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The Texas 70.3 thread

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Herbert

Apr 1, 12 18:12

Post #376 of 404 (3608 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [hogstuff] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Maybe because he isn't a freak?

hogstuff

Apr 1, 12 18:15

Post #377 of 404 (3600 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [Herbert] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

touche

kyle_s

Apr 1, 12 18:15

Post #378 of 404 (3599 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [saltman] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

saltman wrote:

desert dude wrote:

In Reply To:

which is an excellent
result, EVEN for Lance...

I'm sure you meant to say:

"which is an excellent result, EXCEPT for Lance.

I mean the fanboys expect perfection and when he doesn't deliver they make excuses.

Still I wish I had a couple of HIM's under 4:00 to my name.

dude, in my time here I haven't seen very many posters actually say Lance was going to come in and dominate. A few trolls have sure. Kind of seems like you are creating a straw man in this thread. I haven't seen many "fanboys" that were as irrational as you seem to be indicating. I think he has competed at a higher level than even most fans of his expected. I guess I don't see what you are seeing, but maybe I don't spend as much time looking for Lance threads.

I dont know if I'd call them fanboys or not (probably wouldnt call them trolls either), but there are quite a few posts with themes along the lines of "he didnt bike well because he was testing a strategy" or "he doesnt want to show his hand until Kona." Im sure some people do think he has underperformed, at least relative to their expectations. That said, some probably think he has overperformed too
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http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18295
Gustav Larsson supporter

beebs

Apr 1, 12 18:19

Post #379 of 404 (3578 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [kyle_s] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I think Lance threw the competition during the run to give him a psychological edge for kona. He's so much stronger than everyone, he's really just toying with them. That way when he breaks away at Kona and sets a course record on the bike, no one will follow him...

Oh yeah, what is today?

kyle_s

Apr 1, 12 18:22

Post #380 of 404 (3564 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [beebs] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Haha it took me longer than it should have to get that
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http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=18295
Gustav Larsson supporter

devashish_paul

Apr 1, 12 18:29

Post #381 of 404 (3544 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [rhys] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Hi Rhys....no need to be negative (not exactly sure why you need to keep doing this, but maybe it's your style in responding to my posts. It's the internet and I guess you can choose communicate how you want).

In what I saw today (watched the entire bike and run), Kienle showed who the bike boss was TODAY. He had better position, better pacing and obviously nailed his nutrition better than Lance. You don't need to have the biggest engine to have the best bike performance. He started from behind and pretty well rode through the field other than Pouliot and Lance. Maybe he does not have the best engine, but he used it better than Lance and set up his run with a perfectly executed bike. Let's give Kienle some credit. Also, he's been doing this consistently in many races...New Orleans, Wiesbaden, Roth, Miami to name a few races.

Lance may have toyed with the field and if he backed it up with an awesome run like Kienle did today or what he did in Panama, then great. As the Endurance Nation guys say, there is never a fast bike split followed by a bad run. The only fast bike splits that are meaningful are those followed by solid runs. In today's race, Lance did not expend his energy well. Kienle did. As Monty said, this course also does not suit Lance's strengths well. Oceanside would be a much better course for him.

-----------------------------------------

Not responding to Rhys, but to the Texas thread in general (Monday morning quarterbacking....we're allowed right???)

Lance's pacing/cadence. His cadence is much higher than the other triathletes. They are generally running faster than him. He's not riding these races at FTP, and probably does not need to ride them at cadences similar to his 1 hour TT's. In a race like Panama there are coasting breaks for downhills, giving his hamstrings and hip flexors a break. But in Galveston, the pedals are turning constantly with no break. As Brett Sutton says, those hamstrings and hip flexors need to be saved for the run.

While I understand that "this is his riding style" that's fine if you are sitting in a peleton for 4 hours and then riding at 100% FTP for the final 40 -60 minutes. But triathlon is a different sport and there's probably a reason why the top triathletes have converged around certain practices that work for triathlon. At a race like IM France, with lots of coasting the high cadence won't hurt Lance, but in Hawaii with much less coasting it may. It's not like Lance needs to ride at Michael Ralaert cadences, but he perhaps he needs to save some of the run specific muscles for the run. I may be totally out to lunch, but his cadence is a massive outlier in the triathlon field of pros.

cannondale.com |infinitnutrition.ca | bushtukah.com
Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 6/7 2013, Epicman Tremblant 10k/260k/42.2k 11-13 July 2013

beebs

Apr 1, 12 18:32

Post #382 of 404 (3523 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

What was his run split out of curiosity?

AJHull

Apr 1, 12 18:34

Post #383 of 404 (3509 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Just a point I think many fail to recognize...perhaps the course did not totally favor the other racers either.

I am not a Lance fan. I remember history well. That said, I have to say I am impressed with his comeback and his true athletic ability. He also conducts himself well in interviews and has shown a lot of respect for the sport and the calibre of the pros he races against. The history disturbs me, but if I measure him by what I see in the media today surrounding his approach to triathlon, I am impressed. I know that this post does not apply to his bike ride in this race - just a point I felt like making.

_____

Adrian in Vancouver
_____

mojozenmaster

Apr 1, 12 18:39

Post #384 of 404 (3488 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

He might be regretting not breaking them in half when he had the chance on his first lead of the day. What was that soft pedaling all about and letting everyone catch up? The result might have been the same, or better, but at least he would have tested those fools.

**All of these words finding themselves together were greatly astonished and delighted for assuredly, they had never met before**

-BrandonMarshTX

Apr 1, 12 19:28

Post #385 of 404 (3354 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I am replying to Dev as I've only read about a dozen or so posts out of 16 pages! This post could turn out really long, but I will keep it short since I've been up since before 5am. Managed a 14th. I could have done a little better job early on in the bike to get on board, and I'll try to explain a bit of why.

The 'soft' pedaling I think was the result of the dynamics of the vehicular traffic as opposed to the race dynamics or front pack dynamics. I don't know how things really unfolded, but from my view of 'just' slightly too far back to catch on the pack was that...

The press folks/motos did a good job keeping the distance. We pro men do a good job of keeping the legal distance between us. The issue was that there was a larger moto with a camera in the vehicular traffic lane. This caused a back up of 10+ cars that provided more than a little draft to those sitting further back than 2nd or 3rd wheel in the very front group. The wind was a quartering headwind, so any car in the left lane would provide some draft, put 10 or so cars in line...and you see what I'm saying. Some of the vehicles were normal island traffic, and some appeared to be triathlon fans. It's hard to say. The simple fact is that 'if' Lance was in the front and was drilling it while those that were 3rd+ wheel back were getting a huge draft from cars to the left...I'll let you fill in the blanks. It would have been nearly impossible for Lance or anyone else to drop the group of cyclists with the dynamics of the race up until the point that the road was fully closed.

Once the road was fully closed to traffic, the very front pack broke up,actually the whole race broke up. I don't know how it unfolded on the way back...other than my race and those who were either catching me or those that I was catching. When Kienle passed me, he was moving, but it was late enough in the race that he would not have had to deal with the above dynamics once he caught the group in the front.

devashish_paul

Apr 1, 12 19:40

Post #386 of 404 (3303 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [-BrandonMarshTX] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

That makes a ton of sense as to why Lance would have soft pedaled and dropped back....and no fault of the guys who happened to be in the position where they got cross wind shelter from a line up of cars.

So that makes Kienle's bike day even that much more impressive? Congrats on you race. Well done!

cannondale.com |infinitnutrition.ca | bushtukah.com
Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 6/7 2013, Epicman Tremblant 10k/260k/42.2k 11-13 July 2013

kman74

Apr 1, 12 20:12

Post #387 of 404 (3221 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [Coasterx] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I did the course today and there was only 1 spot you rounded cones. Others were a giant curb/median that you couldn't and the other was a 6 foot fence. The cone turn was a rounded 10 fett wide arch so he cut more than a single cone. The only place I saw anyone with authority to dq him was at the fence section all others had kid volunteers.

Edit.haven't read all posts so sorry if repeating but..Michael raelert reported that it wasn't just a flat. He broke the disc as well so it didn't matter if he had a spare
Kirk Noyes
South Coast Endurance Coach
http://www.southcoastendurance.com

(This post was edited by kman74 on Apr 1, 12 20:16)

mojozenmaster

Apr 1, 12 20:14

Post #388 of 404 (3213 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [-BrandonMarshTX] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Tell your friend Lance that I am an 8th Degree Black-Belt in Ironman Armchair Quarter Backing. The number 8 is symbolic with Infinity = there is no higher ranking and no-one wiser than me in this art-form.

And my word is gold.

When Homie says Lance needs to put the hammer down, it is because this is what Lance needs to do.

A Wise Man (Spencer Smith) once said: �Your strength is your strength.� What the Wise Man meant is that you exploit your strengths over the pettiness of race tactics. You go with what you know 'intensity over extensity' and all of that......

It is a gamble, but that is how great races are won.

**All of these words finding themselves together were greatly astonished and delighted for assuredly, they had never met before**

Dom77mu

Apr 2, 12 0:01

Post #389 of 404 (2967 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Perhaps Lance should add St Croix 70.3 in 2 weeks time if he really wants a course that suits him & gain some more points for insurance to be in the top 40 before july. St Croix P-750 race unlike florida, honu P-500

I would! if i fix the G.I. issues before St Croix. Post race interview he wanted advice on gels/nutrition alternatives, because the ones his using now aint working. I sent him my 2cents on strava.

(This post was edited by Dom77mu on Apr 2, 12 1:05)

devashish_paul

Apr 2, 12 4:49

Post #390 of 404 (2756 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [Dom77mu] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

St. Croix is perfect for his strengths (hills on both bike and run)....on the run, he's not so much of a finesse runner whereas he has good power to weight. He should have a massive lead going into T2. Would love to see him race St. Croix.

cannondale.com |infinitnutrition.ca | bushtukah.com
Whiteface Hill Climb + Epicman Lake Placid 3k/180k/21k June 6/7 2013, Epicman Tremblant 10k/260k/42.2k 11-13 July 2013

Dom77mu

Apr 2, 12 4:54

Post #391 of 404 (2744 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Strava i told him about infinit nutrition, if that doesnt work nothing will paul ;-)

rhys

Apr 2, 12 6:08

Post #392 of 404 (2595 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [devashish_paul] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I think you've mentioned this negative thing toward you twice since I joined ST 5 or 6 years ago. Those are good odds given the frequency of posts...so lets move on there.

The suggestion by Endurance Nation to change an athletes riding style after 20 years at the pinnacle of the sport stumps me. My opinion on coaching is our job is to get the most out of the nugget we have in the athlete. In this example, we are talking about the world's greatest bike rider and EN wants to revamp his riding style after 20 years. I would argue, lets keep the strength the strength, and lets work on run turnover. So no, I don't buy the thesis there. But, that is my opinion.

As for Kienle, what a race by him! He was seriously moving on the run too. Great form and stride. The boy has talent no doubt.

TO showed what triathlon is; one sport SBR - fastest from point A to point B wins. Good show!!
http://www.rhysspencer.blogspot.com/

Panabax

Apr 2, 12 8:27

Post #393 of 404 (2347 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [GMAN19030] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

GMAN19030 wrote:

Dev, to answer your question about the heat...
It was much hotter and windier than forecasted. Heat index was about 90. very humid today.

The bike course was also 57 miles. Odd since it is the same bike course year after year. Tim O'Donnell made a joking comment about Lance being tough enough to beat on the bike that they didn't need to make it longer.

I thought my 910XT was defective when I hit 28 miles about 1/2 mile before the turn around. Glad to know it wasn't just me.

I under estimated the effect of the heat and humidity. I felt great on the bike and did not really notice how much I was sweating. I did not hydrate and replenish my electrolytes sufficiently on the bike and got to enjoy 13.1 miles of cramps (just keep running, just keep running). My first 70.3. I got off the bike at 3:30 and was sure I was going to break 5:30 for my first 1/2. What should have been a sub 2:00 13.1 quickly degenerated to a 2:21 as I focused on staying sub 6:00, which I did with a 5:54. Squarely in the MOP for my AG (45-19), but given that my first 5K was one year ago today, I am happy with the result. I learned a lot. It's a shame really. I just mastered peeing on the bike in my final long training ride the week before and, guess what, I didn't need to pee on the bike yesterday. Note to self, if you don't need to pee by mile 28, you need to take on more fluid.

Panabax

We�ve heard that a million monkeys at a million keyboards could produce the complete works of Shakespeare; now, thanks to the Internet, we know that is not true.�Robert Wilensky

pran

Apr 2, 12 14:43

Post #394 of 404 (2045 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [mck414] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Quote:

In all seriousness, how much longer does Lance have to be this competitive? He is 40, I'm 41 and see my abilities beginning to wane. I give him another year, maybe two. I think he has the interest and he certainly has the drive, but he isn't getting any younger.

Well that may be his plan and a good one making him enough time to have a good shot for the win the next year!

NAB777

Apr 2, 12 18:22

Post #395 of 404 (1909 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [pran] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Lance's performance on the weekend has a few similarities to the 2003 Tour de France TT, when 'dehydration' played a big part in his time losses to Ullrich. I wonder if the same thing happened this time?

http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/.../?id=results/stage12

Verbruggen said: �There is nothing. I repeat again: Lance Armstrong has never used doping. Never, never, never. "

pocolocoman

Apr 3, 12 3:30

Post #396 of 404 (1789 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [Panabax] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Panabax wrote:

GMAN19030 wrote:

...
The bike course was also 57 miles. Odd since it is the same bike course year after year. Tim O'Donnell made a joking comment about Lance being tough enough to beat on the bike that they didn't need to make it longer.

I thought my 910XT was defective when I hit 28 miles about 1/2 mile before the turn around. Glad to know it wasn't just me. ...

.

I also had the extra mile on the bike course. That seems like a pretty bad mistake for a course that should be that easy to measure. Just curious if there has been or will be any official acknowledgement or explanation?

The level of competition has certainly jumped up a notch, the 3 winners in the M50-54 were all under 4:40. So much for aging up and improving my place : )

GMAN19030

Apr 3, 12 5:46

Post #397 of 404 (1735 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [pocolocoman] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

pocolocoman wrote:

Panabax wrote:

GMAN19030 wrote:

I thought my 910XT was defective when I hit 28 miles about 1/2 mile before the turn around. Glad to know it wasn't just me. ...

.

The should know exactly where the correct turnaround is since they've done the race for however many number of years. I just looked at my Garmin files for 2011 and 2010 - both measured at 55.96. Sunday's race measured at 56.95. I looked at the maps side by side and Sunday's race clearly went about 1/2 mile further until the turnaround. I'm officially taking about 2.5 minutes off my time.

pjevoe

Apr 3, 12 7:26

Post #398 of 404 (1655 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [triathlonshots] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I was the co host with Greg for Texas 70.3 IM Live coverage. Thanks for the positive feedback on the coverage. I do apologize for the excessive use of the word "exactly" later in the run. I got a bit excited (and caffeinated) as the action picked up, caught myself after several times, then tried to cut it down. I must say, this was my first time trying anything like commentating, so I was well outside of my comfort zone. The night before, I'll admit that I was as nervous as I would have been if I was racing (and slept about as much). It was fun to be on the other side to see the process. Thanks for the positive encouragement. I wasn't on the technical side, so I can't speak for the feed itself. It was a neat experience to be a part of such an exciting race.

Thanks,
Pat

Patrick Evoe
Professional Triathlete
www.patrickevoe.com
Twitter: @patrickevoe

3Aims

Apr 3, 12 8:06

Post #399 of 404 (1599 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [pocolocoman] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

pocolocoman wrote:

Panabax wrote:

GMAN19030 wrote:

I thought my 910XT was defective when I hit 28 miles about 1/2 mile before the turn around. Glad to know it wasn't just me. ...

.

I had 56.92 miles on the bike. I clocked a 4:46 and was 16th in 40-44 AG. Crazy fast day out there.

timtak

Apr 3, 12 20:35

Post #400 of 404 (1447 views)

Re: The Texas 70.3 thread [pjevoe] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Dear professional Triathlete Evoe

The commentary was very good! I enjoyed being able to watch the race live and listen to your commentary
(as I googled things) well into the Japanese night.

If I may be allowed to make a request...

I wished that there had been a bit more in the way of facts and figures, especially as mentioned
here the times between leaders and chasers, mile speeds, average speeds, lead in previous events,
e.g. how far ahead X was of Y in a previous triathlon Z and still they were caught, or not caught by
x seconds...a bit like in baseball (where they show a lot of statistics) or indeed as someone mentioned
above in this thread in Tour De France coverage where they show the gaps in minutes and seconds
on the screen.

You did provide that sort of data, but while being unable to sleep before your next turn at the microphone
you might be so kind as to gem up on loads of useless (but exciting) facts and figures.

Thanks again for a great, free sporting experience.

My kids drink chocolate milk,

Tim

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