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Ideal Body Fat %

 

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asad137

Sep 29, 11 13:19

Post #26 of 54 (2508 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [oldandslow] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

oldandslow wrote:
Quote:

for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I think it depends on the body type. I'm a bit of a mesomorph, and I couldn't get within 3 kgs. of that (even when I was a high school X-country runner with <5% body fat). Nowadays, there's absolutely no way ;(. It's probably more accurate for fast-and-young triathletes....

The only way I could get to that would be to cut a leg off. The 2.2-2.3 lb per inch number I could probably get to with a lot of work, but I wouldn't want to.

Asad


apexendurance

Apr 12, 12 14:53

Post #27 of 54 (2341 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [kluecke] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Kevin what do you weigh thinking you can still lose 5-7 lbs?

You think at 5'9 you should weight under 140lbs?


hammonjj

Apr 12, 12 16:33

Post #28 of 54 (2231 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [prosh8905] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

prosh8905 wrote:
Joe Friel makes mention of
"Determine your ratio by dividing your weight in pounds by your height in inches. Competitive male triathletes are generally about 2.1 to 2.3 pounds per inch. High-performance women triathletes are usually in the range of 1.8 to 2.0. Men who exceed 2.5 pounds per inch and women above 2.3 are best advised to find flat race courses if the goal is to be competitive. Hilly courses favor lower-body-mass athletes. But high-mass athletes actually have an advantage on a flat bike course; all the more so if the wind is blowing. For example, the 200-pound athlete mentioned above comes in at 2.5 pounds per inch and races most competitively on flat to rolling courses."
He goes into a little more detail of this in his books which I don't have handy at the moment.

This is going to seem counter cultural to many of the forum, but a few of us are really below this number. I come from a road racing background and was a pretty good climber at 5'11 and 140lb (1.97). So, how would you guys suggest gaining a few pounds to aid us skinny guys on the bike and swim?


JustinNorCal

Apr 12, 12 16:50

Post #29 of 54 (2203 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

I was tested in January when I did some lactate testing. I was 5'9" tall 158 lbs and 4.9% body fat via skinfold. I have always been pretty lean since I came from an elite cycling background. I stay closer to my ideal weight year round than most hovering barely over 160 during the holidays. I was 157 this morning and will get to a low of 155ish mid summer. As long as I drink plenty, eat good foods and plenty of calories I tend not to have recovery problems.
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bltri

Apr 12, 12 17:43

Post #30 of 54 (2145 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [hammonjj] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Yeah, I just ran the exact same numbers. And did the other formula as well- am I actually 10 pounds under ideal weight? I'm at 140 now, and will be around 135 by June.


RPMacDonald

Apr 12, 12 20:03

Post #31 of 54 (2039 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

It's completely individual - each of our bodies function differently at different body compositions. Some people get to a certain point where they lose too much of their musculature while maintaining body fat which results in a decrease in performance, others (lucky ones) can lose lots of fat and maintain muscle mass... See how your body reacts to the weight loss, if you notice to start to lose power, then try increasing weight. Anyone who claims to be able to give you your ideal % if foolish.
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fordred

Apr 12, 12 22:56

Post #32 of 54 (1977 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [konaexpress] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

konaexpress wrote:
As far as ideal weight goes...... "The trick is to keep losing weight until your friends and family ask you if you've been sick. then you know you're within 10 pounds. if they start whispering to each other, wondering if you've got cancer or aids, you're within 5. When they actually do an intervention, you're at race weight.”

Haha.. I like that reply!


UrsusAdiposimus

Apr 13, 12 0:25

Post #33 of 54 (1955 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Quel] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).

LOL there is NO WAY that would work for me. I am 5'11", 185lbs, 14% body fat. So I have about 25lbs of fat on my body. That formula puts my ideal weight at 150lbs, which would mean I would have to somehow lose 35lbs of body fat even though I only have 25 - maybe if I amputate a few limbs :)

170lbs would put me in the single digits for body fat, which is what I am aiming for right now. I'm just a big dude - I look more like a football player than a triathlete. Weirdly, despite my size, running is my strongest event.


Juanmoretime

Apr 13, 12 1:42

Post #34 of 54 (1936 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Not sure the formula works. At 6' I'm currently 161 lbs and formula say I'm 9 lbs overweight. Friel's formula I'm within the range at 2.25. I've been as low as 146lbs and raced poorly and found my best times were at 5 to 10 lbs heavier.

FWIW at 6' and a 161 lbs I'm under 10% bodyfat.


Andrew69

Apr 13, 12 3:47

Post #35 of 54 (1886 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [SeasonsChange] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]

Ha ha ha...no chance in hell!
According to that, at 5'8" I should be weighing in at 135!!
My wife would literally divorce me if I was that skinny....hmm, I guess it may not be that bad! :-)


xtremrun

Apr 13, 12 4:26

Post #36 of 54 (1864 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [kluecke] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

kluecke wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


That is spot on my current weight, but at 5'9", I would say I am 5-7 pounds above ideal right now.

I'm also 5'9" and that is exactly where I like to be on race day. Around 63-64 kg.


jdrummo

Apr 13, 12 9:23

Post #37 of 54 (1726 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

When considering body fat %, it is sometimes better to take a practical approach rather than a "less is better approach". It's also different based on the event you're preparing for. I'm 41, weigh 160 lbs and have 9% body fat. I have a full time job, which causes lots of stress. I also have 4 school-age kids that are exposed to lots viruses/sicknesses. When I'm training for an event, I average about 20-25 hours of training a week. This includes lots of early mornings, lunch runs, and evening workout sessions (fatigue/sleep depravity). I've played around with my body weight to try to find the ideal weight. I've brought it as low as 5%, which was something that helped with my run pace and my bike climbing. It seemed to have a bit of a negative effect on my non-wetsuit swimming. The real downside was getting sick much more than normal. I was getting sick nearly every other month regardless of preventitive measures. Futhermore, it's hardly practical to maintain that body fat percentage while training for an event (ironman), working a full time job, and juggling day-to-day activities. It's not simply a matter of managing the quantity of food but the quality to maintain a low body-fat percentage...and quality food takes time to prepare.

When I let my body fat percentage stay at the 9%-12% range, the number of times I get sick diminishes significantly, the quality of my food doesn't create significant time constraints, and I have more time to train--and my training is consistent week-over-week because I'm suffering sickness setbacks.

There's obvious trade offs in each range of body fat percentage. There are constraints every athlete faces. Specific formulas for body fat, assume many constraints do not exist. Most of us don't have the free time that pros do. Most of the pros have greater recovery time (through sleep). Most pros do not have kids or full-time work responsibilities. That being said, it is up to you to experiment and find that sustainable, acceptable body fat percent range. And as you are able to make life adjustments (i.e. more free time/kids grow older), you can lower that percentage as deemed necessary.


nickwhite

Apr 13, 12 10:25

Post #38 of 54 (1658 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [jdrummo] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Quote:
When considering body fat %, it is sometimes better to take a practical approach rather than a "less is better approach".

Nah, less is always better. This is ST... Always.


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jeremyb

Apr 27, 12 16:51

Post #39 of 54 (1422 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Travis R] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Travis R wrote:
I would definitely recommend the book - it's a great read.

+1


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Allie

Apr 27, 12 17:09

Post #40 of 54 (1402 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [prosh8905] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

prosh8905 wrote:
Joe Friel makes mention of
"Determine your ratio by dividing your weight in pounds by your height in inches. Competitive male triathletes are generally about 2.1 to 2.3 pounds per inch. High-performance women triathletes are usually in the range of 1.8 to 2.0. Men who exceed 2.5 pounds per inch and women above 2.3 are best advised to find flat race courses if the goal is to be competitive. Hilly courses favor lower-body-mass athletes. But high-mass athletes actually have an advantage on a flat bike course; all the more so if the wind is blowing. For example, the 200-pound athlete mentioned above comes in at 2.5 pounds per inch and races most competitively on flat to rolling courses."
He goes into a little more detail of this in his books which I don't have handy at the moment.

crap. I am 1.9 but I am not a high-performance athlete. Does this mean I can eat Twinkies?


art

Apr 27, 12 17:15

Post #41 of 54 (1392 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

I've moved down from about 16% to about 11% and I've only gotten faster. Right now making a push to drop to 9% to get rid of that stubborn below-navel belly fat and see what happens.


VO2Matt

Apr 27, 12 17:47

Post #42 of 54 (1356 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Quel] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).

lines up well with my current (out of shape) weight as does the Freil method (I'm currently at 2.2)....about 5 pounds higher than my actual race weight, but I'm the scrawny runner type.


sometimes you just have to eat the cake


h2ofun

Apr 27, 12 18:07

Post #43 of 54 (1325 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [SeasonsChange] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]
wow, this would tell me I have to gain 16 lbs. Oh well, lets me eat anything I want.
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hankscorpio

Apr 27, 12 19:01

Post #44 of 54 (1272 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [h2ofun] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

You did the math wrong...or you are a cancer survivor.


Grant.Reuter

Apr 27, 12 19:06

Post #45 of 54 (1263 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [hankscorpio] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Holy crap waterboy and Chip are back....
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Bmanners

Apr 27, 12 19:08

Post #46 of 54 (1261 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Livetotri] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Eli,
I would send a pic of myself but that would be just like weird.
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Grant.Reuter

Apr 27, 12 19:13

Post #47 of 54 (1249 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [UrsusAdiposimus] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).


LOL there is NO WAY that would work for me. I am 5'11", 185lbs, 14% body fat. So I have about 25lbs of fat on my body. That formula puts my ideal weight at 150lbs, which would mean I would have to somehow lose 35lbs of body fat even though I only have 25 - maybe if I amputate a few limbs :)

170lbs would put me in the single digits for body fat, which is what I am aiming for right now. I'm just a big dude - I look more like a football player than a triathlete. Weirdly, despite my size, running is my strongest event.

It just means you have to lose muscle mass, you're opposite of the people who its saying they don't weigh enough. They need to put muscle on too have a good bike and swim you need to lose more to have a better run. In theory at least, but there is no way at 185 you're gonna be running with the guys that are 20-30 lbs under you its just too much time youre giving up.
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Insidious

Apr 28, 12 7:10

Post #48 of 54 (1112 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [UrsusAdiposimus] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).

LOL there is NO WAY that would work for me. I am 5'11", 185lbs, 14% body fat. So I have about 25lbs of fat on my body. That formula puts my ideal weight at 150lbs, which would mean I would have to somehow lose 35lbs of body fat even though I only have 25 - maybe if I amputate a few limbs :)

170lbs would put me in the single digits for body fat, which is what I am aiming for right now. I'm just a big dude - I look more like a football player than a triathlete. Weirdly, despite my size, running is my strongest event.



you (as do I at nearly the same size) have your answer. Lose muscle to get faster. Your FTP might go down and your top 100 scy might be a tick slower but probably not. Your run will rule enough to compensate and the only place you'll lose any real time is perhaps on the flats during the bike if you are currently going fast there. For some people the extra training required opens up a new level of fitness and the lost muscle doesn't matter.

Anyway, losing muscle is a lot slower process than losing fat. Hard on the body and it literally feels like you are starving verses just a reasonable fat -losing diet which just feels fine. Durning weight cutting periods (former lightweight rower) I started having trouble sleeping because I was so hungry and training so hard. Slow to recover and very easy to get sick during that time. A good friend and teammate had liver and kidney problems as a result of cutting too hard he suspects...still an issue 10 years later for him. Proceed with caution. Me I am going for the last easy 15 lbs of fat off to get back into the single digits bf then slow multi year plan to carve another 10-15 lbs off.


Allie

Apr 28, 12 7:16

Post #49 of 54 (1106 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Insidious] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Insidious wrote:
UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).


LOL there is NO WAY that would work for me. I am 5'11", 185lbs, 14% body fat. So I have about 25lbs of fat on my body. That formula puts my ideal weight at 150lbs, which would mean I would have to somehow lose 35lbs of body fat even though I only have 25 - maybe if I amputate a few limbs :)

170lbs would put me in the single digits for body fat, which is what I am aiming for right now. I'm just a big dude - I look more like a football player than a triathlete. Weirdly, despite my size, running is my strongest event.



you (as do I at nearly the same size) have your answer. Lose muscle to get faster. Your FTP might go down and your top 100 scy might be a tick slower but probably not. Your run will rule enough to compensate and the only place you'll lose any real time is perhaps on the flats during the bike if you are currently going fast there. For some people the extra training required opens up a new level of fitness and the lost muscle doesn't matter.

Anyway, losing muscle is a lot slower process than losing fat. Hard on the body and it literally feels like you are starving verses just a reasonable fat -losing diet which just feels fine. Durning weight cutting periods (former lightweight rower) I started having trouble sleeping because I was so hungry and training so hard. Slow to recover and very easy to get sick during that time. A good friend and teammate had liver and kidney problems as a result of cutting too hard he suspects...still an issue 10 years later for him. Proceed with caution. Me I am going for the last easy 15 lbs of fat off to get back into the single digits bf then slow multi year plan to carve another 10-15 lbs off.

Indeed proceed with caution. I understand what you are saying and I don't disagree with it but folks need to remember that heart is a muscle and your body doesn't pick and choose where it catabolizes. Over time, this type of weight loss could potentially lead to problems with cardiac function.


Insidious

Apr 28, 12 7:24

Post #50 of 54 (1100 views)
Re: Ideal Body Fat % [Allie] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Allie wrote:
Insidious wrote:
UrsusAdiposimus wrote:
Quel wrote:
SeasonsChange wrote:
for male triathletes this works pretty well:

0.90[50kg +2.3(inch over 5 feet)]


I'm about 2-3kg over that weight now, but it actually lines up almost exactly with what I think my ideal would be. Just haven't gotten there because of beer and french fries and such:).


LOL there is NO WAY that would work for me. I am 5'11", 185lbs, 14% body fat. So I have about 25lbs of fat on my body. That formula puts my ideal weight at 150lbs, which would mean I would have to somehow lose 35lbs of body fat even though I only have 25 - maybe if I amputate a few limbs :)

170lbs would put me in the single digits for body fat, which is what I am aiming for right now. I'm just a big dude - I look more like a football player than a triathlete. Weirdly, despite my size, running is my strongest event.



you (as do I at nearly the same size) have your answer. Lose muscle to get faster. Your FTP might go down and your top 100 scy might be a tick slower but probably not. Your run will rule enough to compensate and the only place you'll lose any real time is perhaps on the flats during the bike if you are currently going fast there. For some people the extra training required opens up a new level of fitness and the lost muscle doesn't matter.

Anyway, losing muscle is a lot slower process than losing fat. Hard on the body and it literally feels like you are starving verses just a reasonable fat -losing diet which just feels fine. Durning weight cutting periods (former lightweight rower) I started having trouble sleeping because I was so hungry and training so hard. Slow to recover and very easy to get sick during that time. A good friend and teammate had liver and kidney problems as a result of cutting too hard he suspects...still an issue 10 years later for him. Proceed with caution. Me I am going for the last easy 15 lbs of fat off to get back into the single digits bf then slow multi year plan to carve another 10-15 lbs off.

Indeed proceed with caution. I understand what you are saying and I don't disagree with it but folks need to remember that heart is a muscle and your body doesn't pick and choose where it catabolizes. Over time, this type of weight loss could potentially lead to problems with cardiac function.

Good addendum. That would most definitely make you slower :(

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