter tomato can to melt a couple of old candles. I filled a small (2 or 3 quart) sauce pan with water, then put the tomato can, with the candles and chain, in it to make a double boiler. On the stove (the wife is also a cyclist and so this is OK) until the water boils and the wax melts, and the chain submerges in the wax. I swish the chain around to make sure it gets fully coated by the liquid wax. Once about 10 minutes have gone by, I take all that to the garage and pull the chain out, wipe it immediately (before the wax solidifies) and it's clean as a whistle. If there is any oil left in the links and pins, that's all to the good - it's sealed in there by the wax. I let the wax congeal in the can, and I'll re-use it next time until it's too dirty.

Using the boiling water technique ensures that the wax never gets over about 200F, so it's pretty safe as long as you don't spill the wax on yourself.

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Less is more.

Ok, so I have gone through the whole process and waxed up a few chains and I have one installed on the bike. It certainly is a lot cleaner than traditional oil lubes but it is anything but quiet. Granted, I have only turned the pedals with the bike on the workstand for ten minutes and, while there is no squeaking as you'd get from an underlubed chain, there is a lot of chain/cog meshing noise. It is loud. Is this something that will improve with a full hour or so on the bike on the road? If not, I will be back to my old lube pretty swiftly. After a full bike clean and fresh lubing of the chain, I used to not even hear my chain for a few rides.

A waxed chain is a bit louder than a freshly oiled chain but so what. Being perfectly silent does not mean less friction. Riding outdoors the extra noise won't bother you at unless you suffer from significant OCD.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Offhand I don't recall it being all that noisy to start with, on the stand.The amount of noise does vary a lot depending on how much cross-chaining there is for a given chainring/cog combination. On the road or on the trainer it's essentially noiseless.

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Less is more.

OP here - FWIW, I agree that the waxed chain is actually louder and more mechanical sounding than a well lubed oil chain up on the stand.

I honestly don't notice it on the road though - the buzz from my powermeter hub while coasting is MUCH louder than any chain noise. I only notice the extra noise when I've got the bike up on the stand, but yes, while it's up on the stand, it does sound louder to me than the oiled chain - my first instinct was to think "I gotta oil this chain!" and then remembered it was waxed and done.

On the road though, I've never once thought 'wow, my chain is noisy!" since I've waxed it - it sounds perfectly fine, albeit not dead-quiet. And although it still picks up small gritty road debris specks after rides, there is no chain tattoo for sure, and you can grab the chain outright with your hand pretty hard, and only have small light specks of the blackened wax which rub off between your hands really easy. No tenacious black grime that needs degreaser to remove. That's been the biggest and best change for me.

I won't reveal the numerical secrets of paid Friction Facts results, but I will say that I only use my homemade wax brew (with PTFE and MoS2) for the most "A" of "A" races. Straight wax for everything else.

But the #'s are in the Friction Facts report of straight wax vs. wax with additives.

Meh-- I don't doubt it works, but it's just too much time and fuss for me. I'm time crunched as it is just to fit my training in, let alone fussing with a bike. My chains typically are installed once and don't come off the bike until they are replaced-- just an occasional wipe down, some drops of oil, and another wipe. I just use the $18 variety KMC chains or whatever I can source cheaply, and change out a little early.

louder at first, gone within 30 minutes. here's proof of how good this stuff is - 110 miles of gravel grinder racing this weekend. Drive train looks almost perfect.

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Yeah, I was that way in my pre-bike maintenance days (years).

Now that I'm into maintaining my bike in excellent condition after learning the hard way what 5+ years of low maintenance can do to it, I'm finding that waxing the chain is faster than lubing it - if you do the correct method of clean & lube, you're talking bike chain cleaning followed by careful link by link application of lube. The wax chain is literally dip the chain in the melted wax, wipe off, and mount. Don't even have to clean the chain before dunking it since waxed chains stay so clean.

If I weren't working on my bikes now it wouldn't be as big a deal, but now that I am, it's a huge deal for me.

Ok, so I put two hours on the bike this morning after re-waxing a chain last night. I had a closer look at the MSW site and it seems I err'ed in wiping down the chains lightly when they came out of the wax bath. So I didn't do that this time and simply hung the chain to drip dry.

Well, I can say that it's 'one and done' for me. The noise did diminish compared to my initial waxing but the whole ride it felt like my drivetrain was gunked up and the shifting was anything but crisp. I took a look when I got home and the derr pulleys were coated with waxy gunk and the chain was covered in globs of it with a good bit that had flaked off stuck to my chain stay.

Well, that experiment is done. I fully stripped the chains I had waxed in an OMS bath and then put them through the ultrasonic cleaner with more OMS and I will be reverting to the NFS lube I was using that, while not as clean to the touch as was, is a heck of a lot quieter and better running. I'll put up with a five second wipe down of the chain after each ride to keep things clean.

I suppose that's where the YMMV comes into play.

My experience so far has been quieter than oil lubed chains from what I can discern and there has been no build up of wax on the drive train. When I pull the chains out of the hot wax I don't wipe them and hang them on a nail to cool. After they have cooled for a while I sit and break the links loose before I put the chain back on the bike. Although I really don't need to do this it is kind of addicting like popping bubble wrap. There is a very slight amount of wax that comes off the chain while breaking the links loose.

I had over 800 miles on my first waxed chain this year before it really started to make much noise.
I am not doubting your experience. I am just saying it looks like many of us are having different experiences with this process. While reading the different methods in these posts I kind of understand why there are different experiences.

You described exactly what I did.

My guess is that you were either too close to the melt temperature when you took the chain out, or your chain wasn't clean before you waxed it. The chain should be slick and clean after it's cooled. If there are globs of wax, that isn't good IMO. My wax is ~200F, and I do wipe it with a paper towel in addition.

I didn't see anyone mention this, but I rotate 3 chains, so they all get waxed in the same session about once a month. Chains, cassette, and rings get replaced together.

Someone mentioned paraffin oil. That's sounds potentially interesting but I've never heard of using that.

I pretty much followed MSW's directions to the letter. I started with brand new chains and put them through two baths with OMS (one in an US cleaner) and two rinses with de-natured alcohol. They were clean and completely free of anything that would contaminate the wax. As for temperature, I heated the wax up to 195-200F as per my candy thermometer and swished the chain around in that for about a minute before pulling it and hanging it to drip.

I'll also add YMMV, but I definitely would say that in my use as a recent lube to wax convert, the wax chain is wayyyy cleaner than the lubed chain in both short and long run. Sure, you get a few wax flakes here and there, but if you're avoiding the big wax globs on the outer chain after it cools in the wax, it shouldn't gunk anything up - I did worry about my sprockets and gears getting gunked in wax but it has never happened.

But if you prefer the lube to the wax, there's nothing wrong with that! Good on you that you at least tried the wax; as mentioned, it was the incessant chain tattoos that read killed the lubes for me - I had no issues with ride quality with the lubes I used compared to wax, and it was slightly faster to quickly lube a chain (sloppily) although as I mentioned, if I'm actually including time to clean a dirty chain before properly lubing it, waxing is def faster.

So the gunk is just wax? Fairly clean? Did you clean the rest of your drivetrain prior? When you wiped it earlier, what were the results?

There shouldn't be any YMMV at this point.

A minute would really too short a time to heat the chain enough for the paraffin to capillary all the way into the links. I heat to 220*F in order to drive any water out of the chain and make the paraffin less viscus. I also wipe the hot chain down with paper towel as I pull it from the pot.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

I swished for a minute. The chain sat in the wax as it heated up from a solid state to 200F and that took about an hour and a quarter. As I said, I followed the MSW instructions to the letter and even had a chat with someone at MSW and refined my technique after that.

The whole bike was spotless. The cassette was taken off and got the same treatment as the new chains - two OMS baths and two alcohol baths. The chainrings and derr pulleys were cleaned with OMS and alcohol on the bike and then again with soap and water as part of washing the whole bike.

Did the chain have visible chunks of wax on it? That needs to be remedied one way or another. 200F is hot enough, and a few wipes with a paper towel should do the trick. I pull the chain out, let the wax run out for a couple seconds til it slows to a drip, then wipe.

FWIW I've read elsewhere that putting a cold chain into hot wax can potentially lead to wax solidifying on the outside of the chain preventing it properly penetrating the links. I appreciate that you allowed both to warm up together but might have some impact?

Since I've been waxing my chains rather than lubing I've essentially followed the MSW instructions aside from putting the chain in an oven already on the swisher tool at 100C to make sure it is at a higher temperature than the wax before immersing it. I've then left if in the wax for at least 30 mins agitating it occasionally before hanging to cool.

I'm thinking of making the switch to waxed chains. What quick link are you guys using? Are you reusing it?

Straight paraffin or a mixture? The friction facts formula seems to be publicly available and other than the up front cost isn't all that expensive. (About $60 for everything to make ten 1# batches of wax.) On the other hand the improvement over straight paraffin is pretty small (I have the FF reports)

Just did my first waxed chain batch two days ago and raced with one yesterday.
I'm have been using and reusing a normal KMC 10-speed missing link with my 11-speed Shimano chain no problem.

I added some MoS2 oil additive (MoS2 in mineral oil) to the paraffin. It did turn the molten wax dark gray but the waxed chain is clean / whitish. Obviously I don't know whether the moly had any effect but I felt really pro applying it!

As of yesterday I'm a wax chain guy on my TT and road bike. I've been acquiring the parts over the last couple of weeks and finally had a couple hours to go through the initial process.

- Ultrasonic cleaner from Harbor Freight: cleans chains and cassettes really well!
- 2L Crock-pot from Target: Good size for dipping a chain or two
- 1lb. Molten Speed Wax : Not super expensive and has a DTFE/Molybednum mixed in already

In terms of time, it took me a while but I was un-boxing everything.

Ran both chains through the Ultrasonic a few times with some Simple Green mixed in the water. It was a great investment, I can see that already.

After both chains were dried, I put them in the Crock-pot one at a time, swirled them and let the sit for a few minutes. I flipped them over for good measure.

Hung them on a nail in my shop area with a towel underneath to catch the couple of residual drips. A pair of pliers are nice here... that chain gets HOT.

Let them dry and them flexed them a little since they get super stiff after they cool, reinstalled the chains and I'm impressed. Clean and the chains spun very nice on the work stand.

Will be picking up some PTFE powder to brush on my "race chain".

All in all I'm happy and thinking subsequent waxing will be less time since I've figured out how I'll be doing it.

If using Simple green to degrease make absolutely sure it is rinsed very well and no residue remains.
Do not leave chains soaking overnight in it.

This degreaser and those of similar alkline composition can cause hydrogen enbrittlement if these precautions are not followed and you risk chain breakage.

You might actually never use your ultrasonic cleaner for your chain after you go paraffin. It self-cleans!

I don't have anything but a general parts washer and a saucepan with a lid on my stove.
I do use an old gatorade tub with some clean degreaser in it to shake the last oil out of it before washing and waxing.

Re waxing consists of wash in reasonably hot tap water, dry in sun, into the pot.

so after i simple green my chain in the ultrasonic cleanser, i have to rinse it with water and let it dry? i generally just wipe down a bunch, let hang dry for 30 mins. then put in hot wax for 30 mins to allow full penetration of the wax...

Alcohol will probably absorb the water in between the links. You probably dont want to leave water in a chain to dry because of rust and it could interfere with the wax working its way between the links.

Unless the act of waxing the chain happens to boil off the simple green, then yes, you certainly need to thoroughly rinse it, as you should do with all degreasers as they are designed to break down and loosen oils and the last thing you want to leave on your chain is something that will compromise the lubrication.
The cleaner the chain the better the adhesion of the wax to all surfaces.
If you cannot put it in your mouth then the chain is not clean enough to wax.

Heh heh. I think you're probably right from a theoretical perspective, but for the typical rider that's perfectly happy with a waxed chain that'll run problem free for several weeks, I doubt you need the super-detailed chain preparation that is mentioned here and elsewhere.

I'll bet that with even if you start with a fugly dirty lubed chain, do nothing but run paper towels briefly on the outside to get off the huge pieces of grit, and do no degreasing, you can just swish that chain in your melted paraffin a little extra and still get an excellently waxed chain that'll hold up to well to even the most stringently prepped waxed chains.

I did just that before - stuck in a blackened regular-lubed chain right into a pot of melted paraffin, no cleaning, no degreasing, just to see what would happen by relying on paraffin as the solvent. Swished it around not too much, and pulled it out. It turned the paraffin brown-black, but the chain worked absolutely great - after 10 minutes of riding, it's super clean after it expels all the extra hardened loose wax bits.

Anyone use WEND wax? Thoughts on it for saving time on having to melt down wax

 
Just a note to those using de-natured alcohol: remember it contains methanol which is quite toxic.

Do yourself a favor: spend an extra $10 and buy Everclear (pure ethanol) instead.

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Disagree. Compared to petroleum solvents, denatured alcohol is not particularly toxic unless ingested in quantity. And the extra expense of Everclear is a needless expense.

Facts:
1) the reference dose for methanol is 2 mg/kg/d; far higher than reference doses for e. g. benzene and toluene potentially found in petroleum solvents;
2) methanol administered in conjunction with ethanol (like denatured alcohol) is far less toxic as the ethanol is preferentially used by the metabolic pathway (ADH); this is why administration of ethanol is a standard treatment for methanol poisoning;
3) methanol is naturally occurring, is not a carcinogen, and in small quantities is metabolized by the body adequately and without harm or chronic effects.

That said, we should all use protective gloves and eyewear when using any solvent, and avoid inhalation of vapors.

Sounds awesome... I live in a house of ladies and they're excited about cleaning their jewelry... so not a total loss.

Plus there maybe an occasional carb or "something" I've painstakingly scrubbed and brushed in the past that I'll just now drop in the Ultrasonic.

Good tip on the Simple Green, I did rinse the chains afterwards, but I'll be more thorough if I go that route again.

Not even overnight. I made the mistake of putting a set of Red brake calipers in a bucket of Simple Green + water for just an hour or so while I was cleaning other stuff, and it took the finish off

(what do you you use for your degreaser?)

If using degresser, Simple Green Aluminum is a safer alternative.

https://www.amazon.com/...cision/dp/B001VXU7OE

With that said, for a chain mineral spirits and denatured alcohol are better for chains.

Best degreaser I have found is from Morgan Blue, pretty expensive though.
The cheapy stuff I have in my parts cleaner is no where near as effective and will certainly wreck finishes if left in for any amount of time.

Wow, you guys are just discovering paraffin for chains? I used to use it on my Stingray bike in 1974! Here's a tip for cleaning chains. Use hexane. Hexane is the active ingredient in many OTC brake cleaners. Just check the ingredients. If you need to lube in the field, try Hornady's One Shot Tap HD gun cleaner. It's paraffin dissolved in a hexane base. The hexane dissolves the grime and it leaves a coating of paraffin on the metal. if it's good enough for my semi-auto shotgun, it's got to be good enough for your bicycles. : )

thanks for the tip.

i was wondering why after simple green, a bunch of wipes and soaking in paraffin for 2-3 hours that my chain only lasts about 150 miles and i feel it's starting to make some noise. perhaps the leftover simple green is keeping the wax from really getting in there.

i cleaned my chain, soaked it in paraffin for 2 hours, rode 100 miles and though it's really clean, towards the end of the ride i felt it didn't sound as smooth as it did early on. i put some squirt lube on it for tomorrow's 100 miler.

john

John,

I spent a whole late fall, winter and early spring riding a paraffin waxed chain, power meter equipped bike on my Tacx Neo trainer. When I first set the unit up, the Neo and my Power2max read within ~ 1 watt of each other when producing 200 watts and I was thrilled by their agreement. Then over the weeks of use there was a slow shift in the two units reading. I took that as some sort of drift in one or both of the meters and was somewhat disappointed in the situation. Eventually after riding that chain well over 1000 miles there was ~ 4 watts difference in power reading between the Neo and Power2max. Long story short after rewaxing the chain the two meters were back with ~ 1 watt again. So what I'd been seeing rather than power meter drift was decreased lubrication. This next winter season I'll take the time to track the change. My recollection is that the two meters read very close for the first 300 to 400 miles. Waxed chains are definitely especially quite the first 50 miles or so but I believe even though they get louder they're still well lubricated for another 300 miles or so. The Squirt certainly won't hurt though especially if it eases your mind.

YMMV,

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

hugh,

as always, you provide great info. thanks for that. now i'll know that i'm not crazy and i can let it go a few weekends before i keep cleaning it.

i have a question though. if i have a brand new chain, is it best to run it through simple green and ultrasonic for a few mins. wipe it dry, then use denatured alcohol to rinse it (then wipe it), let it dry, then wax it?

i generally heat the wax on high, then put it down to keep warm and put the chain in, is it best to use low/high vs keep warm?

john

Finally took the plunge and cooked my chain in a small Walmart slow cooker today. I used one pound of Parowax mixed with one cup of paraffin candle oil initially. However, the wax was still hard and brittle when cooled down to room temperature, so I added another 1/4 cup of paraffin oil to the mix. I still don't think I have the consistency correct as the wax now scrapes off the chain easily. How much paraffin oil is everyone using?

Zero paraffin oil, zip, nadda. You don't want a sticky mess. You're trying to get away from a sticky mess.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

I re-waxed the chain on the tri bike Friday evening and I think this is the third time this chain has been dipped into hot wax. With going by the thorough initial cleaning of a new chain in several mineral spirit baths and a couple denatured alcohol baths before waxing the first waxing lasted almost 1,000 miles. The second waxing last much less and probably because I had a few wet rides. This third re-waxing I wiped off any grit but that was all that I did before putting it into the hot wax for about 30 minutes. (note to self to order more quick links) Saturday and Sunday's ride were nice to have a quiet chain again. I have not really tracked wattage on the chains.

I hope to at least start keeping track of training time and/or miles for each bike chain.

I have to say that I am still happy with the result of a continual clean drive train and the chain feels just as smooth to me as an oiled chain. I dropped the chain once on Saturday's ride and not even the slightest black on my finger. I have friends that look at my bike and ask if I just cleaned the drive train, but the bike they have seen has over 500 miles in wet and dry conditions and it looks like it was just detailed.

Edit: my point from the ramblings above was that it appeared the initial treatment of the new chains with the thorough steps, such as from Molten Speed Wax directions, seems to have given me the most miles and I am getting less miles out of re-waxing. However, it is still a super simple process to re-wax even it I do get just a few hundred miles out of it.

Just as a general question to put out there, has anyone been using waxed chains for long enough to comment on chain life of a waxed chain vs oiled?

I've noticed huge differences in the time (or miles) it takes for a chain reach 0.5% stretch with a chain that is regularly cleaned vs a neglected one.

I'm still on the fence as to whether to give waxing a try, but the relatively short "lube-life" of a chain waxing makes me wonder whether I'm going to start wearing through chains more quickly.

For chain life I am new to waxing starting this year so I am curious as to how it will play out. I was thinking about it this weekend how any of us could make this comparison. I suppose we can only compare to ourselves since we have variable route conditions and torque applied? Meaning that I am currently recovering from a crash and torn PCL so I am not putting much torque on my chains and I am using fairly flat routes in this recovery. Others may be putting a lot of torque on the pedals with training intensity and route conditions.

Curious to see if anyone is keeping track of this as well.

Sure, it'd be difficult to pin definitive numbers on something like that, but just wondering if anyone has any stark anecdotal observations such as going from 6 months per chain down to 2 months.

I'm keen to give it a try, but I think I'll save it as a winter fettling project.

Hmm, I was following this video: https://www.youtube.com/...=4&v=gF9nbwsaSHs

According to the author (starting at 3:28 in the vid), paraffin wax by itself is a bit too hard and will just flake off in shards. You would need to soften it up a bit by using paraffin oil.

Many thousands of miles on the chains for 4 different bikes tell me that plain paraffin is just fine and doesn't flake off. I actually wipe down the hot chain to remove the bulk of the residual paraffin as I pull it from my hot pot so there's only a very thin layer on the outer plates.

YMMV,

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

That's weird. I've been using simple green as a degreaser for awhile now and never had a problem. I'll let my chains sit in it over night if I'm doing the waxing treatment.

Have I just been lucky?

It can take longer than overnight to take off a finish depending on what kind of finish and coating is additionally protecting it. However, it's def true - be careful with leaving Simple Green on metal parts - I've had some aluminum chainrings with some sort of alu-alloy coating corrode over time; at first I thought it was normal sweat-related corrosion, but turns out its' much more likely to be from simple green, as it even worsened significantly when I WASN'T riding the bike over a few months due to the combo of residual Simplegreen + humidity. Lesson learned.

As stated above, you don't need to soften it, although it is possible that softening it may make it stick to the chain (but also attract dirt) a bit better.

I've been using 100% block paraffin without oil no problem, and it runs super clean. But I do re-wax my chain every 3-4 weeks of riding just to be sure; I don't try and push my limits with it, as I know its not as tenacious as those wet weather lubes.

Okay, will try 100% paraffin blocks next time. Regarding the brands, any differences between Parowax and Gulf Wax? Do you have a preference for one over the other?

Getting ready to to switch to waxed chains and the one question I have is with the clean drive trains do you lube jockey wheels separately or leave then alone. Never did anything with them because I figure chain lube was enough.

Chain lube is enough

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Good question.
I forgot to clean off the jockey wheels on one of my bikes and was surprised how much dirty oil transferred to the new waxed chain. The other two bikes I dampened a rag with mineral spirits and cleaned off the old caked on dirty mess from the teeth. I did not add anything to the jockey wheels once cleaned. One of the bikes has anodized alloy wheels and it still sounds and runs smooth.

To continue with the gun analogy....gun owners will sometimes wash guns with hot, soapy water alone. Then they'll pour some boiling water through them to accelerate the drying process. Lube when dry. Simply Green can strip the finish off of a gun. It depends on the type of finish, the quality of that finish, and how long is it left on before rinsing. No need to use Simply Green. Hot soapy water will suffice.

So I gave this a try at the weekend, just used straight up paraffin wax, no additives, with reasonably successful results.

I was following the Molten Speed Wax instructions so deliberately didn't wipe down the chain after removing from the wax, just hung it up to cool and dry. The results was a chain coated rather heavily on the outer links with unnecessary dried-on wax. I'm running a KMC X11-EL chain that has cutouts in the outer and inner plates and all of these were clogged up with wax too.

I've been on a couple of quick 20 mile rides since and some of it has flaked off (making a bit of a mess on my nice clean cassette, chainrings and jockey wheels in the process) but it still seems like a wipe-down would be beneficial after the waxing. What do you guys do?

Should I wipe down the chain when it comes out of the molten wax?

As I pull the chain up out of the wax pot I pull it through a paper towel once if not twice taking off the majority of the excess wax. I also heat the wax above 212*F so it has an extremely low viscosity. It seems to work for me, my wife and the gal we train. I'm not sure why one would want the excess.

YMMV,

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Yeah, I guess one possible issue is the wiping down drawing some of the molten wax out from inside the rollers; could reduce the lifespan of the treatment? For sure, taking it out and just leaving it to cool will leave maximum wax on/inside the chain, but it does seem to create a lot of mess.

Do as sciguy said - just wipe it down with a paper towel while it's still hot/wet.

Even with your heavy paraffin coating, it'll still self-clean though - give it more miles and the extra stuff will flake off even more. That wax 'mess' you show is still a ton cleaner than any traditional lube that blackens quickly after outdoor riding!

My feeling is that the capillary forces keep the spaces between the pins, bushings and plates filled with wax and that the wiping just removes excess from the outer surfaces of the plates that don't need it.

YMMV,

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

Many thanks for the replies, I'll definitely give wiping it down a try next time then.

Next question, do any of you bother with adding PTFE and MoS2 to the paraffin? I've read that the frictional losses are only slightly lower than paraffin alone, but again I'm wondering if it might help improve the longevity of the treatment?

I purchased both PTFE and MoS2 when I started this path and used the PTFE for the first batch but haven't used it since. I can't imagine it would make make the wax stick better. The Moly is so dark I'd worry it might mask the paraffin getting polluted with road grime. At this point I pop the wax puck out and scrape off the bottom layer every 3rd or forth waxing. You'll see a thin dark layer at the bottom that must have some grit in it.

Hugh

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Genetics load the gun, lifestyle pulls the trigger.

I am not sure if this is worthy of a post. Yesterday was cold and rainy in my area so before I jumped on the trainer I spent a little time with re-waxing the chain on the road bike. In January I went through the extensive cleaning with a new chain and wax treatment. That initial treatment really adhered to the metal and lasted for about 500 miles even with one or two rides in the rain before it became a bit noisy.

The second was a re-wax and I did not really do much other than just wipe off the exterior surface with a towel. Barely anything came off on the towel which was the testament to one of the bonuses of chain waxing - cleaner hands when handling. Plus, the cassette, chain rings and pulley wheels were all still very clean looking. However, this second re-wax seemed to only last about 300 miles before it became noisy. Performance wise I really couldn't tell much other than the noise and even the noise wasn't that bad.

So yesterday I wondered what would happen if I did a little more extensive cleaning again. Would it adhere to the metal as good as the first round? When I removed the chain I ran my finger over the chain and was very happy that very little came off on my hands. What I wanted to know is what would happen if I used boiling hot water in an ultrasonic tub with just a little dish detergent. Thinking since the only lube on the chain so far is wax the boiling water would soften and potentially remove the wax from the metal and allow new wax to bond to the surface. After two extensive runs in the tub I felt as if enough dirt and grit was removed. I will have to see how well it will stick for the next several hundred, winter weather, miles. To be determined.


Before cleaning the chain very little came off on my hand.



Two ultrasonic baths with boiling hot water and dish detergent. I was amazed how much filth was coming out of the links. Is it any wonder that the re-wax did not last as many miles as the first extensive cleaning with a new chain?



Water was starting to look cleaner during the wash.



I have two Premier Optimized chains (road and tri bikes) and the Premier Ultra Glide lube, but I plan to wait until I get past the winter wet months to use those in spring 2018.

Other weird things I did on a rainy Sunday was to Plasti Dip Co2 cartridges as an experiment. I thought I would give it a try and see. Just takes a few seconds to dip them into the paint can and then let them dry. I use dual cartridge bracket on the BTS bottle cage mount and they stick out like a sore thumb. Now they will have a nice black rubber coating that may also give a nice buffer if I have to use them and the metal turns frosty cold. At least they look nice. :-)

Is everyone with 11 speed components just breaking their chain and using a new pin or quick connect each time (since 11 speed quick connects are technically not reusable)? I know some people have cleaned and reapplied with the chain still on the bike, and...that just seems like a PIA but admittedly a new quick connect each time is pretty annoying.

That's exactly what I do. Who said quick connects are not reusable? There is a whole tool just to take them off and put them back on. I've been taking mine on and off for years without issue. I toss the quick connect when I toss the chain.

I mean, I know the "official" stance is they are not reusable but that's what everyone does. Even the molten speed wax folks have that as part of their instructions

I've reused KMC quick links and SRAM, but as you mention they are specified to be single use. The YBN links used by Molten Speed Wax are specified to allow up to something like 5 reuses. The easiest option is the Wipperman Connex link that allows removal without tools.

Wipperman connex is reusable

so are ybn

KMC also makes the M/L-11R which is supposed to be reusable (designated by the R).

Thanks for posting this.

They're also referred to as CL555R (again R for reusable) in line with the naming convention across their ranges, and engraved as such on them. However an internet-search for "CL555R" doesn't produce anything for me, it's only when I searched using the term "M/L-11R" that it comes up with some hits from UK retailers.

I don't know if these are new out, but I looked high-and-low earlier in the year and came up with nothing so I've just been reusing my (ostensibly non-reusable) CL555 and in fact, I did notice it was a lot looser last time I refitted it (maybe the 5th time or so now). I've just picked a couple of these up though; no obvious differences but I'll be glad to switch to something that is actually rated as reusable.

...manufacturers of 11 speed quick connects? Sure, you can do whatever you want, but to blindly ignore a manufacturers recommendation on a part that could fail catastrophically...and costs a few dollars...is pretty silly. Anwyays, glad to see some reusable variants popping back up.

Yeah, I hear what you're saying. Though I've had the SRAM And the KMC links next to each other and they are basically identical. Been reusing SRAM ones for awhile, and even the LBS said they all do the same thing.

So a calculated risk, but I personally don't think it's much of one. I'll buy officially reusable ones once I burn though all my SRAMS though (I have a pile of them)

Indeed. Universal guidelines from third-parties are completely irrelevant. At the end of the day, 9- and 10-speed quick links have been widely rated as reusable for as long as I can remember and I'm sure manufacturers would have said the same about their 11-speed variants if they were confident in them being so.

You can risk it (and I have) but as I noted above my n=1 experience is that I've definitely noticed some loosening off of my "non-reusable" KMC one after a few refittings, which I never noticed in years of reusing the "certified-reusable" 10-speed ones.

I'm glad there that are some now available that the manufacturer's are confident in stating are reusable; I'm not sure what the difference is (perhaps manufactured from a more durable material?) but for me it's worth the £5 for peace-of-mind.

Did you order these from an online shop? I can't seem to find any..
Thx

Yep, here:

https://www.evanscycles.com/...inks-2-pack-EV312173

Despite the stock picture showing a link with CL555 on it, these are definitely the CL555R reusable ones; the two "Ask A Question" things at the bottom, state as much if you don't want to take my word for it!

They're a UK retailer, so not sure if it's the best option for you (presumably in Canada, given your name?!) but you could try sticking "KMC M/L-11R", "KMC CL555R" or even the product barcode number on my photo into Google and see if it throws up any local options?

Thx!

You can also get them directly from KMC (Although it is a 6 pack)

http://store.kmcchain.us/...nk-11r-reusable?pp=8