Changing my intervals from short (400/800m) up to 1 mile, building up to 8 to 10 a couple of weeks out from the race.

Went from 1.40 something to low 1.20s. Horrendous when you're in the middle of a set, but such good results.

I went from doing typical 3x per week run training, to include a long run, to running 4-5x per week with mostly medium and long runs.

For me a medium training run for 70.3 purposes is 6-8 miles, and a long is 9-11 miles.

Couldn't give two shits about pacing. Almost all my runs were done at Z1/Z2.

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I started running slower in training which allowed me to run more week and week out. Mostly slow/easy pace (8 min/mile) with 1-2 run's with some tempo work in there at goal pace or slightly above.

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blog

Curious what the pacing and rest is for these intervals. 10k or open HM pace? 1/4 mile jog recoveries?

I have yet to have what I'd call a good 70.3 run based on what I feel I should be able to run. I'm around 8 min difference between my open half times and my 70.3 runs - goal for the season is to try getting that down to a 5-6 min difference.

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Mine are done at around threshold pace, according to Jack Daniels run calculator, rest is 90 seconds static.

If you're not fading in last one up the pace, and build up from 2 of 3 to start with, as your condition and fitness improves, you should find it easier to add an extra interval.

Used Daniels Marathon A, 24 week plan (just about verbatim) at 35 to 45 miles per week. I took 5 minutes off a good HIM run and was only 2 min slower than my open Half PB.

I went into the plan in good shape, it's not a couch to marathon plan. I had been running 35 -45 miles per week for at least 16 weeks before that as well.

Start with the differential between your stand-alone 1/2 marathon and what your run split is in a 70.3. What is that time difference.

This will reveal certain things, and give you some stuff to focus on.

A common mistake with triathletes and running is always looking too long in both training and racing performance for running. I know this is hard to believe for many, but 5k run performance is the ground foundation for ALL running performance at longer distances. Improve your 5K race times, and all-things-considered, ALL race performances at longer distances, should be faster. But few triathletes seem to understand this, or practice and refine this.

It's why there is ALWAYS great opportunities on the run in big and competitive triathlons of all distances - few are actually running really well. Even small percentages of gains in triathlon run race speed, can yield BIG improvments in place performance!

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Fleck-

I agree with you. But what type of workouts would you use to get your 5k speed higher?

What I say here depends on what your run raining and performance are like now.

The bad news is that many triathletes have a very weak true running base fitness. The good news is the solution, depending on back ground is very easy - run a bit more, but run a bit more in the RIGHT way.

For most that means doing a block of training where you run almost every day of the week, utilizing what around here is commonly referred to as the BarryP formula, although, I have been a big advocate for this as well for a long time.

If you do have that classic weak running base. If you follow the higher frequency formula of running 5 - 7 days/week for a couple of months, the right way, and then taper, for a week, almost everyone that does this, records a 5k or 10K PB at the end of it. They'e done no fancy training. No higher level interval workouts - they have just got out and got in a run of at least 20 minutes almost every day of the week. Some runs a are a little faster, some a little slower. Just run based on feel. Run hard enough that you will be able to run the next day, and the next day and the . . . . you get the picture.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

Ok for those with a good run base?

Losing weight.

Ok for those with a good run base?

Possibly.

Many/Most triathletes grossly underestimate their run fitness.

So, I'm making a generalization here, but most would benefit from this.

The questions are, where are you know, and where do you want to go? No matter where you are, you can always make the run base deeper and broader, which is never a bad thing.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

1. Learning to pace correctly on the bike

2. Training for a 140.6. My 70.3 PR came 6-8 weeks prior to my IM. I had done bricks as long as 70+15 at that point.

Here are my thoughts.

First, you have to stay healthy all the time.

As posted, unless one is, and stays are REAL race weight, one really is not serious!!! How many fast runners are not at real running race weight!
If you do not look like a stick, well.

Does one run 12 months a year?

Running hills for strength 3 days a week all year long I believe is big.

Running bricks right off of my bike onto the treadmill has helped.

Yep, I still believe in using my powercranks, and the bionic runner has not hurt me either.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I ran 2502 miles last year so not sure if this counts as a deep base or not. I have time to bump this mileage up but any benefit to running 60mpw vs 50mpw when its mostly just base running?

How long have been averaging 50 mpw of running? I would say that for most triathletes, if you have done that for a whole year, then I would say you already have a pretty decent base of running.

How old are you and what sort of times are you recording for stand-alone races 5k/10K/half-marathon? What is your best 70.3 half marathon run split?

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

First question should be what is his BMI

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

Unless you've done some accurate testing, basic BMI #'s can be way off. Look at a guy like Chris Solinsky - built much differently than the average runner, and his BMI is probably not that of the typical runner, but an amazing runner. It's not a be-all, end-all. Race performances can tell a lot as well.

I have to also echo what's pretty much been said by several folks - consistency is the number one determinant for running success in longer distance events. 5, 6, 7 days a week of running over years will give you 90% of what gets you there. The speedwork and long runs become the icing on the cake.

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running more, biking 90km slightly easier and smarterer

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I've been in the 45-50mpw for a few years. I'm 39 but I haven't ran a open running race in a long time. My PBs was 3 years ago....2:57 marathon, 1:23 HM, 17:55 5K. However, my PB's in HIM and IM came this year....1:30 run in HIM, and 3:30 marathon.

I don't really look at BMI but I have some weight to lose. Last year I raced around 185-187lbs at 6'2". I'm pretty lean muscle wise though.

Never said it was the end all. But most folks are just too heavy, or do you disagree?

Basics to get better. Consistency, frequency, duration, in that order

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I am 6'5", 160 lbs.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

My BMI is 24 - 24.5 - does that mean im screwed?

And Matt Russell is 5'11" and 170lbs. He's one of the best triathletes out there. Weight doesn't tell the whole picture.

One of the biggest problems is most triathletes don't run 5-6-7x per week. Instead they run 2-3 maybe 4 times per week if they get lucky.
it's going to be hard making significant gains doing that.

Ironically I redid & reposted a blog post on this last night with results from a former co-worker of mine: http://accelerate3.com/...re-not-the-solution/

fwiw my "key" workout is done ~ 3-4x per week. It's a 7 - 8.5 mile aerobic run. I run fast 1x week and run long 1x week. The long run is also aerobic.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I ran. A lot. Every day, even if just 15min off a bike. Lots of short fartleks, a long run and a weekly build run.
Best run at half distance is 1:27.

I know the common wisdom is "pace the bike", but I found that pushing the pace on the bike never affected my run much.

Yep, you can always find exceptions. I guess I will look for a heavy elite running the marathon.

Point is MOST folks are over weight, period.

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

So whats better:
Athlete A: 60mpw running mostly easy with a few aerobic runs (faster than IM pace but slower than marathon pace)
Athlete B: 50mpw running mostly easy with a fast/track workout.

In the beginning of the season probably A. Once racing season begins probably B.

That being said, so many variables though that are not taken into account.

Just by manipulating frequency, duration, intensity & volume I can make a 35 mile week harder and harder to recover from than a 60 mile week. Add in the S/B and it's easy, if not easier, to create an awesome disaster than a masterpiece.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
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This says it better: http://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=4081636#p4081636

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

I followed BarryP and Desert Dude's recommendations - listen to them. 6 years ago I was 28 and ran a 1:42 half marathon (always a swimmer, never ran before). Followed some cookie cutter 3-4x per week programs for next 3 years, only progressed to 1:33. 3 years ago started running 6x per week following BarryP and dropped to 1:23 HM and 1:28 HIM run at 33. No hard runs in training, ever. All training is around 8 min/mile, almost 2 minutes slower than HM pace. 40-45 mpw for HIM training.

I am 6'2" 180 btw

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Strava

i'm not sure how you guys are managing to run 60 mpw (8/9 hours) and still find time for riding, swimming plus work, family etc.

+1!

That is, unless I get to log miles for chasing my kids all day, in which case I believe 60mpw is conservtive! ;)(pink?!)

I log about 3000 steps when at work from 8 - 4, but then I log around 7000 steps from 4.30 - 7.30 chasing the kids around getting them ready for bed etc! So yeah I might start including those!

I switched from hilly 1/2's (Rev3 & Toughman) to a really flat one (Florida). Man did I get faster......

My 30mile weeks must be a bit soft then!

I had my best running gains when I was running 6x a week. But that was when I wasn't swimming and I was only ridding twice a week. Now I'm struggling to figure how to logistically fit 5 runs alongside of 4 rides and 3 swims. I'd be interested in seeing how others schedule this balance.

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Matt

Being retired helps :)

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Dave Campbell | Facebook | @DaveECampbell | h2ofun@h2ofun.net

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Lions don't lose sleep worrying about the sheep

I think it comes down to what your strengths are and what discipline you can sacrifice a little. I'm a shit runner (1.42 for HIM) so am focusing more on that and riding/swimming less as I'm a bit stronger on those legs (2.29/27). The 2.29 was done on 1 x 50km shop ride a week. I find that if I work hard on my run, I can bike as little as once a week and don't lose much (any?) bike fitness. I've got a bit of a swimming background so can just swim once a week if I need to. There do seem to be a few people that have a heavy emphasis on running and not the other two disciplines, especially swimming and really struggle to get near the podium. Can't swim, won't swim...

Having any luck with volume increase? Seems my 30miles/50k weeks are lame around these parts!

I'm doing a similar mileage.

It's hard to say at this stage, I had a 2 month injury lay off, starting back running doing 80/20 6 weeks ago and haven't had too many chances to test myself. I did a sprint and the 5km was a pb in a sprint despite only having 4 weeks low intensity running under my belt, but then a few days ago I did a 5km TT and did abysmally! Probably went out too hard. One thing I have noticed is how easy it is to get the mileage in when you're doing it easy. I did a 20km run at lunch (my boss was away) went back to work and it felt like I'd gone for a light 3km jog. The next day I ran again totally forgetting I'd ran 20km the day before. I'm struggling to see how I can fast in a race off all this slow, easy stuff, but I'll persevere and see how I go.

I hear u re:speed on workouts. Long run
I was Doing 90mins at 5min pace per k and that would beat me up a bit and I would have to stop occasionally. Dropping back to 5:15 pace im much better for it but I'm not sure if that means all other runs should equal that pace or not. I only really have half irons left now so don't need a huge amount of speed work.
Well done on the 5k pb- I have a half in 8 weeks so that gives me hope!

Yeah I've got Busselton 70.3 in 8 weeks. Am aiming to ease back on the riding and increase my running to see how I go.

Ditto. Forgot u are west Aussie! I'm doing Karri valley next week too. I'm hoping a bit of increased kms before busso will serve us well!

cool, yeah can't make Karri valley, but doing the Shoalwater OD, Mullaloo OD and Hillarys sprint.

The best way to improve your half IM run time is to get faster in an open half marathon while NOT losing swim and bike speed. In theory this is easy in practice it's hard. Probably the easiest way is to lose 15 lbs and not lose bike power and maybe lose a bit of swim buoyancy, but the wetsuit will help neutralize that.

I thought about doing Hilary's again because I did the first one but I'm running out of mojo, it's a long season. 80bucks for a sprint hurts too. Would have done shoal water but a bit close to Karri valley.

5min/k 5:10-5:15k for long runs doesn't really matter. basically you should be able to speak in paragraphs when running aerobic runs.

Although talking and running in Busso means you're chances of eating a fly are very, very high.

If you can maintain riding while increase running you'd be really solid there. The bike course favors a high P/CdA ratio not necessarily a high power output. Don't get me wrong, you can never have enough power but less drag is good as well.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

Haha it's not too bad in winter when they have the half. Summer on the other hand for the full...

And yeh the bike course is as fast as it gets really. I did 2:27 on 184 watts last year. My bike is better this year but my run isn't as strong. Maybe a symptom of stronger biking I'm not sure. I tend to start the season strong and fade. I'll see if I can work it up to 45mile weeks from 30 in the 8 weeks prior to busso.

Doing much more riding, riding smarter in the race and pacing myself better during the run

Ad Muncher

When I built mileage, I backed off on the bike a bit and only rode 2x per week. Once I got to 50 mpw for a few weeks I started back on the full trainerroad HIM build plan (high volume).

My weeks look like this now.

Monday
--5am swim, 3-4000 yards
--lunch run ~5-8 miles SLOW (if I'm destroyed from the weekend I may skip this run or shorten it considerably)
Tuesday
--5am bike, VO2 trainerroad workout
--lunch run, 5-8 miles Z2
Wednesday
--5am swim, 3-4000 yards
--lunch run 10 miles, 3-5 of those at tempo
Thursday
--5am bike, trainerroad tempo
--lunch run 5-8 miles Z2
Friday
--5am bike, trainerroad endurance
--lunch swim, 2500 yards
Saturday
--TT tempo ride ~2 hrs
--Brick run 5-10 miles
Sunday
--Long run - 15 miles

The trainerroad plan moves the tempo/brick session from saturday to thursday every other week with a longer ride taking its place on Saturday. On those weeks I do an easy run on Friday's and skip the swim if I need to (my swim is fine, run is way more important)

1) Dropping weight
2) Biking a lot
3) Running a high frequency and consistent volume
4) Doing intervals and tempo runs sparingly because they impact #2 & #1
5) Being engaged and really focusing on overall body mechanics supplemented with hill sprints and strides.
6) Pacing the bike very evenly, within 1.03 even on moderately hilly courses. That means checking your ego at the door sometimes.

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I feel like this and the 5k/10k thread should be merged...

Question for all - a few have mentioned practicing proper run form. Is there a site or set of videos that illustrates proper form? Swim technique is discussed on ST ad nauseam, but run form not so much. Is it more difficult to advise on form because people have different gaits based on musculoskeletal makeup?

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2017 races: St. George 70.3 May 6 | Madison 70.3 June 11 | IM Zurich July 30 | Chicago Marathon October 8

I've had a look at a few youtube videos which have helped, but I guess the right thing to do is engage a run coach that can check your technique and advise accordingly.

Did a OD last week and got a pb for the run leg, only 43m (my weakest leg), but I was taking it easy because I'm still babying my calf. Quite surprising considering most of my running has been really easy since returning from injury. 1 day a week intervals, all the rest is mostly z1/z2. Hard to get my head around how running so slow can be effective, I'm not entirely convinced, but I'm running at least as well as I was last year when I was running hard most of the time. I have had a few tempo runs that have been disappointing and that does worry me a little, but I've gone OK in the OD and a recent sprint.